Animated Racism

[Galloglasses' Alt]

[quote name='rizz_loves_jesus' post='1654662' date='Sep 13 2008, 12:40 PM']There's neither racism nor sexism in Disney films.

The protagonist in [i]Mulan[/i] is an [b]Asian woman[/b].

Beast in [i]Beauty and the Beast[/i] learns to be peaceful and control his temper [b]instead of[/b] being violent (and, as someone pointed out, Gaston is the antagonist, so he shouldn't even be brought up.) The three silly girls are seen as dumb bimbos as opposed to Belle, who is intelligent and independent (but still falls in love with the Beast.)

Ariel in [i]The Little Mermaid[/i] is a strong-willed protagonist who saves the kingdom from Ursula.

As for the objectification of women, you'll notice in [i]Aladdin[/i] that it's the antagonist Jafar who objectifies Jasmine by dressing her up in a skimpy little outfit and making her his palace slave. Aladdin is nothing but respectful toward her.

I'm sorry, but I found both of those videos incredibly ridiculous. I was raised on Disney, and I've never gotten the message to be subservient to men or that I'm in any way lower than them (quite the opposite, actually.) My boyfriend watched a lot of Disney too, and I know he would never objectify me and that he respects me (and the same for me to him.) I think aalpha hit the nail on the head in regards to racism in Disney cartoons.

To sum it up, I think this is just another whiny PC statement meant solely for PC people to have something else to complain about.[/quote]

iawtp

For the record, I was a young boy raised on disney movies and cartoons. I didn't turn out chuvanist! But I am virulently anti-feminist, [b][i]feminist[/i][/b], not Feminine. But that stems from a plethora of veiws and influences I got asides from disney.

For the record, Barbie Dolls are a worse influence on Little girls, then Disney is on boys respectively. =/

[dustthouart]

I don't think we want to be too extreme. There is NOTHING racist or sexist in old Disney films? [i]Really?[/i]

Ironically I just reread the book [i]Black Like Me[/i] today... take the Dumbo example of the "happy hearted roustabouts." How can you not see the racism there? That image of black people as content in ignorance was one of the most powerful racist arguments for keeping black people uneducated and in menial labor.

That said, do I think there was [i]malice[/i] in these Disney depictions? No. But to say there is no racism, no exoticism, no patronizing attitude or sense of superiority, at ALL... I don't see how you can possibly argue that.

RE: the Asian stereotypes. What makes the Siamese song problematic is that it exemplifies the "inscrutable Oriental" stereotype. The unspoken message is that Asians do not operate on the same rules of logic as "normal" people. As for the defense that the Siamese is a real breed of cat, obviously you have never met an actual Siamese cat. Siamese cats are known for being very doglike, super friendly, and some even fetch. Also, note the "slanty" eyes of the cats.

I can understand the impulse to oppose political correctness wherever you encounter it, but it's dangerous to think that anything that liberals oppose must be good.

(The sexism video, on the other hand, is dumb, drawing mostly on Gaston as it does. I would disregard its specific points, but I would not claim that there has been no sexism in Disney films ever.)

[Socrates]

[quote name='Lil Red' post='1653888' date='Sep 12 2008, 11:30 AM']+J.M.J.+
[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LibK0SCpIkk"]Racism in Disney[/url]
[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gg2T_t2UtlU"]Disney and how they portray racism through sound[/url]

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CWMCt35oFY"]Sexism, Strength and Dominance[/url] - this video makes the case about what boys who watch Disney movies grow up to view women like. not sure i agree though.

So what do you think?[/quote]
This stupid load of politically-correct liberal pansydom is almost beyond parody, especially the last one (on "sexism").

And personally, if I had kids I'd rather them watch the old un-pc classic cartoons, than the modern post-Michael Eisner flicks, which are often politically-correct sermons for the kiddies dressed up in song-and-dance.

