Owner Of Muslim Relations Tv Network Beheads Wife

[Madame Vengier]

[quote name='Hassan' post='1792875' date='Feb 27 2009, 10:15 PM']It's not revisionism, that's what the term "some" means.



lol, I'll bite. How?





I guess I was misled by
[i]That's hilarious.

While Muslims are killing and oppressing in the name of Islam all over the world, [size=5]the rest of us are supposed to "give it a fair shake". LOL.[/size][/i]

perhapse it was when you claimed to be "laughing out loud" to my statment.

You claim that my comment was "hilarious" and then "laughed out loud" at the idea that "while Muslims are killing and oppressing in the name of Islam all over the world" you all ought to "give Islam a fair shake"





Sure

has it ever occured to you that perhapse you just arn't very clear?




It's arrogant to request an explanation? Impressive you got through all your advanced education while beleiving this.[/quote]

You know what, Hassan. [b]YOU DON'T GET IT.[/b] Period. There is no possibility of trying to explain ANYTHING to you. Amazingly, no one else in this thread seems to be as confused and perplexed as you are.

[Hassan]

[quote name='Madame Vengier' post='1793527' date='Feb 28 2009, 10:10 AM']Who is to say he was "sick in the head"?
By all evidence in his work and social life, he was entirely functional...with the exception of his marriage in which, witnesses say, it was well-known that he was abusive for years leading up to the murder. A person who is truly mentally ill cannot just pick and choose which areas of their lives they are functional or dysfunctional in. How can one say a person is "sick in the head" when they can function so easily in all aspects of life that even AFTER the murder, colleagues and friends expressed "shock" because "he was so gentle". Other than being abusive, no one saw any signs of "sick in the head". A person doesn't have to be insane to be abusive. Sane people are perfectly capable of acting out immorally. I reject the notion that this man is "sick in the head". I think he knew exactly what he was doing. It will be interesting to hear what he says for himself when the trial gets under way.[/quote]


I'm not deneying that this man knew what he was doing and that he ought to pay the price, simply because this may is legally sane does not mean he's not a very sick man. In the sense of being a very sick human being. Obviously he had some psychological issues if he hacked off his wife's head in a fit of rage, that in no way absolves him.

[Hassan]

[quote name='Madame Vengier' post='1793528' date='Feb 28 2009, 10:12 AM']You know what, Hassan. [b]YOU DON'T GET IT.[/b] Period. There is no possibility of trying to explain ANYTHING to you. Amazingly, no one else in this thread seems to be as confused and perplexed as you are.[/quote]

Apparently I don't get it. It appear that I need to study literary criticism because apparently I can not decode the cryptic message lying just below what appeared to be a sarcastic snide at the idea that Islam ought to be "given a fair shake". I must reject the idea that there is no possibility of explaining anything to me. In fact over my life innumerable individuals have explained innumerable lessons and facts to me and I seemed to have been able to understand what they were trying to get across just fine. I'm not confused or perplexed in the least. I have an understanding of what appears to be a fairly clear comment on your part. According to you if my skills of "literary" criticism were a bit more toned I would have a different understanding yet you don't seem to want to clearly point out just what that understanding is. At first you took exception to my utterly appropriate use of the word "some". Now you seemed to have dropped that and reject the idea that you ever suggested that Islam should not be treated fairly. How you can judge exactly what others took from your comment would be interesting to know seeing as, aside from a very brief comment from TotusTuusMaria I seem to be the only one who has commented on it. If you want to explain what you really meant by your comment, which seems to need no explanation, than I'm all ears. If you simply want to use MORE BIG WORD the [b]EMPHATICALLY INSIST YOU ARE RIGHT[/b] as though THE LARGER YOUR WORDS THE MORE CORRECT YOU ARE while insisting that I'm simply to obtuse to understand the brilliant subtlety of your points than I'm not interested.

[Madame Vengier]

[quote name='Hassan' post='1793611' date='Feb 28 2009, 02:25 PM']Apparently I don't get it. It appear that I need to study literary criticism because apparently I can not decode the cryptic message lying just below what appeared to be a sarcastic snide at the idea that Islam ought to be "given a fair shake".[/quote]

It wasn't cryptic--as evidenced by the fact that no one else is as confused and perplexed by it as you are--and yes, you failed to comprehend but then ran off at the keyboard anyway. This is your usual MO with anything I write. I've said it before and I'll say it again: you don't engage in dialogue; you create arguments.

