Dark Night Of The Soul And Dryness Support Group

[tinytherese]

I'm still waiting for my parish priest to get back to me for guidance. I wrote what I said before.

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='Tinkerlina' post='1749350' date='Jan 12 2009, 02:55 AM']Yes that's true I'm trying my best not to lose faith, and I think I'm slowly making progress. Even though a lot of what I'm doing is "going through the motions" I think at least it's making myself do something rather than nothing-I could be doing much more, no doubt, and I'll keep trying. -Katie[/quote]
I think we all have time periods like that. I always keep in mind what C S Lewis said:
"Now that I am a Christian I do have moods in which the whole thing looks improbable: but when I was an atheist I had moods in which Christianity looked terribly probable." – Mere Christianity

Two quotes I keep in mind:
"I'm on Aslan's side even if there isn't any Aslan to lead it. I'm going to live as like a Narnian as I can even if there isn't any Narnia."
--The Silver Chair

"Relying on God has to begin all over again every day as if nothing had yet been done..."

[Tinkerlina]

[quote name='tinytherese' post='1764379' date='Jan 28 2009, 02:03 AM']I'm still waiting for my parish priest to get back to me for guidance. I wrote what I said before.[/quote]

Talking to a priest is a wonderful idea. I think I might talk to mine soon, too, though it's going to take working up some courage. Good for you. I'll keep praying for everyone here and ask for prayers for me! Thanks for sharing your story. -Katie

[tinytherese]

[quote name='tinytherese' post='1764379' date='Jan 28 2009, 01:03 AM']I'm still waiting for my parish priest to get back to me for guidance. I wrote what I said before.[/quote]

No response yet. He must be busy.

[AccountDeleted]

[quote name='tinytherese' post='1789898' date='Feb 23 2009, 09:14 PM']No response yet. He must be busy.[/quote]

If you are in a area where there are religious priests (ones who belong to a religious community rather than a Diocesan parish priest), I would advise trying to contact one of them. They usually have more time for spiritual direction than parish priests (although I have had a very good parish priest as a SD for abrief time). You might try looking up on your Diocesan web site for a list of religious fathers or brothers and call their monasteries to ask for help.

[AccountDeleted]

Before reading The Dark Night of the Soul by St John of the Cross, I would highly recommend to anyone to read The Ascent of Mt Carmel (and I like the Alison Peers translation). This deals with beginners, and covers the dark nights of the senses, and explains in a little more detail the difference between passive and active nights. the Dark night is often misunderstood, but rather than go into all that, let's deal with the fact of spiritual aridity or dryness.

St Teresa described a time in her life when going into choir for the hour of mental prayer was a great trial for her because of the dryness. She sometimes used a book to help her in the beginning but a lot of the time was simply endurance for her. She persevered and we know how God was able to use her.

Sometimes, when we love someone, we have to be the "givers" and not the "receivers". Look at the great love Christopher Reeve's wife had for him after his accident, caring for him physically and emotionally, when all he wanted to do was die. She loved him enough to be the giver for him, when he felt he had nothing to give to her.

Even if we are receiving nothing (or think we are not) from God, this is a time when we can demonstrate to Him, just how much we love Him and to express our appreciation for His love for us. At these times, we pray, not because it feels good for us, but because He deserves to be loved by us. St John of the Cross tells us to spend this time in silent adoration and contemplation. If we are fortunate enough to have an adoration chapel with Exposition, so much the better. But if not, we can just do as Jesus told us and go apart, shut the door and pray to Our Father in private. Using a repetitive vocal prayer, such as the Rosary can be very helpful but just sitting in quiet contemplation opens our heart to His presence.

One sister in Carmel told me that she felt as if she were in an abusive relationship with Jesus because of the pain she felt in prayer. She couldn't even talk to Him (she said), so she prayed to Our Lady to help her constantly. Now she has finally taken her solemn vows and wrote to tell me that she finally feels that she is a true Bride of Christ, and her heart is full of love for Him. There is a saying -- "this too shall pass", so we have to remember to persevere. Or as St Paul said in Second Timothy, Chapter 4...

[i]7 I have fought the good fight to the end; I have run the race to the finish; I have kept the faith;
8 all there is to come for me now is the crown of uprightness which the Lord, the upright judge, will give to me on that Day; and not only to me but to all those who have longed for his appearing [/i]

[tinytherese]

Anyone know of any good friaries to ask for spiritual direction from about this?

