Driving Drunk And The Punishment

[dairygirl4u2c]

[quote name='philothea' post='1823979' date='Apr 3 2009, 09:10 PM']While prison works -- obviously if you're in a cell you're not driving drunk anymore -- it still doesn't stop people's first offense... and all it takes is once to kill somebody.

I have a better solution!

Any place that serves alcohol can't have a parking lot. [/quote]

i like where you're going with it.
if we don't keep them in jail for their whole life, for the reasons i said, or you, about how it's sorta pointless -- then perhaps we keep a tag on em for the rest of their life. community service etc. i'd totally behind that. they took someone's life, so a life long tag, i could care less.
(maybe in old age, let em be free of it, ? maybe)

[knightec]

All good suggestions. Where does the line of protecting the public interest cross into violating the rights of the accused? They might be criminals but they still have rights.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='philothea' post='1823979' date='Apr 3 2009, 08:10 PM']While prison works -- obviously if you're in a cell you're not driving drunk anymore -- it still doesn't stop people's first offense... and all it takes is once to kill somebody.

I have a better solution!

Any place that serves alcohol can't have a parking lot. [/quote]
People might park somewhere else illegally.
We're not going far enough.

We need to bring back prohibition.

[philothea]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' post='1824250' date='Apr 4 2009, 01:45 AM']People might park somewhere else illegally.
We're not going far enough.

We need to bring back prohibition.

[/quote]


Actually, my idea came from watching people in Japan, who drink [i]way[/i] more alcohol than Americans. Beer vending machines in the streets. Booze sold at fast food restaurants. The most enormous beer cans you have EVER seen (we're talking 1 liter here.) They think getting pass-out-on-the-sidewalk drunk every weekend is normal, healthy, good fun.

But they have no trouble with drunk driving, because very few people drive. It's all walking, trains, busses, taxis, or bicycles. The few people who have cars would never do something so stupid with them.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='philothea' post='1824263' date='Apr 4 2009, 01:06 AM']

Actually, my idea came from watching people in Japan, who drink [i]way[/i] more alcohol than Americans. Beer vending machines in the streets. Booze sold at fast food restaurants. The most enormous beer cans you have EVER seen (we're talking 1 liter here.) They think getting pass-out-on-the-sidewalk drunk every weekend is normal, healthy, good fun.

But they have no trouble with drunk driving, because very few people drive. It's all walking, trains, busses, taxis, or bicycles. The few people who have cars would never do something so stupid with them.[/quote]
I read that it's actually part of the business culture to go out with coworkers and get passing-out drunk.
I have an idea then! In Japan it's not a huge problem because nobody drives. Nobody drives because it's too crowded. If North America were too crowded nobody would drive and we wouldn't have a huge problem.

Therefore, our respective governments need to start slipping fertility treatment into the water and food supply. Also outlaw abortion and emmigration.

[Archaeology cat]

Unless it's changed or I was given incorrect info, I think in Germany a person loses their license after the first offence, and cannot get it back. I would think that would be quite a deterrent, but I don't know the stats.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='Archaeology cat' post='1824280' date='Apr 4 2009, 01:42 AM']Unless it's changed or I was given incorrect info, I think in Germany a person loses their license after the first offence, and cannot get it back. I would think that would be quite a deterrent, but I don't know the stats.[/quote]
That sounds perfectly acceptable to me, actually.

Especially in places in and around Germany, with the Autobahn. Recipe for disaster.

[Archaeology cat]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' post='1824282' date='Apr 4 2009, 07:48 AM']That sounds perfectly acceptable to me, actually.

Especially in places in and around Germany, with the Autobahn. Recipe for disaster.[/quote]
Its really hard to get your license there to begin with. Not too easy here, either, from what I've read (I need to get my license here, just keep putting it off). Some of the people here are amazed at how easy it is to get a license in parts of the US. So I guess my idea would be to make the driving instruction & test a bit more stringent, and then if the person does get a DWI, to lose the license. Maybe they could earn it back after more stringent instruction, but I'm not sure how I feel about that necessarily. Of course, the problem then is that you get people driving without licenses, but if they drink and drive then (or get caught driving without their license), I would say jail time would be in order. Just my opinion, though.

[Sojourner]

I can't find the stats quickly, but if I remember correctly most people arrested once for DWI do not re-offend, but if you've done it twice the risk you are highly likely to keep offending. A fairly high percentage of arrests each year are in this second category or repeat re-offenders, and apparently there are few widely effective deterrents for this group.

I have trouble saying that initial offenders should be punished very severely for a few reasons. One, some people really do must make a mistake, and the current deterrence system we have in place is highly effective for them. They'll clean up their act and not reoffend, and go on to be productive citizens, which is our goal. So I am fine with saying that initial offenses remain misdemeanors (jail time less than one year) with perhaps a few scare tactics like suspending a license, doing electronic monitoring during probation, or forced rehabilitation depending on the person.

For a second offense, though, I would make the punishment MUCH harsher, although I'd give some leniency to people who have more than, say, 10 years between offenses. There's no reason someone should be getting 11 offenses. That's crazy. They should have been forced to sell their cars after offense number 3. I feel less sure that life without parole is appropriate unless someone dies on a repeat offense, but I could be convinced. I just think that we should allow for the possibility of real rehabilitation. I am still am optimist like that.

A guy in my law school class got a DUI last year, nearly a year after his fiance was killed by a drunk driver. I still think of it whenever I look at him. Hopefully he won't reoffend.

[Nihil Obstat]

I'd love to see stats about reoffending.

[Lil Red]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' post='1824407' date='Apr 4 2009, 11:52 AM']I'd love to see stats about reoffending.[/quote]+J.M.J.+
me too.

[philothea]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' post='1824407' date='Apr 4 2009, 01:52 PM']I'd love to see stats about reoffending.[/quote]


[quote name='Lil Red' post='1824430' date='Apr 4 2009, 02:39 PM']+J.M.J.+
me too.[/quote]

[url="http://www.stopimpaireddriving.org/research-repeat.htm"]This site[/url] seems to have some good information, but I am currently too full of Greek food to be able to read.

[Thomist-in-Training]

I'm with dairygirl, even if you kill someone, putting a drunk driver in jail for life is like trying to make a right with two wrongs (assuming they haven't already offended more than once).

Actually, there's a novel for young adults called "Whirligig" about a young man who kills a girl by accident. The girl's mother asks him to perform a task in her memory that will take a lot of time and effort and (being a novel) will also teach him to put his life back together. Obviously that's not something you could work out with laws but it makes sense to me.

[url="http://books.google.com/books?id=sLTD_lulsYoC&dq=whirligig+novel&printsec=frontcover&source=bn&hl=en&ei=uQLYSY3gLJHCM9ufufEO&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=5#PPT150,M1"]http://books.google.com/books?id=sLTD_luls...num=5#PPT150,M1[/url]

[desertwoman]

I think there was a true happening of this when the court ordered a young man to write out a check to the family every year in their daughters name and set aside an account for her. It drove him mad of course to always write a check and write a letter as well with the money.

[ReinnieR]

i had driven drunk. i had woken up one morning and been told that i was driving (black out) if you wannna throw me in jail, go ahead. if you want me to get death sentence go ahead.