Could A Pope Become An Antichrist ?

[Guest]

Rev 12:9
9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

Rev 13:11-18 (Cont.)
12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.
13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.
16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.

[Guest]

[quote name='Resurrexi' post='1840362' date='Apr 19 2009, 06:00 AM']Nice Protestants are not necessarily invincibly ignorant.[/quote]

lol ok well all we are going to do is run around in circles then.

Again im talking about christains who love God and have fruit to show it.

I see your argument if you love God you will become catholic but that isn't how it always works.

At any rate hopefully they can become catholic and experience him in the eucharist.

[Resurrexi]

I admit that I know little about end times. What I do know is that "iterum venturus est cum gloria iudicare vivos et mortuos" ("He is going to come again with glory to judge the alive and the dead") and that "expecto resurrectionem mortuorum" ("I await the resurrection of the dead").

[Resurrexi]

[quote name='Delivery Boy' post='1840368' date='Apr 19 2009, 07:13 AM']lol ok well all we are going to do is run around in circles then.

Again im talking about christains who love God and have fruit to show it.

I see your argument if you love God you will become catholic but that isn't how it always works.

At any rate hopefully they can become catholic and experience him in the eucharist.[/quote]

Some Protestants do some good things. This is true. So do atheists. You don't have to be in the state of grace to do good things.

[Guest]

dude i dont know that much either.
i just know from what i have learned here and from other christian teachers.
i know the main thing is the antichrist comes first at the 6th trump before the true christ.
and the bible says many will be decieved.
but we got the church so they will keep us informed.
i put to much time into thinking about it
27 w/o a g/f what do you expect lol

[Resurrexi]

Perhaps you should get into parish politics...

[Guest]

[quote name='Resurrexi' post='1840371' date='Apr 19 2009, 07:22 AM']Some Protestants do some good things. This is true. So do atheists. You don't have to be in the state of grace to do good things.[/quote]

Ok all im saying is God is good and I feel God is going to save someone who truelly belives in him and walks in love and repents of their sins.
And I accpet them as my brothers and sisters in Chirst.

Edited April 19, 2009 by Guest

[Guest]

[quote name='Resurrexi' post='1840373' date='Apr 19 2009, 07:24 AM']Perhaps you should get into parish politics...[/quote]

what's that ?

[abercius24]

I apologize if my theory (that the anti-Christ may be an anti-Pope someday) has caused some confusion. That is in fact speculative theology and should be seen as nothing other than an educated guess on what may come to pass.

But I should point out that if an anti-Pope were to exist as the anti-Christ, there would also be a true Pope hiding underground with the rest of us who were being persecuted for our faith by that same anti-Christ. And if this anti-Pope were able to convince many that he was the real Pope, many of the faithful would live temporarily in a state of great confusion, but the false and contrary doctrines the anti-Pope would be putting forth would easily act as an undeniable indicator to us that the true Pope was in fact in hiding.

It should also be pointed out that Papal Infallibility transcends time -- particularly the reign of one Pope to another. Popes therefore cannot contradict each other's infallible statements, nor can they contradict the universal infallibility the magesterium has claim to as part of dogmatic decrees made at Ecumenical Councils. Any Pope who would dare do such a thing would easily demonstrate himself to in fact be an anti-Pope (and the faithful would be searching the globe for the real Pope as a result). And if this were the case in the possible scenario of the anti-Christ, then I would imagine it would be that much more obvious given the atrocities and viscious heresies the anti-Christ has been fortold to spearhead.

And I would also like to say that everything Aloysius said is on the money -- as usual!

Edited April 19, 2009 by abercius24

[Guest]

[quote name='abercius24' post='1840390' date='Apr 19 2009, 08:29 AM'][font="Arial Black"]But I should point out that if an anti-Pope were to exist as the anti-Christ, there would also be a true Pope hiding underground with the rest of us who were being persecuted for our faith by that same anti-Christ. [/font][/quote]



That's all I need to know right there !
Thanks bro and Godbless.

[Socrates]

[quote name='abercius24' post='1840390' date='Apr 19 2009, 07:29 AM']I apologize if my theory (that the anti-Christ may be an anti-Pope someday) has caused some confusion. That is in fact speculative theology and should be seen as nothing other than an educated guess on what may come to pass.