[eagle_eye222001]

[quote name='fidei defensor' post='1746904' date='Jan 9 2009, 01:14 AM']I had a dark night. I waited it out, but the sun never came back. So, I moved.[/quote]

Feel relieved by your decision?

[quote name='nunsense' post='1790506' date='Feb 24 2009, 04:09 PM']Before reading The Dark Night of the Soul by St John of the Cross, I would highly recommend to anyone to read The Ascent of Mt Carmel (and I like the Alison Peers translation). This deals with beginners, and covers the dark nights of the senses, and explains in a little more detail the difference between passive and active nights. the Dark night is often misunderstood, but rather than go into all that, let's deal with the fact of spiritual aridity or dryness.

St Teresa described a time in her life when going into choir for the hour of mental prayer was a great trial for her because of the dryness. She sometimes used a book to help her in the beginning but a lot of the time was simply endurance for her. She persevered and we know how God was able to use her.

Sometimes, when we love someone, we have to be the "givers" and not the "receivers". Look at the great love Christopher Reeve's wife had for him after his accident, caring for him physically and emotionally, when all he wanted to do was die. She loved him enough to be the giver for him, when he felt he had nothing to give to her.

Even if we are receiving nothing (or think we are not) from God, this is a time when we can demonstrate to Him, just how much we love Him and to express our appreciation for His love for us. At these times, we pray, not because it feels good for us, but because He deserves to be loved by us. St John of the Cross tells us to spend this time in silent adoration and contemplation. If we are fortunate enough to have an adoration chapel with Exposition, so much the better. But if not, we can just do as Jesus told us and go apart, shut the door and pray to Our Father in private. Using a repetitive vocal prayer, such as the Rosary can be very helpful but just sitting in quiet contemplation opens our heart to His presence.

One sister in Carmel told me that she felt as if she were in an abusive relationship with Jesus because of the pain she felt in prayer. She couldn't even talk to Him (she said), so she prayed to Our Lady to help her constantly. Now she has finally taken her solemn vows and wrote to tell me that she finally feels that she is a true Bride of Christ, and her heart is full of love for Him. There is a saying -- "this too shall pass", so we have to remember to persevere. Or as St Paul said in Second Timothy, Chapter 4...

[i]7 I have fought the good fight to the end; I have run the race to the finish; I have kept the faith;
8 all there is to come for me now is the crown of uprightness which the Lord, the upright judge, will give to me on that Day; and not only to me but to all those who have longed for his appearing [/i][/quote]

Great post. In addition to the spiritual side of our world, this is another aspect I find interesting.

----------------
Listening to: [url="http://www.foxytunes.com/artist/lifehouse/track/hanging+by+a+moment"]Lifehouse - Hanging By a Moment[/url]
via [url="http://www.foxytunes.com/signatunes/"]FoxyTunes[/url]

[AccountDeleted]

[quote name='tinytherese' post='1790547' date='Feb 24 2009, 02:55 PM']Anyone know of any good friaries to ask for spiritual direction from about this?[/quote]

depends on where you are located... where is Missouri and where in Iowa!

If you look up your Diocesan website, then look under religious communities in your Diocese, you could find one that way. Or contact the Vicar for Religious in your Diocese and ask for help to locate a SD.

[tinytherese]

[quote name='nunsense' post='1791163' date='Feb 25 2009, 01:22 AM']depends on where you are located... where is Missouri and where in Iowa!

If you look up your Diocesan website, then look under religious communities in your Diocese, you could find one that way. Or contact the Vicar for Religious in your Diocese and ask for help to locate a SD.[/quote]

In Iowa I'm in Cedar Rapids which is in the Archdiocese of Dubuque and in Missouri (though I won't be there much longer as I'm transfering to Benedictine College ) I'm in Nevada which is in the diocese of Kansas City and St. Joseph. (merged dioceses.)

Edited March 8, 2009 by tinytherese

[Guest Frances]

St Teresa of Avila is a great help on this topic of spiritual dryness. It is best to keep going and Faith becomes stronger when we dont rely on how we feel when praying...

its a desert experience

God bless you...

[AccountDeleted]

[quote name='Frances' post='1800366' date='Mar 8 2009, 05:25 AM']St Teresa of Avila is a great help on this topic of spiritual dryness. It is best to keep going and Faith becomes stronger when we dont rely on how we feel when praying...

its a desert experience

God bless you...[/quote]

This is an interesting topic. St Teresa and St John of the Cross being Carmelites are very keen on the desert analogy and see spiritual dryness as a necessity. Padre Pio, on the other hand, said that aridity can [u]also [/u]be a sign of our own self-centeredness...

