Latin Mass

[Slappo]

Just to quickly add to what Cam was pasting from the liturgical documents for those unfamiliar with liturgical rubrics and the use of language:

The documents don't themselves allow for a completely vernacular mass, but with the permission of the ecclesiastical authority (your bishop) it was allowed in VII. Obviously since such a great amount of permission was needed to do such a thing, it was not the intention of the council

So, to say a mass entirely in the vernacular is not explicitly against the rubrics, but it definitely isn't in the spirit of Vatican II either.

I know Cam knows that, but it is hard to see that in the excerpts he posted from the documents.


If I didn't state my opinion already it is this:
I'd love to have an ad orientem latin novus ordo mass with a silent canon and some use of the vernacular for the readings and a couple other spots. I like the EF but would rather have a properly and beautifully celebrated OF. (Proper no rubrics broken, beautiful in how it is done)

[Cam42]

[quote name='Slappo' post='1840115' date='Apr 18 2009, 09:41 PM']Just to quickly add to what Cam was pasting from the liturgical documents for those unfamiliar with liturgical rubrics and the use of language:

The documents don't themselves allow for a completely vernacular mass, but with the permission of the ecclesiastical authority (your bishop) it was allowed in VII. Obviously since such a great amount of permission was needed to do such a thing, it was not the intention of the council

So, to say a mass entirely in the vernacular is not explicitly against the rubrics, but it definitely isn't in the spirit of Vatican II either.

I know Cam knows that, but it is hard to see that in the excerpts he posted from the documents.


If I didn't state my opinion already it is this:
I'd love to have an ad orientem latin novus ordo mass with a silent canon and some use of the vernacular for the readings and a couple other spots. I like the EF but would rather have a properly and beautifully celebrated OF. (Proper no rubrics broken, beautiful in how it is done)[/quote]

www.stagnes.net

There is the only place that I know of that does it exactly as you would like to see it done. It was my home parish in college. I lived in the rectory for two years with Mons. Schuler...

[Slappo]

[quote name='Cam42' post='1840125' date='Apr 18 2009, 08:56 PM']www.stagnes.net

There is the only place that I know of that does it exactly as you would like to see it done. It was my home parish in college. I lived in the rectory for two years with Mons. Schuler...[/quote]

I'm picky

I wouldn't ever expect what I'd like from a parish, but I'd love to be able to attend one done that way sometime.

[Vincent Vega]

Sorry to jump in so late, especially if this has already been said, but I like the idea of Latin mass - I haven't been to one, though...yet.
I like the idea, because I appreciate the fact that the use of Latin acts as a very real divider between the sacred and profane. So much of the vocabulary that is used in the Mass is used in common language: "love" - it's used to express concepts such as love, in "...the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you always...", but also those like, "I love shopping at American Eagle!" It's one word, but in one context, it's so much more profound and meaningful.
Speaking from personal experience, I find that it's easy to get lazy when the mass is in your native language, because you don't have to think about what's going on to understand it. When something is in another language, even if you only understand a "scripted" form of the language, like the Mass in Latin, one still has to think of the meaning of the words in terms they can understand, and I think it requires a good deal more focus and more participation to keep up. As I said, I've never been to Latin mass, but this I have observed from saying the Rosary in Latin.
That's just my opinion.
Pax

[AdAltareDei]

I love the Traditional Mass. It nourishes my soul so much better than most Ordinary Form Masses I've had to endure.

But really, its the Eucharist that matters. Sometimes I prefer a silent Mass. Without guitars but also without gregorian Chant and soaring latin hymns. That way I can focus completely on Jesus.

I am waiting for the day when the New translation of the Roman Missal is released in Australia and the language used in the Novus Ordo Mass regains some dignity. Hopefully the secular music will disappear aswell.

[jeffpugh]

[quote name='AdAltareDei' post='1843393' date='Apr 22 2009, 06:14 AM']I love the Traditional Mass. It nourishes my soul so much better than most Ordinary Form Masses I've had to endure.

But really, its the Eucharist that matters. Sometimes I prefer a silent Mass. Without guitars but also without gregorian Chant and soaring latin hymns. That way I can focus completely on Jesus.

I am waiting for the day when the New translation of the Roman Missal is released in Australia and the language used in the Novus Ordo Mass regains some dignity. Hopefully the secular music will disappear aswell.[/quote]
werd

[Moosey]

[quote name='AdAltareDei' post='1843393' date='Apr 22 2009, 07:14 AM']I love the Traditional Mass. It nourishes my soul so much better than most Ordinary Form Masses I've had to endure.

But really, its the Eucharist that matters. Sometimes I prefer a silent Mass. Without guitars but also without gregorian Chant and soaring latin hymns. That way I can focus completely on Jesus.

I am waiting for the day when the New translation of the Roman Missal is released in Australia and the language used in the Novus Ordo Mass regains some dignity. Hopefully the secular music will disappear aswell.[/quote]


Im waiting for that to happen in the US. I also agree that a low Mass (aka the quiet Mass) is very pleasant and I find, much more conducive to focused prayer. I do love the high Masses too though for different reasons.

[LouisvilleFan]

[quote name='USAirwaysIHS' post='1840191' date='Apr 19 2009, 02:46 AM']Speaking from personal experience, I find that it's easy to get lazy when the mass is in your native language, because you don't have to think about what's going on to understand it. When something is in another language, even if you only understand a "scripted" form of the language, like the Mass in Latin, one still has to think of the meaning of the words in terms they can understand, and I think it requires a good deal more focus and more participation to keep up.[/quote]

If that reasoning were true, the Eastern Orthodox and Rites would have a long history of liturgical abuses, as would the Latin Rite before Latin became a dead language.

Besides, I've heard proponents of the EF and Latin Mass claim that after you get the hang of it, you don't have to consciously think about the meaning of words.

So, I wonder which it is... difficult or easy... prone to abuse or not?

Edited April 27, 2009 by LouisvilleFan

[elizabeth09]

Well, let just say this is that how easy the words come to you.