But I should point out that if an anti-Pope were to exist as the anti-Christ, there would also be a true Pope hiding underground with the rest of us who were being persecuted for our faith by that same anti-Christ. And if this anti-Pope were able to convince many that he was the real Pope, many of the faithful would live temporarily in a state of great confusion, but the false and contrary doctrines the anti-Pope would be putting forth would easily act as an undeniable indicator to us that the true Pope was in fact in hiding.

It should also be pointed out that Papal Infallibility transcends time -- particularly the reign of one Pope to another. Popes therefore cannot contradict each other's infallible statements, nor can they contradict the universal infallibility the magesterium has claim to as part of dogmatic decrees made at Ecumenical Councils. Any Pope who would dare do such a thing would easily demonstrate himself to in fact be an anti-Pope (and the faithful would be searching the globe for the real Pope as a result). And if this were the case in the possible scenario of the anti-Christ, then I would imagine it would be that much more obvious given the atrocities and viscious heresies the anti-Christ has been fortold to spearhead.

And I would also like to say that everything Aloysius said is on the money -- as usual![/quote]
Yes, we need to keep in mind that the idea that the Antichrist will be a "Catholic" antipope remains nothing but speculation.
While I suppose that is a possibility, personally I'm dubious. Seriously, I don't think people (including, unfortunately, many "Catholics") will have to think the Antichrist is Pope in order to be led astray. All that will be necessary is that present trends continue, and nobody gives a rat's rear-end what the Pope teaches. (Just look at how many "Catholics" worshipfully followed Obama, despite his policies quite clearly being contrary to Church moral teaching.)
I tend to think it will be clear (at least to most honest and serious Catholics) who the real Pope is. He won't be some obscure figure hiding in the wilds of Montana or the Australian outback, or where-have-you, as certain rad-trads of dubious mental functionality would have us believe.
Currently most people (including most so-called "Catholics") don't follow nor care what the Pope teaches, so no anti-pope would be necessary to mislead them.
As long as liberalism and relativism dominate our culture, the masses will happily follow after whatever charlatan charms them with "Hope," "Change" and other empty puffery.

Edited April 21, 2009 by Socrates

[Guest]

I don't think a antipope will be the antichrist although a antipope could be the false prophet that tells the world to worship the antichirst and take the mark of the beast so they will be able to buy and sell.

[Aloysius]

[quote name='Socrates' post='1842059' date='Apr 20 2009, 10:58 PM']Yes, we need to keep in mind that the idea that the Antichrist will be a "Catholic" antipope remains nothing but speculation.
While I suppose that is a possibility, personally I'm dubious. Seriously, I don't think people (including, unfortunately, many "Catholics") will have to think the Antichrist is Pope in order to be led astray. All that will be necessary is that present trends continue, and nobody gives a rat's rear-end what the Pope teaches. (Just look at how many "Catholics" worshipfully followed Obama, despite his policies quite clearly being contrary to Church moral teaching.)
I tend to think it will be clear (at least to most honest and serious Catholics) who the real Pope is. He won't be some obscure figure hiding in the wilds of Montana or the Australian outback, or where-have-you, as certain rad-trads of dubious mental functionality would have us believe.
Currently most people (including most so-called "Catholics") don't follow nor care what the Pope teaches, so no anti-pope would be necessary to mislead them.
As long as liberalism and relativism dominate our culture, the masses will happily follow after whatever charlatan charms them with "Hope," "Change" and other empty puffery.[/quote]
imagine, if you will, an anti-pope set up not by the Cardinals in Rome, but under a schismatic meeting of dissatisfied liberal Catholics together with their ecumenical brethren of many religions... imagine such a "pope" comes and teaches birth control is okay, homosexuality is okay, all religions are equal and Christ isn't really that special. you really don't think claiming the office of the papacy wouldn't make such a "pope" popular, followed, and obeyed? especially would he be all the more obeyed if he claimed that no one had to obey him as pope! such an anti-pope could figure prominently into an end times scenario, IMO.

[goldenchild17]

[quote name='Delivery Boy' post='1842064' date='Apr 20 2009, 09:03 PM']I don't think a antipope will be the antichrist although a antipope could be the false prophet that tells the world to worship the antichirst and take the mark of the beast so they will be able to buy and sell.[/quote]

I think this type of scenario is more likely.

[HisChildForever]

[quote name='Delivery Boy' post='1842064' date='Apr 20 2009, 10:03 PM']I don't think a antipope will be the antichrist although a antipope could be the false prophet that tells the world to worship the antichirst and take the mark of the beast so they will be able to buy and sell.[/quote]

Are you reading those Left Behind books?