John Kerry

[Iacobus]

I must say though, the Republican Party has had some bad things in its past and isn't all that good today. Halliburton, WMD.

[M.SIGGA]

[quote name='Iacobus' date='Mar 4 2004, 10:36 PM'] I must say though, the Republican Party has had some bad things in its past and isn't all that good today. Halliburton, WMD. [/quote]
you're talkin' blasphemy here :ph34r: lol.

[Ash Wednesday]

I thought it was a mortal sin to vote for a candidate that was pro-choice. Unless both were, and in that case one could vote to limit the evil.

Can someone verify that?

I respect pro-life and morally sound Democrats, it's just that there are so very few.
P.S. Ironmonk, you left out stem cell research and cloning!

I'm not keen on either party, btw.

[littleflower+JMJ]

[quote name='Ash Wednesday' date='Mar 5 2004, 12:29 AM'] I thought it was a mortal sin to vote for a candidate that was pro-choice. Unless both were, and in that case one could vote to limit the evil.

Can someone verify that?

I respect pro-life and morally sound Democrats, it's just that there are so very few.
P.S. Ironmonk, you left out stem cell research and cloning!

I'm not keen on either party, btw.  [/quote]
Yes it is a sin to vote for a pro-choice candiate. you are helping and supporting abortion by if you do so.

anyone who does is taking part too in the grave sin.

thats why anyone who is afflicated with abortion can get excommunicated.

[littleflower+JMJ]

also the courts can't change it, untill they get pro-life ppl in, which the democrats keep kicking them out.

if there is no pro-life peeps in the courts to overturn our chances are slim.

the democrats have done a fantastic job keeping anyone pro-life out.

clearly one can see what they will be promoting if they win.

lacubos, i really consider you to think about what yoru saying. abortion is the greatest destroyer of peace. if we do not vote to end it, we are only keeping it. and until abortion is stopped then we [b]cannot[/b] expect life to be recognized at any other stage if we as a country fail to recognize LIFE at its earliest stage.

God bless,
flowery
+JMJ

[frozencell]

I definitely side with the Republican party because so many issues with the Democrats just plain don't make ANY sense. Abortion is not right under any circumstances and voting for a candidate who thinks it should be legal everywhere is not a godly thing to do. And the idea that I would be forced to pay for someone to have an abortion in a DIFFERENT COUNTRY really burns me up! I don't like being forced to support a lot of things in THIS country, why would I support these things in some other one?!?!

Also, why is it such a concern that countless millions MIGHT die from nuclear war and not such a big deal (in comparision) that the same number ACTUALLY die everyday in the name of convenience and privacy. It's amazing how some people can be so much more concerned with the lives of people who have already been born than those who haven't even had the chance yet. When treaties and diplomatic problems become the fore-running issue over life and death legislation it's time to re-evaluate some priorities. Remember that a key character trait in a lot of saints of the Church was selflessness and giving. Many saints put themselves in harm's way to save those who were innocent and being discriminated against. Saint Maximillian gave his life for another in a Nazi prison camp. I'll suffer through some more of this world if it means that there is the chance of bringing into this world someone with the potential to become a mighty force for God in this country and world.

There are some things that I feel that Bush could be better or more solid on and things that I don't agree with the Republican party, but these are so menial compared to the problems with Kerry and other liberals that it's never enough to sway my vote. I am in the Air Force and it is so surprising to me how many people are against this war. Everyone I work with supports it. Everyone I work with volunteers to go overseas. Very few people that I have met in the military think it's wrong, and even less are vehement about it. It's amazing how so many more people who have no idea how the military life is or never have to be in the "hot seat" for deployment get so vehemently opposed to the war. The fact that the military personnel, for the most part, are so for this war should go a long way to show those civilians that Bush has to be doing something right.

We must weigh the "evils" of both sides and pick the lesser, and right now it seems that Bush has the MUCH lesser evil going for him.

