New Approaches To Apologetics?

[Laudate_Dominum]

When I read protestant attacks against the Faith I often have the feeling that what they are attacking is really a triumphalistic, ultra-Roman charicature of Catholicity. I think this is because much of counter-reformation Theology and Roman Catholic apologetics are largely reactive, because of the protestant revolt, and to some extent this ultra-Roman charicature has truth to it, there have been excesses.

So I have this idea of formally studying the Theological traditions of the Eastern Churches because I believe that a broader understanding of Catholicity, and an infusion of new Theological insights and directions would lead to a better Catholic apologetics. Often I read protestant attacks against the Catholic Faith and think to myself, "an Orthodox Christian would laugh off this argument", or "this really only applies if one assumes that post-Trent Roman Catholicism is the whole Catholic Church", etc.. I'm not sure if anyone will understand where I'm coming from with this. I'm not trying to attack Roman Catholicism at all, I'm wholly Roman. But since my conversion I have constantly been asking the question, "what does it mean to be Catholic", and I have found great insight into this question from the traditions of the East. And I think a broader vision and new approach would throw the professional anti-Catholics through a loop.

What do you peeps think of this?

[Hananiah]

Sounds good. I have a lot of fun insisting to people like Jason Engwer, Eric Svendsen, and David King that I'm not Roman Catholic. They keep calling me that, though.

[phatcatholic]

[quote name='Hananiah' date='Apr 5 2004, 06:28 AM'] Sounds good. I have a lot of fun insisting to people like Jason Engwer, Eric Svendsen, and David King that I'm not Roman Catholic. They keep calling me that, though. [/quote]
how does that affect your apologetics, to identify w/ the eastern churches? does it help your efforts, or does it hinder them b/c you have to stop whatever ur talking about to explain what it means to identify w/ the eastern churches? that would appear to be the only obstacle i can see. but, if it educates your opponent (harsh word?) on the "universality" of the Church, then maybe that timeout isn't all bad.

anyway, articulating your experiences here will help us determine if LaudDom is on to something. holla back...

pax christi,
phatcatholic

ps: i know there's other catholics who relate to the eastern churches as well. what has your experience been?

[homeschoolmom]

I must admit, up until about 18 months ago, I had never heard of any Eastern Rites. (and many of my former Catholic friends didn't even know they existed either). I probably still wouldn't know of them except for the fact that we know a Russian (Orthodox) who is converting to Catholicism and must do so through an Eastern Rite church. When most protestants hear "eastern" they almost without fail think of the Eastern Orthodox Church. I think it is a TREMENDOUS service to all to educate everyone as to the existance of the Eastern Rites... So, someone please go ahead and educate me... I know super little...

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' date='Apr 5 2004, 02:48 AM'] When I read protestant attacks against the Faith I often have the feeling that what they are attacking is really a triumphalistic, ultra-Roman charicature of Catholicity. I think this is because much of counter-reformation Theology and Roman Catholic apologetics are largely reactive, because of the protestant revolt, and to some extent this ultra-Roman charicature has truth to it, there have been excesses.

So I have this idea of formally studying the Theological traditions of the Eastern Churches because I believe that a broader understanding of Catholicity, and an infusion of new Theological insights and directions would lead to a better Catholic apologetics. Often I read protestant attacks against the Catholic Faith and think to myself, "an Orthodox Christian would laugh off this argument", or "this really only applies if one assumes that post-Trent Roman Catholicism is the whole Catholic Church", etc.. I'm not sure if anyone will understand where I'm coming from with this. I'm not trying to attack Roman Catholicism at all, I'm wholly Roman. But since my conversion I have constantly been asking the question, "what does it mean to be Catholic", and I have found great insight into this question from the traditions of the East. And I think a broader vision and new approach would throw the professional anti-Catholics through a loop.

What do you peeps think of this? [/quote]
Hey Laud I'll read any links you send, it sounds very interesting.