I didn't bother reading the rest of your post past the sentence above. I'm frankly fed up with your confused, perplexed, and demanding commentary to everything I write at PhatMass.

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='Hassan' post='1793604' date='Feb 28 2009, 02:13 PM']I'm not deneying that this man knew what he was doing and that he ought to pay the price, simply because this may is legally sane does not mean he's not a very sick man. In the sense of being a very sick human being. Obviously he had some psychological issues if he hacked off his wife's head in a fit of rage, that in no way absolves him.[/quote]


The man placed a great deal of importance on his marriage and family and looking respectable. Public loss of his wife, loss of face, loss of his children, loss of his business partner, loss of his possible business, being raised in a religion that says you are superior to a woman, and having a history of abusing the one closest to him would tick off rage. He punished the one who was causing it all - his wife, in a way his cultural background provided. Abusers typically don't get that they themselves are causing the problem. See what ya learn after 4 semesters of psych.

[Hassan]

[quote name='Madame Vengier' post='1794264' date='Mar 1 2009, 12:18 PM']It wasn't cryptic--as evidenced by the fact that no one else is as confused and perplexed by it as you are--and yes, you failed to comprehend but then ran off at the keyboard anyway.[/quote]

As I said before, seeing as except for TTM I'm the only person to respond your your odd claim I'm not sure how you make that judgement. I didn't find it cryptic in the least.

[b]me-Islam but it hardly get's a fair shake here (for the most part).[/b]

[i]you-That's hilarious. While Muslims are killing and oppressing in the name of Islam all over the world, the rest of us are supposed to "give it a fair shake". LOL. [/i]

[b]me-So your mindset is, because some Muslims are doing bad things, the best thing to do is to try and misrepresent Islam? [/b]

[i]you-Muslims are representing Islam just fine by themselves.

And by the way, it's notable that you responded to "all over the world" with "some Muslims". THAT shows YOUR mindset. Denial ain't just a river... [/i]

(by the way, the River is "The Nile" )

blah blah blah you're angry blah blah blah

all the way down to

[i]you-First of all, I never said I objected to Islam being treated fairly. In fact, I made no comment at all (reference my previous note about your failure to comprehend the statements of others) about how Islam should be portrayed. I simply commented that Muslims portray Islam quite well on their own. Secondly, explanations are not owed to you. Your comment "I would like an explanation" is arrogant at best[/i].



Really now?
[i]
I never said I objected to Islam being treated fairly.[/i]

seems in conflict with

[i]That's hilarious. While Muslims are killing and oppressing in the name of Islam all over the world, [b]the rest of us are supposed to "give it a fair shake[/b]".[/i]





[quote]This is your usual MO with anything I write. I've said it before and I'll say it again: you don't engage in dialogue; you create arguments.[/quote]

Actually I do, with other people. Then again they don't make angry, absurd claims, argue about it for a page only to insist they never made such a claim and insist the other person needs help in "literary critique" to understand the true subtlety of their point without actualy just explaining what they meant.

[quote]I didn't bother reading the rest of your post past the sentence above. I'm frankly fed up with your confused, perplexed, and demanding commentary to everything I write at PhatMass.[/quote]


lol

[Hassan]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' post='1794275' date='Mar 1 2009, 12:39 PM']The man placed a great deal of importance on his marriage and family and looking respectable. Public loss of his wife, loss of face, loss of his children, loss of his business partner, loss of his possible business, being raised in a religion that says you are superior to a woman, and having a history of abusing the one closest to him would tick off rage. He punished the one who was causing it all - his wife, in a way his cultural background provided. Abusers typically don't get that they themselves are causing the problem. See what ya learn after 4 semesters of psych.[/quote]


I took AP Psych

I know things


But seriously thanks, I found that interesting.