Edited March 5, 2004 by frozencell

[marielapin]

[quote name='frozencell' date='Mar 5 2004, 10:10 AM'] I definitely side with the Republican party because so many issues with the Democrats just plain don't make ANY sense. Abortion is not right under any circumstances and voting for a candidate who thinks it should be legal everywhere is not a godly thing to do. And the idea that I would be forced to pay for someone to have an abortion in a DIFFERENT COUNTRY really burns me up! I don't like being forced to support a lot of things in THIS country, why would I support these things in some other one?!?!

Also, why is it such a concern that countless millions MIGHT die from nuclear war and not such a big deal (in comparision) that the same number ACTUALLY die everyday in the name of convenience and privacy. It's amazing how some people can be so much more concerned with the lives of people who have already been born than those who haven't even had the chance yet. When treaties and diplomatic problems become the fore-running issue over life and death legislation it's time to re-evaluate some priorities. Remember that a key character trait in a lot of saints of the Church was selflessness and giving. Many saints put themselves in harm's way to save those who were innocent and being discriminated against. Saint Maximillian gave his life for another in a Nazi prison camp. I'll suffer through some more of this world if it means that there is the chance of bringing into this world someone with the potential to become a mighty force for God in this country and world.

There are some things that I feel that Bush could be better or more solid on and things that I don't agree with the Republican party, but these are so menial compared to the problems with Kerry and other liberals that it's never enough to sway my vote. I am in the Air Force and it is so surprising to me how many people are against this war. Everyone I work with supports it. Everyone I work with volunteers to go overseas. Very few people that I have met in the military think it's wrong, and even less are vehement about it. It's amazing how so many more people who have no idea how the military life is or never have to be in the "hot seat" for deployment get so vehemently opposed to the war. The fact that the military personnel, for the most part, are so for this war should go a long way to show those civilians that Bush has to be doing something right.

We must weigh the "evils" of both sides and pick the lesser, and right now it seems that Bush has the MUCH lesser evil going for him. [/quote]
DITTO.

Everyone I know supports this war too. I met an Army guy a few weeks ago who was here on two week vacation from Iraq and he could not believe what lies were being spread back here by the liberal media - misrepresenting the truth of the good that is being done there everyday by people like him.

[frozencell]

[quote name='marielapin' date='Mar 5 2004, 10:47 AM'] DITTO.

Everyone I know supports this war too. I met an Army guy a few weeks ago who was here on two week vacation from Iraq and he could not believe what lies were being spread back here by the liberal media - misrepresenting the truth of the good that is being done there everyday by people like him. [/quote]
Thank you for that. I can't help but think that if we had a Democratic president right now and in this situation (completely hypothetical!) the media would be lauding him for his good judgment and praising the effort and pushing nothing but the upside.

[marielapin]

[quote name='frozencell' date='Mar 5 2004, 10:53 AM'] Thank you for that. I can't help but think that if we had a Democratic president right now and in this situation (completely hypothetical!) the media would be lauding him for his good judgment and praising the effort and pushing nothing but the upside. [/quote]
You notice the same people who are bashing Bush for his policies on this war didn't say anything when Clinton sent troops to Kosovo.

The fact that Kerry voted in support of these wars and is now trying to use them against Bush is the biggest bunch of bull carp I've ever heard. Any man who comes back from a war, throws his (they really weren't his) war medals over the fence and then years later proudly displays them in his office is very low in my estimation.

[Kilroy the Ninja]

hmmm

John Kerry.

Yeah, whatever.

You know, I was alive when he came back from Vietnam but I wasn't keeping up with the news at the time.

But my mother-in-law was.

And she remembers John Kerry getting up and denouncing the war he had just come back from. And that's all fine and good if not terribly patriotic.

But she also remembers him admitting to the slaughter of entire Vietnamese villages, men, women, children - and not necessarily on the orders of anyone in particular. Now, before ya'll liberals go jumpin' off the deep end, I'll do a little more research on that. But let me tell you this first. My mother-in-law is one of the only people I know that would probably be considered a saint if she were to die today. She has been a highly respected and loved Catholic school teacher for the last 26 years. I doubt she'd be making this up. Or mis-remembering.

funny how you don't hear about that in the evening news.

[M.SIGGA]

[quote name='marielapin' date='Mar 5 2004, 09:59 AM'] You notice the same people who are bashing Bush for his policies on this war didn't say anything when Clinton sent troops to Kosovo.

