Discerning A Vocation

[Indwelling Trinity]

[b][/b] I dont know if this topic has already been touched but I wondered what do those discerning a vocation look for in Communities or Orders?

Do you think there is a great difference between those discerning apostolic life versus contemplative life?

I guess I am Trying to understand the discernment process of those asking to join new communities. But I am also interested in those considering already established communities.

Sometimes understanding the differences and common ground make for greater communion between the various communities and spiritualities of religious life.

Edited August 22, 2009 by Indwelling Trinity

[VeniteAdoremus]

During discernment, I got to know and appreciate many different spiritualities, which was one of the most enjoyable parts of the process. I guess that the main thing I learned is that every community has a bit of every spirituality, but the uniqueness is in the parts they put the emphasis on. And the trick is finding the emphasis that agrees with your personal spirituality.

I don't know about a difference between discerning apostolic or contemplative life. What I do see is gaggles of discerners turning out to be called to the one while they always thought they wanted the other! So a discerner should be careful not to rule things out too quickly.

The first communities I visited were Benedictines and Carmelites, and in both cases I saw the beauty of the spirituality but didn't feel the "click" - I didn't see how this could feed me my entire life. With the Dominicans, however, all that was needed was [url="http://www.domcentral.org/trad/domspirit/default.htm"]one book[/url] (a book, yeah, figures, for an OP) and I was completely sold. I kept nodding and muttering "Yes! That's how it works!"

Of course, I tried to run off in between, but it does seem like they finally got me

[Gemma]

[quote name='Indwelling Trinity' date='22 August 2009 - 02:25 PM' timestamp='1250961937' post='1954280']
[b][/b] I dont know if this topic has already been touched but I wondered what do those discerning a vocation look for in Communities or Orders?

Do you think there is a great difference between those discerning apostolic life versus contemplative life?

I guess I am Trying to understand the discernment process of those asking to join new communities. But I am also interested in those considering already established communities.

Sometimes understanding the differences and common ground make for greater communion between the various communities and spiritualities of religious life.
[/quote]

Special graces accompany those called to a new foundation. As I said in another post, they usually think they are the only ones with the idea, until they run into people like me, and the networking starts. They are usually more independent than those who are called to established communities.

Those who are not called to a new foundation are usually severely skeptical, or they just simply wish you well. The latter is in conformity with canon law. The former need to learn to say, "That's not for me."

The information you put out there for discerners is important--mainly being in communion with Rome, habit, community life, chapel pix, horarium, and formation program. The formation of the first group is the biggie for a new foundation. Also, it's required that your charism be unique. How unique is it?

The greatest thing you can tell discerners is that the Holy Ghost works on attraction. This is the single biggest burden lifter for discerners, and I wish I had known it 20 years ago.

Since I know your own story, dear In.Trin., your own transition from active to contemplative life should be a lesson in and of itself. I am working with a discerner who just could not understand the contemplative life. She was in the middle of sports, and I told her to minister to what she knew. I asked her how she related to St. Rosalie Rendu, DC, who said, "I pray best in the middle of the street." She began to understand, as she could relate to St. Rosalie. Now we're working on how she can incorporate a prayer life into what she's presently doing.

HTH.

Blessings,
Gemma

[Indwelling Trinity]

Dear Venite Adoremus and Gemma:

Thank you both for your responses. I think I agree with both of you. In joining Carmel at an earlier age I did not really finds that "click" while at the monasteries I was in but the Charism of Teresa did "Click" !

In Teresian Carmels you never really know what you get until you are in; as each monastery is so small and the combination of personalites along with the way they interpret Our Holy Mother is unique to every Carmel. I have found that what may be seen as instability in visiting many monasteries may only be a searching for that right fit. In Carmel I still longed for a more intense eremitical aspect of the life even though I believed in the need for some healthy community life. In fact sometimes I would try to throw myself fully into community only to find myself at times having to withdraw because of the deep longing inside.

Now I am finding many longing for the same balance of the increased emphasis on eremitical solitude while still retaining some healthy communal aspects but not as intense as in Traditional Teresian Carmels. In reading both constitutions of the OCD's I find little emphasis on the Elijan aspects of the life; and I think that is where I got caught in the attempt of founding a new community along with other former Carmelites looking for the same thing.

To me it is the combination of the O.Carm expression of Elijan eremiticism together with Our Holy Mothers reform that makes Carmel a whole for we are both hermits and apostolic comtemplatives within the confines of our own monastery. I think this is the starting point for this little community. For me and the others with me this "clicks." Therefore our longing for the hermitage and increased time within it.

