Homosexuality & The Priesthood

[AdAltareDei]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' post='1861538' date='May 7 2009, 11:27 PM']Ad, everyone's got the right to disagree, but we also try to do so respectfully. Just some friendly advice. [/quote]

haha
Noted

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='AdAltareDei' post='1861547' date='May 7 2009, 11:44 PM']haha
Noted [/quote]
Glad you took that the right way. It's hard to say tactfully.

[AdAltareDei]

tact is over-rated and boring

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='AdAltareDei' post='1861610' date='May 8 2009, 02:45 AM']tact is over-rated and boring [/quote]
NOT at phatmass, it isn't

[AdAltareDei]

hmmm

[franciscanheart]

[quote name='HisChildForever' post='1858412' date='May 5 2009, 10:49 AM']As I learned more about the faith, my issues were - women priests, contraception, and homosexual civil unions.[/quote]
[quote name='mcts' post='1858970' date='May 5 2009, 07:52 PM']the fact that mary and joseph remained virgins, homosexual CIVIL unions[/quote]
i know i'm late to the game but i'm confused. two posters in the first two pages of this thread spoke to having issues with the homosexual [b]civil[/b] union teachings of the Church. why civil? what difference does it make if the Church will allow Her people to marry civilly and not sacramentally? how do you have one without the other?

so confused.

[ariaane]

[quote name='CatherineM' post='1859423' date='May 6 2009, 08:41 AM']I think barring gay men from the priesthood is in reaction to the perception that they had become too ingrained in the priesthood, especially in seminaries. When dealing with something as large as the clergy abuse scandal is, and it is far from over legally, there is often the reaction to amputate. [b]Even though many of the pedophile priests weren't homosexual,[/b] it was felt that the atmosphere that allowed homosexuals to hide in the priesthood also allowed pedophiles to hide. I have to accept that they know what they are doing, and respond with[/quote]

[quote name='AdAltareDei' post='1859423' date='May 6 2009, 05:04 AM']Being a homosexual struggling for chastity isn't going to interfer with your priestly ministry any more than being heterosexual struggling for chastity will.[/quote]

I used to think the same thing about homosexual priests, but then I did some reading and discovered:

1. That 80% of the child abuse cases in the Catholic Church involved [b]post pubescent teenage boys[/b] and men with same sex attraction, according to the J[b]ohn Jay Criminal College[/b] investigation.

The abuses, although child molestation, were not predominantly one of paedophilia, but homosexuals raping underage teenage boys. Some call it pedastry.

One would have to be in denial if they cannot see that youth in males is very popular in the gay [b]male[/b] culture- this doesn't seem to be the cases with lesbians. Gay men who chase adolescent males are known as chickenhawks in the gay male culture.

2. Where there is an abundance of homosexual priests, liberalism and feminism seem to follow hand in hand. Books such as “Goodbye Good men” by Michael S Rose note how the most liberal areas in the US comprised the highest number of homosexual priest/ feminist nuns/ child abuse cases.

3. Yes, celibate men with SSA are different from practicing homosexual males, but lets be realistic: Putting a priest with SSA in close quarters with other priests at the very least, [b]can lead to an occasion of sin[/b]. It is asking for trouble, just like sticking heterosexual priests in close quarters with heterosexual nuns is too, asking for trouble...

Edited May 11, 2009 by ariaane

[havok579257]

[quote name='ariaane' post='1864151' date='May 11 2009, 10:27 AM']I used to think the same thing about homosexual priests, but then I did some reading and discovered:

1. That 80% of the child abuse cases in the Catholic Church involved [b]post pubescent teenage boys[/b] and men with same sex attraction, according to the J[b]ohn Jay Criminal College[/b] investigation.

The abuses, although child molestation, were not predominantly one of paedophilia, but homosexuals raping underage teenage boys. Some call it pedastry.

One would have to be in denial if they cannot see that youth in males is very popular in the gay [b]male[/b] culture- this doesn't seem to be the cases with lesbians. Gay men who chase adolescent males are known as chickenhawks in the gay male culture.