Were there some racial stereotypes in old Disney cartoons? A little, but the same could be found (and often much more blatantly) in pretty much [i]all[/i] entertainment of the period. Acting as if Disney was up to something sinister is ridiculous. To be consistent, we'd have to censor all movies from prior to 1960 or when have you.

Most of the examples of "racism" I do not think are particularly offensive; most of them were cases of pc looking for things to get "offended" at. Disney cartoons are full of goofy, ridiculous comic characters, yet no one gets "offended" unless they are perceived to be non-white. (Speaking of goofy, Goofy, judging by his voice and skin complexion, appears to be white. Does this popular kids character perpetuate the stereotype that white people are all bumbling buck-toothed idiots?)
And if that pistolero rooster guy smears Latinos as violent, what do these people say about Yosemite Sam?
(And is the ridiculous, squawking lily-white Donald Duck racist against whites, or just against ducks?)
I also thought it was funny how that vid turned around and complained that those dancing Brazilians were all white, while no doubt if they were black or whatever, they'd complain about the scene perpetuating some racist stereotype or another (like how blacks are good dancers).
The shaggy-haired dancing monkeys in [i]The Jungle Book[/i] didn't even look "black" and were voiced by white actors, so I don't see why that was even seen as racist (unless you're so racist as to equate dancing monkeys with black people!)
And, as others have pointed out, it's silly to complain about having villains of a certain race/ethnicity in movies where the heroes and all the other characters are also of the same said ethnicity (Aladin, Mulan)
And the offending centaur scenes from [i]Fantasia[/i] have been cut from all modern releases of the film, so I don't see the point in digging them back up.

The "sexism" video almost needs no comment. You want to tell the oh-so-sentivitive-and-pc (male) narrator to grow a pair and get a frickin' life! "Most Disney movies revolve around a heterosexual relationship between a hero and a heroine"! Hercules has muscles! Male heroes and villains fight!The horror! Apparently the kiddies would be better off if they were all watching animated equivalents of [i]Brokeback Mountain[/i] (which unfortunately, given certain "educational" trends, doesn't seem so far-fetched now.
The sexist pig Gaston was, of course, the villain of that movie, which actually had a not politically incorrect message about girls being smart and standing up for themselves. And while I didn't see it, I remember Mulan being criticized for promoting a feminist message.

I'm sorry, but the pathetic liberal pc pansies who make and promote such videos need to stop whining and seeking out "racism" "sexism" and "heterosexism" in everything, and get a life!
Sheesh!

This entire thread belongs on the Lame Board.

Edited September 16, 2008 by Socrates

[Socrates]

[quote name='homeschoolmom' post='1653911' date='Sep 12 2008, 11:56 AM']It is not uncommon in american movies to have the villain have a British accent-- even if he's not British. Sorry.. that's not just disney.[/quote]
That's actually a venerable old tradition. I heard in some feature on an animated DC comics video that in the old days, playing the villain was regarded as a coveted role to gain respect in the British theatre, so British actors would often actually seek out villain roles in hollywood films. With time, the British accent itself became associated with movie villainy.

Nothing to do with "racism" as that silly video charges (and aren't the Brits white?)

[Lil Red]

+J.M.J.+
[quote name='dustthouart' post='1656221' date='Sep 15 2008, 05:16 PM']I don't think we want to be too extreme. There is NOTHING racist or sexist in old Disney films? [i]Really?[/i]

Ironically I just reread the book [i]Black Like Me[/i] today... take the Dumbo example of the "happy hearted roustabouts." How can you not see the racism there? That image of black people as content in ignorance was one of the most powerful racist arguments for keeping black people uneducated and in menial labor.

That said, do I think there was [i]malice[/i] in these Disney depictions? No. But to say there is no racism, no exoticism, no patronizing attitude or sense of superiority, at ALL... I don't see how you can possibly argue that.

RE: the Asian stereotypes. What makes the Siamese song problematic is that it exemplifies the "inscrutable Oriental" stereotype. The unspoken message is that Asians do not operate on the same rules of logic as "normal" people. As for the defense that the Siamese is a real breed of cat, obviously you have never met an actual Siamese cat. Siamese cats are known for being very doglike, super friendly, and some even fetch. Also, note the "slanty" eyes of the cats.

