Writing Carmelite Communities

[InHisLove726]

Here's Rochester, NY's schedule (1990 Constitutions):

[quote]4:00 Rise
4:30 Matins
5:00 Lectio
5:45 Mental Prayer
6:45 Lauds
7:30 Holy Mass
Thanksgiving
Terce
8:30 Breakfast
Manual Labor
11:00 Sext/Examen
11:20 Dinner
12:00 Recreation
12:55 Free Time
1:40 Rosary
2:00 None
2:25 Spiritual Reading
3:00 Manual Labor
4:30 Vespers
5:00 Mental Prayer
6:00 Supper
6:40 Recreation
7:40 Compline
8:00 Free Time
9:30 Retire[/quote]

I found it unusual that they say Matins later in the morning. They have a very balanced schedule, IMHO.

This is one of the Carmels that I wrote to, as well.

[HisChild]

In the above (Sioux City) horarium, the Office of Readings is Matins. It's at 730pm. Every community I've written to, visited or read about prays the OoR (Matins), some in private and some in public. I'm sure there are some out there who don't but it's there... just not at midnight.

Edited August 15, 2009 by HisChild

[InHisLove726]

[quote name='HisChild' post='1949907' date='Aug 15 2009, 05:59 PM']In the above (Sioux City) horarium, the Office of Readings is Matins. It's at 730pm. Every community I've written to, visited or read about prays the OoR (Matins), some in private and some in public. I'm sure there are some out there who don't but it's there... just not at midnight.[/quote]


Ok, thank you for the clarification! See, ya learn something new everyday.

[InHisLove726]

Looks like I have some writing to do! I heard back from a third monastery, the Carmel of the Holy Name of Jesus in Denmark, WI. Mother Mary Elizabeth of the Blessed Trinity sent me a booklet of the information that they based their website on, which actually has more pictures. It's difficult to believe that they are followers of the 1991 Constitutions, because they look so traditional. I don't think I've ever seen such a beautiful or captivating synopsis of the life of Carmelite Nuns before. I'm looking forward to continuing to learn more about their order.

In the little card that she sent me, Mother also included a 2nd or 3rd class relic of St. Therese (I believe it's a 3rd class; a little piece of white cloth with a tiny picture). I will cherish this forever.

Edited August 16, 2009 by InHisLove726

[HisChild]

InHisLove,

Have you read [url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?showtopic=58540"]this post[/url] by Margaret Clare? She has a very thorough description of the differences between the 1990 and 1991 Constitutions.

I have visited and have had written correspondence with several Carmels who follow the 1991 Constitutions (as well, of course, with those who follow the 1990). One Mother Superior says it best. She said that while the 1990 Constitutions Carmels follow a more ancient observance, some can get so wrapped up in the letter of the law, they fail to obey the spirit of the law (she did not name names; nor will I). The 1991 Constitutions allow a little more leeway and a more conscious decision to do so. She said that many of those who follow the 1991 still abide by the older customs, of which hers was one. She said her particular Carmel (which by the way wears the full habit, and visiting is done behind a thick grille, complete with the requisite Turn) chose the 1991 Constitutions not because they wanted to throw the baby out with the bath water, a practice some religious communities in general have done since Vatican II, but because they wanted to be ever mindful of the decisions they made in regards to the rulings and rubrics of their Carmel.

I don't mean to get on my soapbox, but your comment that you 'find it difficult to believe they are followers of the 1991 Constitutions' required that I speak up, so to speak, and aver that just because they do so does not make them any less authentic to the teachings of Holy Mother Teresa.

God bless you,
HisChild

[InHisLove726]

[quote name='HisChild' post='1950282' date='Aug 16 2009, 01:08 AM']InHisLove,

Have you read [url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?showtopic=58540"]this post[/url] by Margaret Clare? She has a very thorough description of the differences between the 1990 and 1991 Constitutions.

I have visited and have had written correspondence with several Carmels who follow the 1991 Constitutions (as well, of course, with those who follow the 1990). One Mother Superior says it best. She said that while the 1990 Constitutions Carmels follow a more ancient observance, some can get so wrapped up in the letter of the law, they fail to obey the spirit of the law (she did not name names; nor will I). The 1991 Constitutions allow a little more leeway and a more conscious decision to do so. She said that many of those who follow the 1991 still abide by the older customs, of which hers was one. She said her particular Carmel (which by the way wears the full habit, and visiting is done behind a thick grille, complete with the requisite Turn) chose the 1991 Constitutions not because they wanted to throw the baby out with the bath water, a practice some religious communities in general have done since Vatican II, but because they wanted to be ever mindful of the decisions they made in regards to the rulings and rubrics of their Carmel.

