BLAZEr Posted March 30, 2004 Share Posted March 30, 2004 [quote name='immaculata' date='Mar 29 2004, 11:18 PM'] I really don't like holding hands during the Our Father, but I get sucked into it by all the sweet little old ladies in the choir.. When I'm not in the choir, though, I prefer to keep my hands folded. The orans or semi-orans position is just as distracting to me. [/quote] AMEN! But honestly, I don't get sucked in anymore, I just bow my head and close my eyes right before the Our Father and I fold my hands. People just assume I'm intently praying and they don't bother me to hold their hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BullnaChinaShop Posted March 30, 2004 Share Posted March 30, 2004 [quote name='BLAZEr' date='Mar 30 2004, 04:34 AM'] AMEN! But honestly, I don't get sucked in anymore, I just bow my head and close my eyes right before the Our Father and I fold my hands. People just assume I'm intently praying and they don't bother me to hold their hands. [/quote] That is what I do as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mamalove Posted March 30, 2004 Author Share Posted March 30, 2004 (edited) Another thing that bugs me about it is that when a stranger offers their hand to me and I politely refuse, some of them get all mad about it! What's up with that?! Being angry while praying the Our Father just isn't very Christian. Then there's those that unsuspectingly grab your hand and your stuck. I hate that. But the thing that really gets me is that I've seen Catholics (or been distracted by them) who don't participate in most of the Mass with things like not saying the responses, sitting down instead of kneeling and generally just standing around with their thumbs up their you know what; but when it comes time for the Our Father, they make a big show of holding hands and lifting them high. That really chaps my hide. Don't get me wrong, I'm not being judgemental about anyone else's personal faith. But on the outside, I think it looks disrespectful. Just an opinion. Edited March 30, 2004 by mamalove Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littleflower+JMJ Posted March 30, 2004 Share Posted March 30, 2004 my dad and i were [i]just[/i] talking about this after this past sunday mass. i dont like it for reasons that many have already said. it just soo cheesy to hold hands when we have the Eucharist before us cuz the eucharist is [u]the[/u] deepest union and community we will always have!! the holding hands really creeps me out now cuz i feel the false/empty feeling that we're trying to get when ever we do it.... :ph34r: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.SIGGA Posted March 30, 2004 Share Posted March 30, 2004 (edited) is it that serious? none of this stuff goes through my head at mass. I'm more likely not too because I have OCD that other people are dirty Edited March 30, 2004 by M.SIGGA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littleflower+JMJ Posted March 30, 2004 Share Posted March 30, 2004 [quote name='M.SIGGA' date='Mar 30 2004, 12:23 PM'] is it that serious? none of this stuff goes through my head at mass. I'm more likely not too because I have OCD that other people are dirty [/quote] i would think it would be serious... its at the most criticial time in mass, right after consecration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilroy the Ninja Posted March 30, 2004 Share Posted March 30, 2004 Strangely enough Don John and I have had rows about this very topic because I for one, am against the hand holding as I find it distracting since people are more worried about whether or not the person next to them or in front of them are participating instead of praying the Lord's prayer with all their being. Don John grew up with it. I didn't. And I don't like the orans position either. I take Father Barker's advice and reverently fold my hands. According to Fr. Barker's website that is what he does when he is not actually presiding over the mass... good enough for him, good enough for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homeschoolmom Posted March 30, 2004 Share Posted March 30, 2004 [quote name='mamalove' date='Mar 30 2004, 11:50 AM'] But the thing that really gets me is that I've seen Catholics (or been distracted by them) who don't participate in most of the Mass with things like not saying the responses, sitting down instead of kneeling and generally just standing around with their thumbs up their you know what; but when it comes time for the Our Father, they make a big show of holding hands and lifting them high. That really chaps my hide. Don't get me wrong, I'm not being judgemental about anyone else's personal faith. But on the outside, I think it looks disrespectful. Just an opinion. [/quote] Does it occur to you that they may be non-Catholics or very new Catholics and don't know all of the responses, but do know the Our Father (from a previous church) and holding hands may be something that makes them feel like they know what's going on? I mean, I don't know. If they take the Eucharist, then my theory is shot, but maybe... cut them some slack. Watching what others are doing and judging them during mass isn't too Christian, either... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilroy the Ninja Posted March 30, 2004 Share Posted March 30, 2004 The problem is that as Catholics (not just newbie Catholics either), we are not educated in proper form for mass. Let me repeat that: We are not educated in proper form for mass. This is due to the endless varities of "local" customs being included in masses all over the country. So many people have gone to so many different masses (and new people come to theirs) that nobody is really sure of what exactly is supposed to be going on. Furthermore, with the numerous different missals available for parishes to purchase, usually each comes with a little different directives. How are we supposed to be universal Catholic if everyone is doing it just a little bit differently? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sammy Blaze Posted March 30, 2004 Share Posted March 30, 2004 I'd only hold hands with my family members............... and everybody in every Catholic Church, in every city worldwide is a member of my family. IMHO, if we look past the entire "eww I'm holding someone's dirty hand" attitude, and focus on the sacredness of the mass, holding hands is irrelevant. If Jesus can embrace the lepers, I can surely hold a fellow Christian's hand. I know I'm theologically incorrect, but I'm still on my journey. my .02 cents. Pax Christi ~S. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilroy the Ninja Posted March 30, 2004 Share Posted March 30, 2004 You know it never occurred to me that OTHER people's hands were dirty, just mine. But I still find it uncomfortable and irreverent. Probably, and please don't any of our protestant friends take offense at this, but when I was in school and we said prayers it was always in the protestant tradition and the whole hand-holding thing made me feel uncomfortable there. So my sacred community is the last place I want to feel uncomfortable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.SIGGA Posted March 30, 2004 Share Posted March 30, 2004 It was a question and what I meant is it's not like hand holding hindering you from recieving communion or anything - not an attack, just my personal opinion. Personally I raise my hands sometimes, and I'll hold hands sometimes if they are outstretched toward me, but I'm so focused on the actual words of the Our Father and the person who said the prayer right in front of me on the altar, that my eyes are closed tight and my total focus is on Him and no one else around me. If I'm at a traditional parish I won't do it, just like I'll recieve communion on the tongue and pray the [i]Pater Noster [/i]even though I don't literally understand the language. My reasoning is that if the bishops thought it was 'repulsive' as someone else has already said, I trust the Successors of the Apostles or the Pope would have taken immediate action to stop the practice, since it occurs at the height of our Christian worship, instead of letting it go on for almost 30 years and also actively participating in the practice. I was worried once I might be doing something wrong, until I served at my Cathedral and the bishop joins hands with his fellow priests and Eucharistic ministers. My priest at home and most priests I have seen also join hands. I'm not judging; hold hands or not - whatever floats your boat - as long as you aren't making a chain to block me from the communion rail (that was a joke) Is it specifically talked about in the GIRM? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.SIGGA Posted March 30, 2004 Share Posted March 30, 2004 If you didn't catch it I was totally joking about holding people's dirty hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest thomasaquinas3 Posted March 30, 2004 Share Posted March 30, 2004 Well, I can honestly say thatI haven't given this much thought. We have been at the same parish with the same priest for as long as I can remember. WE hold hands during the Our Father, we even join hands across the aisles. I guess, since I ahve been around it ever since I can remember, it is natural to me, and it doesn't bother me. I understand all of your points against it, but the only thing I can come up with, is that many things in our faith are external, outward signs of something going on interiorly, spiritually. So, in holding hands during the Our Father, it is an external sign of our about to enter into communion, or unity with Christ, but entering into it together. The Mass is not a bunch of individuals coming for the Eucharist, but it is, rather, brothers and sisters in Christ, coming to share and partake in His Unity. Many of you, I think, if you ahve a family, will hold hands with your family, and yet we are all one big family in Christ. Holding hands is an external sign that we are united in Christ, through Christ, and that we will soon be united with Christ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest thomasaquinas3 Posted March 30, 2004 Share Posted March 30, 2004 [quote name='Sammy Blaze' date='Mar 30 2004, 12:51 PM'] I'd only hold hands with my family members............... and everybody in every Catholic Church, in every city worldwide is a member of my family. IMHO, if we look past the entire "eww I'm holding someone's dirty hand" attitude, and focus on the sacredness of the mass, holding hands is irrelevant. If Jesus can embrace the lepers, I can surely hold a fellow Christian's hand. I know I'm theologically incorrect, but I'm still on my journey. my .02 cents. Pax Christi ~S. [/quote] Amen. Thank you, I posted something similar, and then saw your post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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