[i]"Let us take care, then, to mortify our selfish spirit which puffs us up, makes us impulsive, and leads to aridity of soul."[/i]

and

[i]"Aridity is the fruit of our defects."[/i]

and he recommended prayer, fasting and vigils as a remedy for this...

[i]"We know that such practices as fasting, vigils, solitude and various other mortifications played an important part in Padre Pio's spiritual development at this time, strengthening him in virtue and liberating his spirit from all selfishness. "[/i]

So you are right - the answer is perseverance in prayer, along with mortifications and penance - and complete trust in the goodness of God.

[puellapaschalis]

When we have a period of dryness, how do we know if it's from God or whether it's caused by our own lack of sanctity?

[AccountDeleted]

[quote name='puellapaschalis' post='1800609' date='Mar 8 2009, 03:32 PM']When we have a period of dryness, how do we know if it's from God or whether it's caused by our own lack of sanctity?[/quote]

Personally, I don't think it matters what the cause is because the remedy is still the same - more prayer and penances and fasting - and absolute surrender to God's will!

Purification should lead to greater humility and an increase in virtue but since it also makes us even more aware of our own defects, we are hardly going to be sitting around saying to ourselves "Gee, I seem to be increasing in virtue these days!" lol This focus on self, of course, has the danger of leading to the sin of spiritual pride. St Teresa did say that God's graces were able to give her virtues that she herself could not have obtained, but her focus was not so much on herself but on God's goodness and grace. Self-absorption is a danger for beginners so St John of the Cross said about beginners...

[i]"Often they beseech God, with great yearnings, that He will take from them their imperfections and faults, but they do this that they may find themselves at peace, and may not be troubled by them, rather than for God’s sake; not realizing that, if He should take their imperfections from them, they would probably become prouder and more presumptuous still."[/i]

But then St John does go on to help discern where the aridity is coming from... (I have edited this for brevity)

[i]"BUT since these aridities might frequently proceed, not from the night and purgation of the sensual desires aforementioned, but from sins and imperfections, or from weakness and lukewarmness, or from some bad humour or indisposition of the body, I shall here set down certain signs by which it may be known if such aridity proceeds from the aforementioned purgation, or if it arises from any of the aforementioned sins. For the making of this distinction I find that there are three principal signs.

The first is whether, when a soul finds no pleasure or consolation in the things of God, it also
fails to find it in any thing created; for, as God sets the soul in this dark night to the end that He
may quench and purge its sensual desire, He allows it not to find attraction or sweetness in anything whatsoever. In such a case it may be considered very probable that this aridity and insipidity proceed not from recently committed sins or imperfections

The second sign whereby a man may believe himself to be experiencing the said purgation is
that the memory is ordinarily centred upon God, with painful care and solicitude, thinking that it
is not serving God, but is backsliding, because it finds itself without sweetness in the things of God. And in such a case it is evident that this lack of sweetness and this aridity come not from weakness and lukewarmness; for it is the nature of lukewarmness not to care greatly or to have any inward solicitude for the things of God. There is thus a great difference between aridity and lukewarmness, for lukewarmness consists in great weakness and remissness in the will and in the spirit, without solicitude as to serving God; whereas purgative aridity is ordinarily accompanied by solicitude, with care and grief as I say, because the soul is not serving God.

The third sign whereby this purgation of sense may be recognized is that the soul can no longer
meditate or reflect in the imaginative sphere of sense as it was wont, however much it may of itself endeavour to do so. For God now begins to communicate Himself to it, no longer through sense, as He did aforetime, by means of reflections which joined and sundered its knowledge, but by pure spirit, into which consecutive reflections enter not; but He communicates Himself to it by an act of simple contemplation, to which neither the exterior nor the interior senses of the lower part of the soul can attain. From this time forward, therefore, imagination and fancy can find no support in any meditation, and can gain no foothold by means thereof."[/i] (Dark Night of the Soul Chapter 8)

I guess it does come back to "by their fruits ye shall know them". If the aridity leads you closer to God, then it is good - if it doesn't then it might be either from the evil one or from sin. But hey, who said this was going to be easy?

[tinytherese]

I have been adjusting my prayer life. I spend at least a little time (or try to) be in quiet. Wow, it's been almost a full three years now. It's still been difficult, especially since I'm going through a hard family issue and it feels as if Our Lord doens't care that much about it and I need Him very much now, maybe now more than ever.