2. Where there is an abundance of homosexual priests, liberalism and feminism seem to follow hand in hand. Books such as “Goodbye Good men” by Michael S Rose note how the most liberal areas in the US comprised the highest number of homosexual priest/ feminist nuns/ child abuse cases.

3. Yes, celibate men with SSA are different from practicing homosexual males, but lets be realistic: Putting a priest with SSA in close quarters with other priests at the very least, [b]can lead to an occasion of sin[/b]. It is asking for trouble, just like sticking heterosexual priests in close quarters with heterosexual nuns is too, asking for trouble...[/quote]

If that's your point on #3, what's the difference from putting a heterosexual priest around tennage girls in catholic school girl unifroms, since a just barley legal look is big in society today and that's a big thing the porn industry pushes in society today. I really don't see any difference beweetn a gay priest and straight priest when it comes to #3.

[CatherineM]

[quote name='ariaane' post='1864151' date='May 11 2009, 09:27 AM']I used to think the same thing about homosexual priests, but then I did some reading and discovered:

1. That 80% of the child abuse cases in the Catholic Church involved [b]post pubescent teenage boys[/b] and men with same sex attraction, according to the J[b]ohn Jay Criminal College[/b] investigation.

The abuses, although child molestation, were not predominantly one of paedophilia, but homosexuals raping underage teenage boys. Some call it pedastry.

One would have to be in denial if they cannot see that youth in males is very popular in the gay [b]male[/b] culture- this doesn't seem to be the cases with lesbians. Gay men who chase adolescent males are known as chickenhawks in the gay male culture.

2. Where there is an abundance of homosexual priests, liberalism and feminism seem to follow hand in hand. Books such as “Goodbye Good men” by Michael S Rose note how the most liberal areas in the US comprised the highest number of homosexual priest/ feminist nuns/ child abuse cases.

3. Yes, celibate men with SSA are different from practicing homosexual males, but lets be realistic: Putting a priest with SSA in close quarters with other priests at the very least, [b]can lead to an occasion of sin[/b]. It is asking for trouble, just like sticking heterosexual priests in close quarters with heterosexual nuns is too, asking for trouble...[/quote]


That's interesting. I didn't know that. I knew from my Criminal Law classes that most pedophiles are hetero, and just assumed that applied to the clergy abuse scandal as well. I should know better than to make assumptions. I suspect I never looked at the numbers because like a lot of Catholics, I dealt with the abuse scandal by trying not to think about it too much. I guess it is time to get over that because to fix a problem, you really need to understand how it was allowed to happen in the first place.

[ariaane]

[quote name='havok579257' post='1864172' date='May 11 2009, 05:41 PM']If that's your point on #3, what's the difference from putting a heterosexual priest around tennage girls in catholic school girl unifroms, since a just barley legal look is big in society today and that's a big thing the porn industry pushes in society today. I really don't see any difference beweetn a gay priest and straight priest when it comes to #3.[/quote]

Point taken.

However, a heterosexual priest must be in contact with heterosexual females at some point.
Priests have to hear peoples confessions, and that includes school girls, sometimes in school uniforms.

Not to mention that there is difference between a priest teaching a class with young girls in a [b]public setting[/b] and him [b]living with young girls[/b].

Often, priests live in shared houses sometimes called presbyteries. When the lights go out, who is to stay that only licit behaviour will occur between SSA priests who share the same home...

For this reason, nuns and priests do not share the same living quarters, and [b]rightfully[/b] so.

[LouisvilleFan]

[quote name='havok579257' post='1864172' date='May 11 2009, 12:41 PM']If that's your point on #3, what's the difference from putting a heterosexual priest around tennage girls in catholic school girl unifroms, since a just barley legal look is big in society today and that's a big thing the porn industry pushes in society today. I really don't see any difference beweetn a gay priest and straight priest when it comes to #3.[/quote]

Or trying to drive around town about 3pm...

I never understood why those skirts are actually required outfits. I hear they're supposed to be knee-length...