I see the first fruits of our little community expanding. The silence between us is almost complete except for the one hour of recreation on non complete hermit days. It is a gentle respectful, profound silence. We enjoy our recreation but are so very happy to go back to the silence of the cell to be alone with God. Each sister is a strong soul despite our individual weaknesses. Yes this love of the cell is also a very strong part of Teresian Charism in fact all Carmelite charisms. But ours seems to be forming so far in what I call an Elijan wildness. It is very hard to put into words. What there is though is a profound sense of prayer and recollection with a gentle acceptance of the uniquness of each others personal spirituality, and so we allow space for the other to grow as God wills.

And yes, Venite there is a little of every spirituality in each community the emphasis is the difference. When I see books and a Library to learn from I go ga ga... Laughing, but yet when i get to my cell and open the books after about a page or two I have to stop and pray... so I no longer read as assiduously as I used too.

As For Gemma's remark, yes Gemma i have met others with similar ideas but so far i do not see them coming together. It is like they are just waiting for it to form by itself.

I believe one does not just go out and found a community. God uses those who are nothing to found them so that His grace and glory may shine forth. This has been my experience so far. God knows how very weak I am and yet still uses me even to my own confusion as to why me...why us? I have no answer but in my weakness just try to give Him my best and let him provide what is lacking. I tell those who ask about coming, don't expect to see a saint or a great leader but only a little and imperfect soul. I wish not to mislead anyone coming.

If they come it is for Jesus alone and not for some charismatic figure. I do this so they will not be disappointed or scandalized by my own weaknesses rather it is the community that is strong as we all make up for each others weaknesses. It is because of the others with me that I do not remain bereft in my own weakness and each one of the initial group is a foundress of this community for we each bring our own special gifts and inspirations.

Oh I have wandered so! The only reason I Think I am the one moving things on the exterior level is that my personality is more outgoing in dealing with the many people I must meet in order to put things in place for us to grow. Yet at times this can be a little lonely in making so many decisions. I always ask Our lady and Jesus to walk beside me and show me/us the way.

God is our shield and protector. May he allow us to put on he armor of Holiness and continue our journey to the holy Mountain of Carmel!

Tenderly,

Indwelling Trinity

[Indwelling Trinity]

Dear Gemma: Thank you for the support of your post!

Yes the formation of the first group is the biggie! I have paid special attention in providing that necessary Carmelite formation by networking as you say with other O. Carm's and O.C.D.'s. They all are being very helpful to us.

I think the Charism is a new expression of an ancient order yet still traditional in its makeup. In addition to being open to young physically strong vocations there is a great respect for more mature and for those with less than perfect health vocations. The Carmelite life is mainly interior so even those who are over the normal age limits/ or with some health limitations can offer a sweet sacrifice of Praise to God.

There is a big difference in having hermitages to live in for short periods of time as in Port Tobacco, which is a wonderful community, as opposed to living most of your day in the hermitage where you live, pray, eat two of the daily meals, sleep and work. In some ways similar to the Carthusians or Camaldolese of Monte Corona but with a Carmelite spirituality as its basis rather than Benedictine Influence. So these things I think are a part of the uniqueness of our endeavour.

If it succeeds Praised be God! If it does not, praised be God as well!

God Bless You!

Indwelling Trinity

Edited August 23, 2009 by Indwelling Trinity

[TeresaBenedicta]

Dear Indwelling Trinity,

You have me very intrigued. I would love to hear your story one day, of course, only if you were comfortable sharing it.

[Indwelling Trinity]

Dear Venite Adoremus:

Thank you for the link on the dominican spirituality it is so beautiful! I can see why you are attracted to it! I once read that Saint Dominic took some of his spirit from the Carthusians and that he had a great devotion to them. Is that accurate?

Tenderly,

Indwelling Trinity

[Indwelling Trinity]

Dear Teresa Benedicta:

Laughing... ummm i must think long and hard about that one! I only share it when absolutely necessary. I can tell you that the road for me had many twists and turns which I could only decipher at a later time in life. I had to lose almost everything to find my way. God had to literally break me only to gather me up in His arms and heal that which was broken. This journey I later found is typical of many Carmelites.

Despite the darkness and pain, the journey is oh so beautiful! Anyone who has made it will concede this fact. But, the price is not turning back for any reason but just continue to walk in blind faith.

Tenderly,

Indwelling Trinity

Edited August 23, 2009 by Indwelling Trinity

[HisChild]

Oh, my. Where do I begin? LOL

Like Indwelling Trinity, I have been in more than one community. I've always been attracted to more contemplative communities. To me, it's always been about the prayer life.