The fact that Kerry voted in support of these wars and is now trying to use them against Bush is the biggest bunch of bull carp I've ever heard. Any man who comes back from a war, throws his (they really weren't his) war medals over the fence and then years later proudly displays them in his office is very low in my estimation. [/quote]
maybe global support and U.N. approval and 100% factual just cause (not disappearing WMDs) had something to do with it...

[marielapin]

[quote name='M.SIGGA' date='Mar 5 2004, 12:17 PM'] maybe global support and U.N. approval and 100% factual just cause (not disappearing WMDs) had something to do with it... [/quote]
I'm assuming you mean the first part of my comment.

But if one feels that the United Nations should have full control over the movement of our troops, then Kerry is the person to vote for.

This whole disappearing WMDs thing is really getting old. There are several options as to why they are not there:

1-we bombed them to kingdom come
2-they were moved to other countries before the war began

I for one would like to wait a little bit longer before assuming they did not exist. After all, even Kerry believed they were there before the war started.

[marielapin]

[quote name='Kilroy the Ninja' date='Mar 5 2004, 11:32 AM'] hmmm

John Kerry.

Yeah, whatever.

You know, I was alive when he came back from Vietnam but I wasn't keeping up with the news at the time.

But my mother-in-law was.

And she remembers John Kerry getting up and denouncing the war he had just come back from. And that's all fine and good if not terribly patriotic.

But she also remembers him admitting to the slaughter of entire Vietnamese villages, men, women, children - and not necessarily on the orders of anyone in particular. Now, before ya'll liberals go jumpin' off the deep end, I'll do a little more research on that. But let me tell you this first. My mother-in-law is one of the only people I know that would probably be considered a saint if she were to die today. She has been a highly respected and loved Catholic school teacher for the last 26 years. I doubt she'd be making this up. Or mis-remembering.

funny how you don't hear about that in the evening news. [/quote]
[They - soldiers during the Vietnam war] personally raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, taped wires from portable telephones to human genitals and turned up the power, cut off limbs, [blew] up bodies, randomly shot at civilians, razed villages in fashion reminiscent of Ghengis Khan, shot cattle and dogs for fun, poisoned food stocks, and generally ravaged the countryside of South Vietnam ... (John Kerry, April 23, 1971)

Nothing – not politics, not time, not outcome – nothing will ever diminish one iota the contributions of these brothers and sisters, nothing can ever lessen the courage with which they waged war. Nothing reduces the magnitude of their sacrifice, nothing can take away the quality of their gift to their nation. (John Kerry, June 11, 2002)

whatever.

[Iacobus]

About the Veitnam issue. Kerry was testifing about the Mila (misspelled) Massacare along with MANY other returning vets. Vietnam was not a good time in our past.

When in went into Kosovo it was with NATO support (it wasn't just the US and the UK going in) and also the Kosovo conflict NEVER had us insert ground troops.

I am also concerned about handing over control of Iraq in June. With the attacks that occured on Wed can they really be capable of self-rule and self-policing this ealiar.

The few people I know who came back from Iraq had every negtive views on what was happening. The one I have seen the most came home early becasue of a blockage in his aotate (misspelled). He was sent over to Kuwait a year ago last month. He is a reseverist medic. His unit was sent in and took a postion in the Sunny Triangle. They were shelled every nite by atleast 3 rounds. The ROE prohibited them from returning fire. His unit will still be there until at least July 04. And these are not active duty troops but reseverist meant to hold up the army till it can hold its own or respond to issues in the US.

What I am saying is that we need to end abortion but we also need to make the world a safer place for the children and we need to do it at the same time. Right now neither party seems too intreseted in doing that.

[marielapin]

[quote name='Iacobus' date='Mar 5 2004, 12:48 PM'] What I am saying is that we need to end abortion but we also need to make the world a safer place for the children and we need to do it at the same time. Right now neither party seems too intreseted in doing that. [/quote]
This is true. I don't think anyone here would argue that, no matter what their political affiliation is.

But the only way I can see of qualifying which is more important is by numbers.

And abortion wins out on numbers.