Nature Of Hell

[Resurrexi]

I picture hell as a furnace of fire where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Edited June 19, 2009 by Resurrexi

[cassandragirl]

I believe hell, purgatory and heaven all are in the presence of God but in Hell (and in purgatory for some tine) they souls cannot posses Him or be united to Him and there fore saying it is like fire is correct based on things the saints have said.

God is like a living flame and as many of the saints advanced in sanctity and went through purification, they often described great suffering and buring away of their old selves. Those entering the dark night or being prepared for transforming union will often have an aversion to praying or to holy things - they feel empty and abaondoned. Souls in purgatory also have great suffering and the pain of not fully possessing God - the longing for God is their suffering.

However, the souls in Hell, because they have rejected God completly, can never be purified - they can no longer love but can only despise God and the rest of the damned.

This is my two cents

[Marie-Therese]

I believe that Hell is a real physical place...as the Scripture states, it is a place reserved for the devil and his angels. After the fall of man, sin necessitated that it be used for impenitent human souls, all suffering punishment for all eternity, where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth. I do believe that the description of Hell as a place of eternal fire is literal. Not only do those suffering have actual physical torments, the separation from the face of God amplifies the torment. For reference, I would advise reading [u]The Four Last Things - Death, Judgment, Hell, Heaven[/u] by Fr. Martin Von Cochem. It is an older text but well worth contemplation...not only on the topic of Hell, but also on eternity and judgment.

Of course, all this is IMHO.

[Gregorius]

[quote name='White Knight' post='1895469' date='Jun 18 2009, 07:48 PM']But I believe it is 100% accurate to say that we will never know extactly what Hell is like while on Earth, all we have is speculations given to us, but the only way to find out for sure is to go there, and I hope for everyone that we dont see that dreaded feared existance of Hell.
From Aaron.
God Bless You All.
Pax Christi.[/quote]
Of Course, the nature of Hell is largely irrelevant at the end of the day, as it is my goal and God's goal that none of us go there. I'm just curious, that's all.

But people, in order to have existence, there needs to be a creator to create it and sustain it at every single moment. If God was absent, how can a place exist? Is he there and just far off that the damned can never join him? Or is it like the Orthodox conception, which by the way I'm still slightly confused about. God is Love, how can Love feel like anything other than Love to a Human Being, a creature that is made to accept and reflect that same Love? Surly there cannot be that many people corrupted enough to twist and bend who they are at the deepest level?

[Gregoriana of Nyssa]

[quote name='Gregoriana of Nyssa' post='1895405' date='Jun 18 2009, 04:08 PM']1) It's in the last paragraph of my last post.

2) I have actually found theology like that in some of the Protestant churches. That's why I noted it's more like Calvinism than Catholicism.[/quote]

I did some checking....The teaching referred to in River of Fire is a combination of Anselm's Satisfaction Theory and the Reformed Penal Satisfaction Theory. It matches what I often heard in Evangelical circles, such as the Evangelical Free Church I used to attend.


[quote name='Gregorius' post='1895774' date='Jun 19 2009, 01:05 AM']Or is it like the Orthodox conception, which by the way I'm still slightly confused about.[/quote]

I found a simpler explanation than ROF that might help:
[url="http://www.oca.org/OCchapter.asp?SID=2&ID=208"]Heaven and Hell[/url]

[Gregorius]

[quote name='Gregoriana of Nyssa' post='1895789' date='Jun 19 2009, 02:20 AM']I did some checking....The teaching referred to in River of Fire is a combination of Anselm's Satisfaction Theory and the Reformed Penal Satisfaction Theory. It matches what I often heard in Evangelical circles, such as the Evangelical Free Church I used to attend.




I found a simpler explanation than ROF that might help:
[url="http://www.oca.org/OCchapter.asp?SID=2&ID=208"]Heaven and Hell[/url][/quote]
Thanks!
But see my question on this perspective above.

[Patrick]

[quote name='Gregorius' post='1895774' date='Jun 19 2009, 12:05 AM']God is Love, how can Love feel like anything other than Love to a Human Being, a creature that is made to accept and reflect that same Love? Surly there cannot be that many people corrupted enough to twist and bend who they are at the deepest level?[/quote]

I think you've nearly hit on some of the point. We do have human examples of people not being able to receive love. Many dysfunctional relationships and families have difficultly not only giving, but receiving love. For a more biblical example, consider how our relationship to God (by extension from the original intent of Israel's relationship to God) is like that of Hosea and his prostitute wife. But also more generally, in God's continual love of Israel, and yet how they turned again and again from God to other idols, rejecting God's goodness. Certainly, it is possible to feel love given as painful, restrictive, over-protective, irrelevant, etc.. etc...

[Patrick]

Why did Moses have to cover his face with a veil? The glory of God shone from Moses' face and the Israelites could not endure it. The disciples fell down on their faces seeing the glory of God in transfigured humanity upon Mt. Tabor. People died who went into the holy of holies unworthily. God's presence is difficult to endure, particularly to those who are not internally correct.

[Patrick]

Also, it must be remembered that God did not intend Hell for us humans, but rather for the devil and his angels, as it says in Luke.

For your consideration, an article on the nature of hell, from an Orthodox perspective: [url="http://aggreen.net/beliefs/heaven_hell.html"]http://aggreen.net/beliefs/heaven_hell.html[/url]

EDIT: In fact, I would point out that this article is a gem of biblical scholarship, and it answers pretty much all the points and questions that have been raised on this thread so far. I highly recommend you read it!

Edited June 19, 2009 by Patrick

[Don John of Austria]

[quote name='Gregoriana of Nyssa' post='1895386' date='Jun 18 2009, 04:38 PM']I go with the Orthodox view. Though, of course, what any of us believes doesn't change the fact that nobody knows for sure on this side.

To clarify the "burning fire" position, check out [url="http://www.orthodoxpress.org/parish/river_of_fire.htm"]The River of Fire[/url]. Though keep in mind it does get very polemical towards Western theology. What it describes as "Western" theology--I'm not sure which branch of the church it means. From what I've learned of Catholic teaching, what ROF describes fits far better with Protestant Calvinist teachings than with Catholic.

Anyway, my priest says that Hell is not physical or material as we are: Everything will be transformed at the Resurrection, no longer material as we know it now. Pictures of Hell are made material so we understand the devastation of it. We can burn inside without being materially affected.[/quote]


This is not in keeping withthe tradition of Christianity East or West .... We will be bodily Resurrected both matter and spirit. I would consult your bishop on the matter.

[Apotheoun]

[quote name='Don John of Austria' post='1896132' date='Jun 19 2009, 04:04 PM']This is not in keeping withthe tradition of Christianity East or West .... We will be bodily Resurrected both matter and spirit. I would consult your bishop on the matter.[/quote]
I agree. The spiritual body (soma pneumatikon) that St. Paul talks about is not a body that is converted into spirit, but is a physical body controlled by the Spirit.

I wrote a paper about this years ago. Click the link below to peruse it:

[url="http://sites.google.com/site/thetaboriclight/paper01"][u]St. Paul and the Resurrection of the Body[/u][/url]