OraProMe Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 (edited) You cannot see the difference between "women having children is degrading" and "women being seen as a means of pop out as many babies as possible is degrading"? At any rate there is no argument for you to misunderstand, I'm just saying it was silly of HisChildForever to say that condoms objectify women because it's completely up to them if they want to have sex with a man who's wearing protection or not. Infact if anything her statement is degrading to women as it implies that a woman has no choice in a) When she has sex with her partner and b) that she has no say in whether he uses contraception. In many cases, and others said this, the woman is the one who insists on using protection. Edited October 11, 2009 by OraProMe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Resurrexi Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 (edited) [quote name='OraProMe' date='11 October 2009 - 08:19 AM' timestamp='1255267152' post='1983064'] At any rate there is no argument for you to misunderstand, I'm just saying it was silly of HisChildForever to say that condoms objectify women because it's completely up to them if they want to have sex with a man who's wearing [b]protection[/b] or not. [/quote] Condoms are [b]not[/b] protection. They are evil devices that leads souls to hell. Edited October 11, 2009 by Resurrexi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIKolbe Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 [quote name='OraProMe' date='11 October 2009 - 07:19 AM' timestamp='1255267152' post='1983064'] You cannot see the difference between "women having children is degrading" and "women being seen as a means of pop out as many babies as possible is degrading"? At any rate there is no argument for you to misunderstand, I'm just saying it was silly of HisChildForever to say that condoms objectify women because it's completely up to them if they want to have sex with a man who's wearing protection or not. Infact if anything her statement is degrading to women as it implies that a woman has no choice in a) When she has sex with her partner and b) that she has no say in whether he uses contraception. In many cases, and others said this, the woman is the one who insists on using protection. [/quote] You cannot see that "women being seen as a means of pop out as many babies as possible is degrading" is not an opinion held by many, especially on this board; and that you are simply using that non-sequitor to attempt to prop up a silly argument? And just because a women chooses, wills, or demands that a man wear a condom does not make it any less degrading for the woman. Many people choose to degrade themselves. Lest you think prostitution is a feminine-affirming lifestyle. That's what sin does. Sin dimishes the mental capacities (that's in the CCC somewheres) Or, sin makes you stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChildForever Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 [quote name='OraProMe' date='11 October 2009 - 09:19 AM' timestamp='1255267152' post='1983064'] At any rate there is no argument for you to misunderstand, I'm just saying it was silly of HisChildForever to say that condoms objectify women because it's completely up to them if they want to have sex with a man who's wearing protection or not. Infact if anything her statement is degrading to women as it implies that a woman has no choice in a) When she has sex with her partner and b) that she has no say in whether he uses contraception. In many cases, and others said this, the woman is the one who insists on using protection. [/quote] I have said absolutely nothing degrading. Why on earth would I degrade women?? I am a woman!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varg Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 [quote name='MIkolbe' date='11 October 2009 - 11:17 AM' timestamp='1255274225' post='1983088'] Sin dimishes the mental capacities (that's in the CCC somewheres) Or, sin makes you stupid. [/quote]Lol. For your information, Stephen Hawking does not believe in god. Therefore he sins. Is he stupid? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIKolbe Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 [quote name='Varg' date='11 October 2009 - 09:32 AM' timestamp='1255275149' post='1983096'] Lol. For your information, Stephen Hawking does not believe in god..... Is he stupid? [/quote] um, yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChildForever Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 [quote name='Varg' date='11 October 2009 - 11:32 AM' timestamp='1255275149' post='1983096'] Lol. For your information, Stephen Hawking does not believe in god. Therefore he sins. Is he stupid? [/quote] We all sin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sojourner Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 [quote name='OraProMe' date='11 October 2009 - 09:19 AM' timestamp='1255267152' post='1983064'] You cannot see the difference between "women having children is degrading" and "women being seen as a means of pop out as many babies as possible is degrading"? At any rate there is no argument for you to misunderstand, I'm just saying it was silly of HisChildForever to say that condoms objectify women because it's completely up to them if they want to have sex with a man who's wearing protection or not. Infact if anything her statement is degrading to women as it implies that a woman has no choice in a) When she has sex with her partner and b) that she has no say in whether he uses contraception. In