Question

[Apotheoun]

I agree with Sternhauser.

[elizabeth09]

Adam and Eve sinned, but we are saved thought Jesus who died for us on the Cross. If God did not create us as humans, then who will take care of His World? I mean that if God knows that one person is going to hell, then He knows that that one person always come back to us, as meaning good.

[mommas_boy]

[quote name='Sternhauser' date='01 October 2009 - 08:36 PM' timestamp='1254443816' post='1975962']
It is better to exist in hell than not to exist at all.

~Sternhauser
[/quote]

I had a teacher in high school who was formerly a seminarian. He asked us a question that neither he nor any of his students knew the answer to: if we need God in order to stay in existence, and Hell is the absence of God, then how would someone "in Hell" stay in existence? They can't simply "not exist", because the devil and his demons are in Hell, and the Church teaches that they and their influence are real, and so they must also still exist.

Something to think about, anyway.

[Aloysius]

stern's quote is, in fact, full of win.

non-existence is a greater evil than eternal suffering. sadly, modern philosophy would prefer non-existence to a suffering existence; however, they are absolutely wrong in this regard.

hell is a form of redemption and mercy by which God gives even the worst of the human race a continued eternal existence.

[ardillacid]

It would be better for him not to be born...

[Apotheoun]

[quote name='Aloysius' date='24 October 2009 - 12:32 AM' timestamp='1256365966' post='1990585']
. . .. hell is a form of redemption and mercy by which God gives even the worst of the human race a continued eternal existence.
[/quote]
I agree.

[OraProMe]

Non-existence is better than eternal torment. The whole idea of hell itself is bound up in the human desire for revenge. I'd hope an omnipotent and benevolent God could rise above that.

[Aloysius]

the whole idea of hell is justice, not revenge. the damned are tormented by the fire of God's love; the love is torturous because they reject it in the deepest recesses of their hearts.

Apo, I should hope you agree, it was you who made me think that way about hell in the first place one of the many gems of Christian thought I've developed based in part on your good influence on these boards.

as regards it being better for Judas had he never been born... so many say it could have been possible for even him to have repented since we know of no specific person being in hell. the phrase "better had he never been born" is semitic hyperbole; I don't take it as necessarily a philosophical statement that oblivion is better than hell. the statement is a hyperbolic way of saying it would be better for him not to have had the chance to betray the Son of God.

if it was a literal philosophical statement, then we would have here proof positive of an illogical and indeed malevolent God; for if Christ really believed it would have been better (a greater good) for Judas to have never existed, then as God He ought not to have created him because God creates whatever is the greatest good possible. Christ loves Judas, there can be no question of that; and therefore Christ wishes Judas to exist, even if Judas is in hell. it is love and mercy by which Christ sustains the existence of every living being in heaven, on earth, and indeed even in hell.

then there's the random other way I could've gone literalistically and said that Christ said it'd have been better had he never been born, not that he never existed, so he might've been saying that it'd have been better had he had a similar death to that of the Holy Innocents. haha, that's not actually a serious thought, it'd be a protestant-esque way to answer a problematic part of a text in scripture...

[elizabeth09]

There are some days I wish not to be born, but then I think about my brothers and sisters where I can make the one differences in their life. Then I know that if i was not born, then their life will be different.