[ariaane]

[quote name='CatherineM' post='1864179' date='May 11 2009, 05:53 PM']That's interesting. I didn't know that. I knew from my Criminal Law classes that most pedophiles are hetero, and just assumed that applied to the clergy abuse scandal as well. I should know better than to make assumptions. I suspect I never looked at the numbers because like a lot of Catholics, I dealt with the abuse scandal by trying not to think about it too much. I guess it is time to get over that because to fix a problem, you really need to understand how it was allowed to happen in the first place.[/quote]

I very much doubt that [b]most paedophiles[/b] are heterosexual.

What often is not taken into consideration is [b]ratio[/b], when we look at statistical occurrences of child abuse amongst heterosexuals and homosexuals.

Of course, there will be more instances of child abuse amongst the heterosexual demographic, [b]because heterosexuals comprise over 96%[/b] of the worlds population (The 10% of the world is gay statistic is nothing but a myth that originates from Kinsey’s faulty studies- and many homosexuals acknowledge this today).

What needs to be looked at are the number of child abuse cases in [b]relation to the size[/b] of the homosexual demographic. When this is done, I’m pretty certain the conclusions you have will be different.

The media, of course, will not report the truth about the child abuse cases lest they offend the liberal and homosexual demographic who are prone to erupt whenever a bad word is spoken about homosexuals.

Even instances where known homosexual paedohiles have raped and killed boys, such as the Jesse Dhirsking case (sp), the media remains silent. I even stumbled upon a gay blog which legitimised this homosexual rape of the 12 year old boy claiming the boy had consented to being mutilated and sodomised, and his death was accidental. Yes, a homosexual male wrote such revisionist reporting publicly. And was he challenged by the homosexual community? I doubt it...

I say what I say because of I think society needs to upfront and [b]honest about the tendency of male homosexuals (and I’m not talking about lesbians here) to be obsessed with all things young and male.[/b] I don’t see the same trend amongst lesbian women.

Keep in mind that NAMBLA (man-boy love organisation) was born from the homosexual rights movement, and was only disowned by the homosexual community when they began to receive negative press from the public. Again, this is something that some homosexual organisations do admit.

And yes, I do agree that we have to stop with the political correctness and call a spade a spade. [b]I consider the welfare of young males- and their souls (keep in mind that many abused boys have probably left the Church, thus endangering their salvation)- more important than offending homosexual males, be they young boy lovers or not.[/b]

[CatherineM]

[quote name='ariaane' post='1864201' date='May 11 2009, 11:20 AM']I very much doubt that [b]most paedophiles[/b] are heterosexual.[/quote]

When it comes to pre-pubescent children, it really isn't about gender anyway. It is about the age of the child. Once a child hits puberty, then the statistics change, but of course at that point, the abuser is not technically a pedophile, it's called hebephilia. In the real world though, we don't really make that distinction. Studies done in penitentiaries of those convicted of child molestation have shown they are typically heterosexual [i]with adults[/i].

[franciscanheart]

i cannot believe you are sitting here claiming that homosexuals are pedophiles. this is disgusting.

[HisChildForever]

[quote name='hugheyforlife' post='1864141' date='May 11 2009, 09:39 AM']i know i'm late to the game but i'm confused. two posters in the first two pages of this thread spoke to having issues with the homosexual [b]civil[/b] union teachings of the Church. why civil? what difference does it make if the Church will allow Her people to marry civilly and not sacramentally? how do you have one without the other?

so confused.[/quote]

Again I will state that I no longer support homosexual unions of any kind. Anyway, the term "homosexual marriage" implies a union before God in a Church. The term "homosexual civil union" implies more of a legal union by a justice of the peace. I always had wondered why the homosexual couple could not have the latter; while I never agreed with homosexual activity and knew it was contrary to nature and God (still do believe this), I never understood why the couple could not be joint (not [i]married[/i] but [i]joint[/i]) under the law. Marriage would mean that the Church approves of their relationship, which is of course not the case nor ever will be. A civil union, however, is not a Sacrament (not sure if this is true, but this was my line of thought).

Edited May 11, 2009 by HisChildForever