Priesthood, Marriage, And Laicization

[MithLuin]

Of course. Men are ordained as transitional deacons during their time in seminary, but must continue with seminary before being ordained to the priesthood. This man I mentioned will be re-entering formation now that he is seeking to be ordained a priest.

[CatholicCid]

[quote name='cappie' post='1733077' date='Dec 21 2008, 07:39 AM']The Church regards it as a tragedy when a priest leaves the ministry but it recognizes that there are cases in which it is pastorally prudent to allow this to happen. As a result, the Church has a procedure known as laicization by which a priest can be returned to functioning in the Church as if he were a layman.

This means (among other things) that he can no longer celebrate the sacraments apart from emergency circumstances (e.g., hearing the confession of a dying man). There also are restrictions on the kind of public role he can play in parish life (the Chruch doesn't want such individuals to have too high a profile because of the confusion it can cause the faithful). Laicized priests may, however, be able to marry.

On the other hand, some priests simply abandon their ministry and do not pursue laicization. Some of these then attempt marriage in a civil ceremony, [b]which results in an invalid marriage because the sacrament of holy orders creates an impediment to marriage that must be dispensed if the marriage is to be valid[/b]. This applies even if the priest formally defects from the Church. The only way a priest can validly contract marriage is if he is laicized first.[/quote]

I'm confused at what the dispensation does exactly. What does it do so that removes the impediment of ordination?*

I am assuming that the reason ordination is an impediment to marriage is that the Priest is not free to marry due to the ordination.

Also, can a Priest who is formally laicized proceed to return to his ministry (with approval of the Bishop) after the passing of his wife?

*After re-reading your second post Father concerning laicization, I'm guessing that a majority of the issue is clerical celibacy, but considering that it is a discipline, it stills seems as it cannot be the sole issue that is addressed.

Edited December 23, 2008 by CatholicCid

[LouisvilleFan]

[quote name='CatherineM' post='1733851' date='Dec 22 2008, 01:30 PM']The bishop was making him take some classes. I don't think it was an upgrade on his part, I think the bishop was enforcing a bit of penance on him because he was making him jump through so many hoops he just about gave up, but he's got a parish up north now. He wasn't re-ordained, but I don't know if he'd been laicized or not. I never felt comfortable asking him.[/quote]

I'm sure he was getting a bit of a penance... especially for his own good, to make sure he's determined to be faithful to his vocation this time around But it's also true that, like any profession, the professional side of priesthood requires continual education. Any bishop with the means to do so requires his priests to receive some minimal amount of education every year. Plus, rubrics and emphasis in training change with time. A priest educated in the 70s most likely didn't receive as good training in homiletics as a seminarian today, so going back to seminary helps him "catch up" in that area.

[quote name='CatholicCid' post='1734252' date='Dec 23 2008, 02:30 AM']I'm confused at what the dispensation does exactly. What does it do so that removes the impediment of ordination?*[/quote]

The details are different in each case, depending on the relevant doctrine and discipline, but the bottom line is everything must be done in submission to the Church through our bishops and religious superiors. For example, if a permanent deacon decides he wants to re-marry, his desire for marriage must be lower than his desire to obey his bishop and his willingness to grant a dispensation.

Edited December 23, 2008 by LouisvilleFan

[CatholicCid]

[quote name='LouisvilleFan' post='1734294' date='Dec 23 2008, 09:30 AM']The details are different in each case, depending on the relevant doctrine and discipline, but the bottom line is everything must be done in submission to the Church through our bishops and religious superiors. For example, if a permanent deacon decides he wants to re-marry, his desire for marriage must be lower than his desire to obey his bishop and his willingness to grant a dispensation.[/quote]

How is it different... I can understand each case being handled differently depending on the circumstances, but that is not my question.

What is the dispensation dispensing that would prevent a valid marriage?

Edited December 23, 2008 by CatholicCid

[CatherineM]

Each situation is different because each man is different. We also have a former priest in our parish. He's elderly now, and does no ministry. He married a developmentally disabled woman 15-20 years his junior when her parents died. They eventually had 7 kids together. He was laicized and does receive communion.