I can understand the impulse to oppose political correctness wherever you encounter it, but it's dangerous to think that anything that liberals oppose must be good.

(The sexism video, on the other hand, is dumb, drawing mostly on Gaston as it does. I would disregard its specific points, but I would not claim that there has been no sexism in Disney films ever.)[/quote]
interesting points, thanks.

[Didacus]

Did anyone watch the 'gay moments' of the Lion king?
What's that about?

[homeschoolmom]

[quote name='Didacus' post='1656616' date='Sep 16 2008, 08:47 AM']Did anyone watch the 'gay moments' of the Lion king?
What's that about?[/quote]
I did not and I don't want to know.


Another interesting topic on the subject of Disney would be: Does Disney sanitize its fairy tales so as to remove their originally intended meaning? For example, in Hans Christian Anderson's The Little Mermaid, the mermaid disobeys her father (as does the Disney mermaid), but in the end, she walks into the sea and her body turns to seafoam because she was disobedient. In the Disney version, of course, she disobeys (because she just has to meet that boy!) and in the end ends up married to him. Sorta tells kids that it's okay to disobey if you KNOW that you are right. Don't listen to those cranky parents!

Discuss

[StColette]

[quote name='homeschoolmom' post='1656675' date='Sep 16 2008, 11:05 AM']I did not and I don't want to know.


Another interesting topic on the subject of Disney would be: Does Disney sanitize its fairy tales so as to remove their originally intended meaning? For example, in Hans Christian Anderson's The Little Mermaid, the mermaid disobeys her father (as does the Disney mermaid), but in the end, she walks into the sea and her body turns to seafoam because she was disobedient. In the Disney version, of course, she disobeys (because she just has to meet that boy!) and in the end ends up married to him. Sorta tells kids that it's okay to disobey if you KNOW that you are right. Don't listen to those cranky parents!

Discuss [/quote]

I don't believe the Disney version of the Little Mermaid tells children to go out and disobey their parents and they will be rewarded in the end. I mean, the Little Mermaid had to watch her father suffer for her sake when things did not turn out like she thought they would, the boy didn't kiss her in time. Her father signed over his own life to the Sea Witch in order to save his daughter. A great sacrifice of love from a parent and the movie makes it pretty evident that she felt horrible for this happening, ie she comes to his defense. In the end, out of the father's great love for his daughter he rewards her with her wish to be human. I mean the same can be said for us. We disobey Our Father, we feel sorry for what we did and seek forgiveness, and hopefully in the end we will be rewarded with eternal life.

[homeschoolmom]

hehe... I had not remembered that. (I don't think I've seen it since it was released!) That's a good point then. Disobedience does have consequences... just not necessarily turning one into sea foam. (I would have loved that ending, btw-- so unDisney.)

[desertwoman]

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIP4WY8FhUk"]Coal Black[/url]

[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSYAY1nv6tg&feature=related"]More stuff[/url]

I remember all of these growing up.

[Didacus]

Anyone familiar with 'Ash Puddle'? She was the first 'Cinderella'.

Her evil step sisters got their eyes plucked by crows after cutting off their heels. I think AshPuddles' story would be far more interesting than Cinderella - I make it a point of telling my kids the REAL Cinderella story every now and again.

[Azriel]

You ever get the idea that too many people have too much time on their hands? Why go looking for evil, when its so blatantly other places. Go fight the good fight, and teach your kids right from wrong then you won't have to worry about what Disney is putting out.

and my 2 pennies, I'm very happy not only that Bean loves the Disney Princesses, as they are most all certainly strong women, but I'm really not even all that upset that she like Hannah Montana either.

[Balthazor]

Hey I can not say anything about the sexism thing..... I mean one of my favorite series is the Wild Wild West.....



Oh James!