[Hananiah]

[quote name='phatcatholic' date='Apr 5 2004, 09:19 AM'] how does that affect your apologetics, to identify w/ the eastern churches? does it help your efforts, or does it hinder them b/c you have to stop whatever ur talking about to explain what it means to identify w/ the eastern churches? [/quote]
So far it's helped me in that whenever a Protestant laments that the universal Church is not confined to the "Catholic Church" I can say I agree with him and explain that the universal Church, while institutional, hierarchical, and visible, is composed of multiple rites. So yes, it helps me explain the universality of the Catholic Church.

[Theoketos]

LD,

There are some people already doing this...

...have you ever heard of Communion Liberation?

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='Theoketos' date='Apr 5 2004, 02:22 PM'] LD,

There are some people already doing this...

...have you ever heard of Communion Liberation? [/quote]
I haven't heard of that. What is it?
Sounds interesting..

[Theoketos]

[url="http://www.communion-liberation.org/"]Here is Website that will explain it better then I can...[/url]

...but as if you my friend do not spend enough time online.

When we meet it is like a great books program in where we discuss Mnsgr. Luigi Giussani books and other things. It is ment to turn cultural Catholics into Hard Core Jesus Lovers.

I have meet many Eastern Priests through this program. I have even heard apologetics from Father Stephen Muth with a Protestant that blew the protestant mind...

[Laudate_Dominum]

grazie mille

pace bene

[Theoketos]

ET TU

TU ES GRATIA PLENA AB S. STEPHAN

[BeenaBobba]

Hi Laudate,

I agree with you, too. The theological perspectives on a doctrine from both the Latin and Eastern Catholic Churches actually possesses the fullness of the revealed doctrine rather than if it was just presented one-sidedly. That being said, it works to the advantage of Latin Catholics to study Eastern Catholicism and their theological perspective. Being more informed on perspectives on doctrine, therefore, gives one new angles in talking to non-Catholic Christians. We can also present the Eastern view as well, which is also doing a service to the Eastern Catholic Churches, who aren't very well known. It is charitable for Latin Catholics to speak out for and spread the word about Eastern Catholicism. I honestly didn't even know they existed until two years ago! Now I'm considering becoming Eastern Catholic -- but I don't know if this will ever come to pass, as I'm very Latin in my thinking in that I approach theology very logically. Plus, I like having clearly defined answers, which would be an obstacle to fully espousing Eastern Catholicism, as they tend to be more mystical and less eager to define something more than is necessary.

The only drawback, perhaps, to giving the Eastern perspective is that many Protestants, being Western Christians, know very little about Eastern Christianity. Using arguments from Easter Catholicism [i]could[/i] confuse them -- or perhaps, on the other hand, the arguments possibly wouldn't have so strong an impact since they are so different from Western theological perspective in general and could be hard for them to grasp.

All in all, I'm definitely pro-studying Eastern Catholicism and incorporating its perspective in my apologetics.

God bless,

Jen

[HS_Dad]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' date='Apr 5 2004, 12:48 AM'] When I read protestant attacks against the Faith I often have the feeling that what they are attacking is really a triumphalistic, ultra-Roman charicature of Catholicity. I think this is because much of counter-reformation Theology and Roman Catholic apologetics are largely reactive, because of the protestant revolt, and to some extent this ultra-Roman charicature has truth to it, there have been excesses.

[/quote]
LD,

I think you are very right..... As a new convert, I've thought about starting a thread about what evangelicals would expect to see to get more seriously interested in Catholicism.... It does feel that Catholic apologetics are largely reactive and an attack on the Word of God.... Catholic apologetics need to have a deep knowledge of the Word and a communication of a true love for the Word to help win Protestant hearts. I had to "self educate" to convince myself... I did this through a thorough re-reading of much of the New Testament, reading many books about Catholicism, and reading Papal encyclicals.... I found typical apologetics to have some value but the real value came in coming to a heartfelt belief that the Church had rejected a triumphalistic power view of faith for a more servant oriented Christ-like view of its role... JP2 said sometime within the past 10 years that the Marian role is over the Petrine role... We need to say yes to Christ and become disciples... I could sense through his encyclicals that he believed this... That helped me tremendously. Ut Unum Sint's tone and the Lutheran Catholic statement on justification also played important roles.

God bless.