dairygirl4u2c Posted January 25, 2009 Share Posted January 25, 2009 so when in your opinions has satan appeared as an angel of light? the bible says that he would. and it said somehting to the effect that "the elect, if that were possible" would be deceived. if satan is said to be gonna do that etc, then we can assume he has, before, right? i'll put out there muhammed, maybe latter day saints (i think manmade), and some marian apparitions that don't have CC approval. what other ones? are there any marian ones that strikes you as satanic? do you agree with muhammed and the LDS thing? please give reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChildForever Posted January 25, 2009 Share Posted January 25, 2009 The scapular thread, and now this. What is really troubling you about Mary? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giolla Posted January 25, 2009 Share Posted January 25, 2009 [quote name='dairygirl4u2c' post='1760531' date='Jan 24 2009, 10:01 PM']so when in your opinions has satan appeared as an angel of light? the bible says that he would. and it said somehting to the effect that "the elect, if that were possible" would be deceived. if satan is said to be gonna do that etc, then we can assume he has, before, right? i'll put out there muhammed, maybe latter day saints (i think manmade), and some marian apparitions that don't have CC approval. what other ones? are there any marian ones that strikes you as satanic? do you agree with muhammed and the LDS thing? please give reasons.[/quote] Give examples and go in depth on what you are talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dairygirl4u2c Posted January 25, 2009 Author Share Posted January 25, 2009 [quote name='HisChildForever' post='1760570' date='Jan 24 2009, 10:17 PM']The scapular thread, and now this. What is really troubling you about Mary?[/quote] i have no beefs with mary or praying to her. i'm well versed in the apologetics of 'it's like asking your friend to pray for you' etc. and i agree with it. this thread is more separate from the scapular thread. it sprang from it though, cause i was thinking "there's got to be a devil as an angel of light situation before. no one ever talks about when he has etc. this could be an instance, cause i have some pretty valid points. but even if not here, theres got to be some instances where it's happened. wonder where' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dairygirl4u2c Posted January 25, 2009 Author Share Posted January 25, 2009 (edited) [quote name='Giolla' post='1760608' date='Jan 24 2009, 10:40 PM']Give examples and go in depth on what you are talking about.[/quote] im not sure what you want clarified. i do have a tendency of assuming people know premises i don't state. 2 Corinthians 11:14 "No wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light." In Luke, we read, "False christs and false prophets will appear and perform signs and miracles to deceive the elect — if that were possible." also, in, matthew 24 and mark 13 Edited January 25, 2009 by dairygirl4u2c Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Therese Posted January 25, 2009 Share Posted January 25, 2009 [quote name='dairygirl4u2c' post='1760645' date='Jan 24 2009, 10:06 PM']i have no beefs with mary or praying to her. i'm well versed in the apologetics of 'it's like asking your friend to pray for you' etc. and i agree with it. this thread is more separate from the scapular thread. it sprang from it though, cause i was thinking "there's got to be a devil as an angel of light situation before. no one ever talks about when he has etc. this could be an instance, cause i have some pretty valid points. but even if not here, theres got to be some instances where it's happened. wonder where'[/quote] Asking the Holy Virgin for her prayers is much more than "asking a friend to pray for you". She is the mother of God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatherineM Posted January 25, 2009 Share Posted January 25, 2009 And what good Jewish boy can turn down a request by his mother? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted January 25, 2009 Share Posted January 25, 2009 I've read stories of saints who experienced Satan appearing to them as an angel... was it Padré Pio? Or maybe I'm thinking of some of Fr. Amorth's stories. Anyway, my point: doesn't necessarily have to be spectacular... although the possibilities you mentioned seem to make some sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Therese Posted January 25, 2009 Share Posted January 25, 2009 The devil accomplishes much more through ordinary sinful people than through spectacular things like apparitions, except possibly in the case of Medjugoia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eagle_eye222001 Posted January 25, 2009 Share Posted January 25, 2009 Interesting thing to note about prayers... James 5:16 [i]16 So confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another to be cured; the heartfelt prayer of someone upright works very powerfully. [/i] Some prayers have more effect than others apparently. ---------------- Now playing: [url="http://www.foxytunes.com/artist/nickelback/track/another+hole+in+the+head"]Nickelback - Another Hole In The Head[/url] via [url="http://www.foxytunes.com/signatunes/"]FoxyTunes[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puellapaschalis Posted January 25, 2009 Share Posted January 25, 2009 I thought that Satan, before his sin, was the highest of the angels, and indeed the angel of light - hence an alternate name for him, Lucifer (which incidentally means "match" as in something you strike in order to make a fire in Dutch. Not that one makes a fire in Dutch, I meant the word...ok you get me). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galloglasses' Alt Posted January 25, 2009 Share Posted January 25, 2009 Read the story of Joan of the Cross, (I think thats what it was called, not to be confused with St.John of the cross), where a girl was receiving visions of Saints and, I think, the Virgin Mary as a child, but in reality it was Satan. (Who eventually revealed it as himself after he had built up her pride and ego to such an aweful degree), she did perform miracles and suchlike and many lay people priests and I think a Bishop saw her as a living Saint. Long story short she had to get an exorcism on her deathbed, (I'm not sure how successful it was), but the damage had been done, once the French Laity and Hierarchy discovered they were fooled by the devil there was a massive crisis of Faith in that part of France. I'm sorry I have no more contemporary examples to give you. (Actually, I think I should be glad I have no such examples to give you.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted January 25, 2009 Share Posted January 25, 2009 [quote name='puellapaschalis' post='1761124' date='Jan 25 2009, 07:37 AM']I thought that Satan, before his sin, was the highest of the angels, and indeed the angel of light - hence an alternate name for him, Lucifer (which incidentally means "match" as in something you strike in order to make a fire in Dutch. Not that one makes a fire in Dutch, I meant the word...ok you get me).[/quote] Once an angel always an angel. Satan still could be considered the "highest of the angels" in that he retains his position, since God will not reject his creatures, however he's now just a fallen angel. Interesting question I thought of a couple days ago... Have all the fallen angels already fallen? Or hypothetically is it possible for there to be further rebellion? Or do the angels exist with God outside of time, making this all a pointless question? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MithLuin Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 The 'outside of time' thing makes it moot, but angels are not eternal the way God is - they have a beginning, just as we do. However, the rebellion is over, and they are already confirmed as far as what side they are on goes. No switching sides now. Speaking of St. John of the Cross, his advice to confessors (if the penitent reported having visions or whatnot) was to tell the person to discount/ignore them. If they were from God, whatever good was going to come of them had already happened (during the vision), and if they were from a demon, best to ignore it. Lucifer means 'light-bearer' the same way Crucifer means 'cross bearer' or Thurifer means...incense-bearer? I guess? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selah Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 [quote]And what good Jewish boy can turn down a request by his mother?[/quote] That's right! He will not refuse Her Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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