Hate To Say It..

[ICTHUS]

[quote name='dairygirl4u2c' date='Mar 4 2004, 09:20 AM'] I am coming from the stance that the baby in its early days may or may not have a soul and therefore we shouldn't impose our view to save it simply for the benefit of the doubt or for its own inherent worth even though personally I would myself be obliged to for these reasons. [/quote]


Most of the Protestants I know would vehemently disagree...you must be a liberal.

[Rebirth flame]

[quote name='photosynthesis' date='Mar 6 2004, 03:13 AM'] At conception, the embroyo or fetus belongs to God, not the mother. Therefore, it is our duty as Christians to protect this new life, because it is not our right to decide what its future should be. [/quote]
i agree completely.

dairygirl, i believe this debate can be taken outside of religion as well.

There was a scientist, Francesco Redi, who proved that life could not spontaneously generate. that means that babies do not just magically appear, as you know. that also means that the gift of life does not just spontaneously appear. A child is created from two living humans. it can grow, think, feel, and experience everything it's mother feels while inside her womb.

Murder is defined as "To put an end to; destroy; The unlawful killing of one human by another, especially with premeditated malice." i don't know about you, but i don't think there is anything else as premeditated as abortion.

abortion is defined as "Any of various procedures that result in such [b][i]termination[/i][/b] and expulsion."

If abortion isn't murder, the taking of someone's life, what is there to terminate??? abortion, then, is putting an end to the childs gift to grow, learn, and experience every grace this world has to offer. In this sence, also, abortion can then be looked at as murder, because it does not give a living child the ability to develop. it puts an end to the childs development, and destroys the sanctity of life and our sexuality.

therefor, to apply logical reasoning:

if life [b][i]does[/i][/b] not spontaneously generate,
then the child in the womb is alive,
therefor abortion would be taking away the right of the child to be able to develope, and would be constituted as murder.

but why, then, is it not punishable as murder?
because that would mean that our government would have to admit that it was wrong.

on top of that, the Church recognizes it as a grave sin to take the life of anyone (unless in self-defence, which doesn't even apply to abortion) especially someone as innocent as a child in the womb.

Pax Christi
Rebirth

[Rebirth flame]

here are a bunch of quotes from the catechism pertaining to abortion;
just thought i'd post these for more common knowledge...

[quote]2271 Since the first century the Church has affirmed the moral evil of every procured abortion. This teaching has not changed and remains unchangeable. Direct abortion, that is to say, abortion willed either as an end or a means, is gravely contrary to the moral law:

You shall not kill the embryo by abortion and shall not cause the newborn to perish.

God, the Lord of life, has entrusted to men the noble mission of safeguarding life, and men must carry it out in a manner worthy of themselves. Life must be protected with the utmost care from the moment of conception: abortion and infanticide are abominable crimes. [/quote]
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[quote]2272 Formal cooperation in an abortion constitutes a grave offense. The Church attaches the canonical penalty of excommunication to this crime against human life. "A person who procures a completed abortion incurs excommunication latae sententiae," "by the very commission of the offense," and subject to the conditions provided by Canon Law. The Church does not thereby intend to restrict the scope of mercy. Rather, she makes clear the gravity of the crime committed, the irreparable harm done to the innocent who is put to death, as well as to the parents and the whole of society.[/quote]
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[quote]2322 From its conception, the child has the right to life. Direct abortion, that is, abortion willed as an end or as a means, is a "criminal" practice (GS 27 § 3), gravely contrary to the moral law. The Church imposes the canonical penalty of excommunication for this crime against human life.[/quote]
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[quote]2274 Since it must be treated from conception as a person, the embryo must be defended in its integrity, cared for, and healed, as far as possible, like any other human being.

Prenatal diagnosis is morally licit, "if it respects the life and integrity of the embryo and the human fetus and is directed toward its safe guarding or healing as an individual. . . . It is gravely opposed to the moral law when this is done with the thought of possibly inducing an abortion, depending upon the results: a diagnosis must not be the equivalent of a death sentence."[/quote]
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pretty self explanatory quotes...