When I first started discerning, we had very few religious who wore the habit near us, so I knew very little about religious life (not to be uncharitable, but I think of the phrase 'out of sight out of mind'; there might have been religious in our parish, but I was never aware of them). I only knew I was to give my life to our Lord. It wasn't sure what that would entail. At a nearby parish there were a couple sisters who wore a modified habit (one wore white shirt and black skirt and sometimes a veil, the other wore the shorter Dominican habit and veil), so I went to them first for guidance. One was a Spiritual Director and so began my journey. I was given the Guide to Religious Ministries (this was before there was a huge religious presence online) and knowing very little about different orders, I just started reading the blurbs and wrote to whatever community caught my attention.

Once the brochures and letters started coming in I realized there that while there were a lot of similarities, there were also a lot of differences. As I started to understand a little more about religious life, I would just pray as I read each brochure and see what feelings or intuition came over me. It seemed that I was more attracted to those communities that were either Dominican or Carmelite. I later learned it was the Charisms of the Orders that began to separate in my mind.

Soon, I started to visit communities. It was quite amazing to me to discover the differences even within a particular order. There were some that, although lovely, I knew right away were not for me. There were others that I just couldn't get a feel one way or the other, and then there were some that seemed to be a fit.

In hindsight, what I looked for back then, aside from the prayer life, has no bearing on what I'd look for now. My faith was still quite immature and I looked at externals to help me decide. And in all honesty, while I wanted a very contemplative life, I also wanted to be a visible witness. Did I want that for God's glory... or my own? I don't know. There's a part of me that wants to admit both.

Now, as I begin to discern again, my priorities are a little different. I seek more silence and solitude,a fervent horarium, with room for personal prayer within the chapel and in my cell/hermitage, to live a life more hidden in Christ... but not so much solitude as a hermit that I am separated from a community.

Knowing now what I know about religious life and its various expressions, it seemed that I was called to a more eremitic life. But until recently it seemed that those sketes and lauras out there were of the various Benedictine traditions. While I have deep respect for Benedictine life, what I know of their charism just doesn't resonate with me as profoundly as Carmel. That which attracts me within Carmel is not only the OCD spirit, but also that of the O.Carm. What many don't seem to realize or consciously consider is that our Holy Mother St. Teresa did not reform the Order because she didn't like the Rule of St. Albert (a rule with tremendous eremitic leanings), but that she felt the O.Carm. communities where she lived were incredibly lax. Nuns had visiting rooms and parlors within the cloister, they gossiped, rarely kept silence. It was more of a social club than religious life. I want to find a community that allows for both cenobitic and eremitic sides of the Carmelite Order. And until recently I didn't see it existing, at least not in this country, thinking that my attractions were a sign to found a community myself, or at the very least forgo my own desires to live as a hermit in community and live alone as a Carmelite hermit.

Some may not be attracted to communities that are newly forming. But as has been abundantly shown in the other thread I started about those who've been in more than one community, often times these Saints and holy people went on to found other orders because that which was available to them was not the life they were being led to live. My biggest pet peeve with naysayers today who frown on founders of new communities is that they somehow believe that God couldn't possibly be calling someone to found a community NOW (Can anyone say John Cardinal O'Connor?). Similarly some will say that about Marian apparitions or Eucharistic miracles, etc. Who's so arrogant to know the mind of God and the workings of the Holy Spirit? Saying that, however, I ABSOLUTELY believe that one should test a miracle or a new community thoroughly before passing judgment. By their fruits you will know them.

But it IS possible... take a look at religious life in the world today. Many communities no longer receive vocations, causing them to consolidate with other communities, and other orders. Yes, there are other established communities out there who are receiving vocations. And I hear those arguments to join one of those... but think of this: If there were no brave souls out there to found new communities within the last couple of decades, there would have been no Sisters of Life (which was one of the communities I was a postulant in, in the early 90s), no Sisters of Mary, Mother of the Eucharist, no Francsicans of the Renewal...I could go on.

New communities, to me, signify growth in the Holy Spirit. There are women and men out there who would not do well in a new community. That's completely understandable. Our Lord is leading them to a community or order that is more established, based on their talents and gifts. It's where He will cull them to holiness. But He also draws others to leave communities, for whatever reason not finding a home there, because He has other plans for them, to build up His kingdom in a new way. God bless and reward them for their courage.

Yours in Christ,

HisChild

[InHisLove726]

[quote name='VeniteAdoremus' date='22 August 2009 - 04:33 PM' timestamp='1250973233' post='1954394']
I don't know about a difference between discerning apostolic or contemplative life. What I do see is gaggles of discerners turning out to be called to the one while they always thought they wanted the other! So a discerner should be careful not to rule things out too quickly.

[/quote]

Gah! That's me in a nutshell!

[Macies]

Dear One,

There is much to consider. I would make sure you have a solid spiritual director, a trusted companion, a good prayer life, and did I say a solid spiritual director?

This is the most important thing of all since the process of discernment can be overwhelming, difficult and quite confusing!!!!

Prayers and support!

Macies