many cases, and others said this, the woman is the one who insists on using protection. [/quote] So you think women are never coerced or influenced into a sexual encounter or relationship that is less than they would ideally want? Contraception, in any form, is degrading to women -- even if it's the woman pushing for using it. It's also degrading to men. Sex is an act, but it is an act that has inherent meaning. Sex means "We want to make total, faithful, fruitful, free gifts of ourselves to each other." Contraception distorts the meaning of the act, making a mockery of it and the people engaging in it -- even if they think they know what they are doing. We want sex to have "meaning" but we want to define that meaning for ourselves. It doesn't work that way. Just because we as a society have denied or forgotten what sex means, it doesn't follow that this meaning has disappeared. By making a less than complete gift of ourselves in the act of intercourse, we degrade ourselves, because we act in a way that is contrary to not only the meaning of the act but also the core of who we are as human persons made in the image of God. The awful thing is we can't fix ourselves, and so without intervention we're doomed to continue degrading ourselves over and over. The beautiful news is that God offers to fix us so we can reclaim the true meaning of the human person, including the act of sexuality. [quote name='MIkolbe' date='11 October 2009 - 11:17 AM' timestamp='1255274225' post='1983088'] You cannot see that "women being seen as a means of pop out as many babies as possible is degrading" is not an opinion held by many, especially on this board; and that you are simply using that non-sequitor to attempt to prop up a silly argument? And just because a women chooses, wills, or demands that a man wear a condom does not make it any less degrading for the woman. Many people choose to degrade themselves. Lest you think prostitution is a feminine-affirming lifestyle. That's what sin does. Sin dimishes the mental capacities (that's in the CCC somewheres) Or, sin makes you stupid. [/quote] [quote]Action failed: You have reached your quota of positive votes for the day [/quote] [quote name='Varg' date='11 October 2009 - 11:32 AM' timestamp='1255275149' post='1983096'] Lol. For your information, Stephen Hawking does not believe in god. Therefore he sins. Is he stupid? [/quote] A lack of intellectual accuity is just one of the many forms stupid can take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 [quote name='Varg' date='11 October 2009 - 10:32 AM' timestamp='1255275149' post='1983096'] Lol. For your information, Stephen Hawking does not believe in god. Therefore he sins. Is he stupid? [/quote] Idiot savant, we'll say. I've also heard he's an extremely unlikeable man... very arrogant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
little_miss_late Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 [quote name='OraProMe' date='10 October 2009 - 08:55 PM' timestamp='1255222555' post='1982679'] Honestly, I think that viewing women as a means to pop out as many children as possible is more degrading than making the choice to use contraception. [/quote] I agree. I would feel very degraded if I got a sense from my partner that the only important thing about our sex life was my ability to get pregnant as many times as physically possible. But I wonder why you assume that this is the attitude of people who choose not to use contraception. I would also feel degraded if I got a sense from my partner that the only important thing about our sex life was my ability to get him off. But I don't assume that this is the attitude that every condom-wearing man takes toward his partner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitty Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 Stephen Hawking is too awesome for religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Varg Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 [quote name='HisChildForever' date='11 October 2009 - 11:40 AM' timestamp='1255275647' post='1983099'] We all sin. [/quote]So w're all stupid. Right, thanks for clearing that up. What would we do without your ever-helpful insight? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChildForever Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 [quote name='Varg' date='11 October 2009 - 04:12 PM' timestamp='1255291935' post='1983211'] So w're all stupid. Right, thanks for clearing that up. What would we do without your ever-helpful insight? [/quote] In all honesty, there is no reason to be rude like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chestertonian Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 [quote name='Varg' date='09 October 2009 - 04:37 PM' timestamp='1255127824' post='1981956'] Nah, mainly we just complain about religion there. Maybe you'd like to sign up there and I could be the atheist on the catholic forum and you could be the catholic on the athist forum. Or something. [/quote] You complain about religion, and then come and hang out on phatmass all day long. That makes tons of sense! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChildForever Posted October 11, 2009 Share Posted October 11, 2009 [quote name='Chestertonian' date='11 October 2009 - 04:43 PM' timestamp='1255293821' post='1983224'] You complain about religion, and then come and hang out on phatmass all day long. That makes tons of sense! [/quote] Yeah, exactly. Why do you come here, Varg? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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