I don't mean to get on my soapbox, but your comment that you 'find it difficult to believe they are followers of the 1991 Constitutions' required that I speak up, so to speak, and aver that just because they do so does not make them any less authentic to the teachings of Holy Mother Teresa.

God bless you,
HisChild[/quote]


I, of course, meant no disrespect. It's just that they are a little more traditional than some of the 1991 Constitution Carmels I've had contact with. There was one, I won't say the name, who had grown quite lax in their observance of the Constitutions. When I looked at their daily schedule, Saturday was more of a free day, and Sunday was, too. It may have to do with the fact that most of their nuns were in their 50s and 60s or above and could not follow a strict adherence. It's also my preference to have a more structured schedule, so I knew that I was not called there.

Of course, I did not mean that all 1991 Carmels are that way. I'm sorry if it appears I put them all in that reference. Most of the 1991 Carmels that I know of are VERY adherent. Thank you, HisChild, for pointing out my mistake. God bless you.

P.S.--I've read MC's thread several times. I even have it bookmarked for referencing.

Edited August 16, 2009 by InHisLove726

[InHisLove726]

On Saturday, I received a package in the mail from the Buffalo Carmelites and I opened it up immediately. I was very happy to see the book, "Love Can Do ALL" and a little note from Mother Miriam giving me permission to visit them when I am able. I read the entire book in one sitting Sunday morning and I cannot express how much peace entered my soul. I read about how St. Therese protected Mother Elias and I could not believe how St. Therese told Mother Elias when she was a little girl that she would be a Carmelite. Wow, wow, WOW!

I just finished writing a second letter to back to Mother Miriam last night. The peace I felt superseded all the other responses I received. Lord, I pray I can be patient so I don't rush into the idea that you are calling me here without checking it out and praying about all my decisions. But if you are calling me here, please give me the grace to accept it full of praise and thanksgiving.

[Jennifer G.]

(I already miss the old forum layout - easier to read... oh well)

[quote name='InHisLove726' date='15 August 2009 - 06:54 PM' timestamp='1250373271' post='1949898']
Here's Rochester, NY's schedule (1990 Constitutions):

<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->4:00 Rise
4:30 Matins
5:00 Lectio
5:45 Mental Prayer
6:45 Lauds
7:30 Holy Mass
Thanksgiving
Terce
8:30 Breakfast
Manual Labor
11:00 Sext/Examen
11:20 Dinner
12:00 Recreation
12:55 Free Time
1:40 Rosary
2:00 None
2:25 Spiritual Reading
3:00 Manual Labor
4:30 Vespers
5:00 Mental Prayer
6:00 Supper
6:40 Recreation
7:40 Compline
8:00 Free Time
9:30 Retire<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

I found it unusual that they say Matins later in the morning. They have a very balanced schedule, IMHO. <img src="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="" border="0" alt="smile.gif" />

This is one of the Carmels that I wrote to, as well.
[/quote]

Anyway, I've noticed that the 1991s seem to have breakfeast before Mass, not after like the 1990s. I think Terre Huate has their Mass in the afternoon. Some call Matins the "Office of Readings", I think.

Edited August 24, 2009 by Jennifer G.

[InHisLove726]

[quote name='InHisLove726' date='24 August 2009 - 04:53 AM' timestamp='1251104025' post='1955470']
On Saturday, I received a package in the mail from the Buffalo Carmelites and I opened it up immediately. I was very happy to see the book, "Love Can Do ALL" and a little note from Mother Miriam giving me permission to visit them when I am able. I read the entire book in one sitting Sunday morning and I cannot express how much peace entered my soul. I read about how St. Therese protected Mother Elias and I could not believe how St. Therese told Mother Elias when she was a little girl that she would be a Carmelite. Wow, wow, WOW!

I just finished writing a second letter to back to Mother Miriam last night. The peace I felt superseded all the other responses I received. Lord, I pray I can be patient so I don't rush into the idea that you are calling me here without checking it out and praying about all my decisions. But if you are calling me here, please give me the grace to accept it full of praise and thanksgiving.
[/quote]

Can you all please pray that I am able to be considered by this lovely community if it be God's will? I still have the elephant on my back about my history of depression that I am worried about. I haven't notified Mother, and I don't intend to talk about it until I am able to go there, in person, so she can ask me questions and relay any concerns in person. I know if God wills that I be anywhere, He'll make it so even if it seems difficult.

[HisChild]

You're in my prayers!

God's will be done.

[InHisLove726]

[quote name='HisChild' date='24 August 2009 - 10:51 AM' timestamp='1251125491' post='1955549']
You're in my prayers!

God's will be done.
[/quote]

Thank you! God be praised.