[HisChildForever]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' post='1794275' date='Mar 1 2009, 11:39 AM']The man placed a great deal of importance on his marriage and family and looking respectable. Public loss of his wife, loss of face, loss of his children, loss of his business partner, loss of his possible business, being raised in a religion that says you are superior to a woman, and having a history of abusing the one closest to him would tick off rage. He punished the one who was causing it all - his wife, in a way his cultural background provided. [b]Abusers typically don't get that they themselves are causing the problem.[/b] See what ya learn after 4 semesters of psych.[/quote]

[b]This is extremely true.[/b]

I have to add that the abuser manipulates the abused to the point where the abused does not see him or herself as the victim, but as a person who [u]deserves[/u] to be beaten. It is also incredibly plausible that the man HAS abused his (now deceased) wife in the past, because one does not wake up one day and decide to decapitate their spouse, [i]especially[/i] since (as far as we know) there is no history of mental illness. He would have beat her chest, stomach, back, upper arms, and legs - places that clothing easily covers. And since he convinced her that she deserved the abuse (possibly using religion to justify it, or perhaps he simply has a conniving personality), she would not report it.

So the questions I now have are:
- Why did he and his first wife divorce?
- What was his childhood like: Was he physically or emotionally abused by his parents? older sibling(s)? authoritative figure, be it a teacher or religious? etc.

Also important to add - just because the man abused his wife (not solid fact but I would say there is a high, high chance) does not mean he is mentally ill.

[CatherineM]

I recall a case we looked at in law school where a man had beheaded his girl friend. He had actually choked her in rage, and to try to cover up the crime, he beheaded her. He thought the police would look for some kind of Manson type killer instead of him, and if they did look at him he could say that he must have been crazy to do something so bizarre.

These days I can't imagine someone just sitting still and allowing someone to cut their head off. She must have been unconscious, already dead, or subdued in some way. Most people also don't have things around the house that could do the job in one swath. You have to be pretty determined, and either out of if on drugs or something, or cold blooded in a way that I hope I never experience.

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='Hassan' post='1794298' date='Mar 1 2009, 01:38 PM']I took AP Psych

I know things


But seriously thanks, I found that interesting.[/quote]

I took basic, developmental, abnormal and one I can't remember the title, it amounted to 16 credits. When I was working we had to be rec-certed with 25 hours of classes a year, and we had the "how to deal with a potential suicide", "how to deal with abusers", how to deal with specific mental illlnesses" etc., in addition to CPR, first aid, advanced first aid, and drug administration.

[Madame Vengier]

[quote name='Hassan' post='1794281' date='Mar 1 2009, 01:12 PM'](by the way, the River is "The Nile" )[/quote]

You. Can't. Be. Serious.

[Hassan]

[quote name='Madame Vengier' post='1795227' date='Mar 2 2009, 02:55 PM']You. Can't. Be. Serious.[/quote]

Totally. You see I think you got it confused by thinking that the definite article "the" was part of the actual river name. If the English language just abolished articles all together like Russian none of these confusions arise.

In some dialects I think "the" is pronounced almost like "de" which can sort of bleed over into the proper name making "the Nile" come out like "de nile" which you must have sonfused with "denial" which is like a when you reject unpleasant truths. It's just a very odd confusion that you happened to get that river name, which was totally unrelated to anything we were arguing about, confused with a state of mind that you earlier confused me of having.

hope that clears everything up!

[Hassan]

actually you accused me of having it, you didn't confuse me of having it

[Madame Vengier]

[quote name='Hassan' post='1795386' date='Mar 2 2009, 06:57 PM']Totally. You see I think you got it confused by thinking that the definite article "the" was part of the actual river name. If the English language just abolished articles all together like Russian none of these confusions arise.

In some dialects I think "the" is pronounced almost like "de" which can sort of bleed over into the proper name making "the Nile" come out like "de nile" which you must have sonfused with "denial" which is like a when you reject unpleasant truths. It's just a very odd confusion that you happened to get that river name, which was totally unrelated to anything we were arguing about, confused with a state of mind that you earlier confused me of having.

hope that clears everything up!

[/quote]

Again, you can't be serious. If you are, I just feel really sorry for you, Hassan.

[Hassan]

[quote name='Madame Vengier' post='1796150' date='Mar 3 2009, 10:57 AM']Again, you can't be serious. If you are, I just feel really sorry for you, Hassan.[/quote]


Really?

Because I honestly don't know how to lay it on any thicker than that.