Some priests fall in love with women they can not marry in the church. Laiciziation wouldn't matter to them. Some men leave the church entirely, not just the priesthood. When/if they return, there are lots of things to look at.

[LouisvilleFan]

[quote name='CatholicCid' post='1734429' date='Dec 23 2008, 04:09 PM']How is it different... I can understand each case being handled differently depending on the circumstances, but that is not my question.

What is the dispensation dispensing that would prevent a valid marriage?[/quote]

Oh, I see what you asking there. The Church can only dispense people from disciplinary regulations, and from promises and vows (diocesan priests make promises; religious priests take vows). When a priest is laicized, he is dispensed from his promises of poverty, celibacy, and obedience to his bishop. It's his promise of celibacy that is preventing him from entering a valid marriage, not the fact that he is ordained.

[CatholicCid]

Ok, yes, that was the brunt of my question. Much thanks.

Though, why can a permanent Deacon then not re-marry after his wife passes? Would it be common for one to petition such a thing?

I assumed the vow of celibacy was involved, but it seems odd that we can allow a married clerical state (permanent deacons, Eastern Catholic priests) if they are to marry beforehand, but not allow them to re-marry afterwards without quite a process. Any thoughts/reasons as to this?

[CatherineM]

I was thinking of a situation where a permanent deacon's wife died leaving him with several small children. I'd think the bishop would want him to remarry.

[cappie]

a priori impediments to the priesthood are divided into "irregularities", which are permanent unless removed by the competent authority and "simple impediments" which may pass with time without action of an ecclesiastical authority. Canon Law also lists various impediments to the exercise of a priesthood that has already been conferred. The bishop can remove most irregularities and simple impediments, except for those involving public apostasy, heresy, or schism; abortion or murder, even if in secret; and existing marriages. Irregularities that cannot be removed by the bishop can be removed by the Holy See.

Once someone is ordained in the Latin Rite of the Catholic Church they cannot contract a valid marriage.

A priest can return to the active ministry if after a period of discernment the bishop with the agreement of the Holy See. All previous marriages must be declared null, or the spouse must have died. In the case of a deceased spouse, most bishops require that the children be raised to adulthood before the man can undertake active ministry again.

[LouisvilleFan]

[quote name='CatholicCid' post='1734594' date='Dec 23 2008, 09:50 PM']Ok, yes, that was the brunt of my question. Much thanks.

Though, why can a permanent Deacon then not re-marry after his wife passes? Would it be common for one to petition such a thing?

I assumed the vow of celibacy was involved, but it seems odd that we can allow a married clerical state (permanent deacons, Eastern Catholic priests) if they are to marry beforehand, but not allow them to re-marry afterwards without quite a process. Any thoughts/reasons as to this?[/quote]

I think permanent deacons either promise chastity or only make the two promises of poverty and obedience. If you asked at Catholic Answers (I'm sure it's come up on their forums many times), you'd probably get a more official answer, but the discipline of sacrificing the option to re-marry has existed for deacons and priests in the Eastern Churches since well before the Schism. I believe it's simply a matter of ordained ministers being called to a greater fidelity to God and the Church. Remember what St. Paul says about married people being concerned about their spouse and family while the unmarried are free to concern themselves purely with serving the Lord. While he did write those words expecting a more immediate return of Christ, there is still truth in them.

Obviously it's not that marriage is "bad." It is a good and wonderful vocation. Ordination is an even greater and more wonderful vocation. Choosing either vocation involves some level of sacrifice in the other and the Church disciplines are simply reflecting that fact.

[quote name='cappie' post='1734616' date='Dec 23 2008, 11:23 PM']Once someone is ordained in the Latin Rite of the Catholic Church they cannot contract a valid marriage.[/quote]

That isn't true though, because a laicized deacon or priest is still ordained, but he is free to contract a valid marriage. It has to be the promise celibacy that is preventing valid marriage.

Edited December 24, 2008 by LouisvilleFan