Triumphalism

[Resurrexi]

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[Justin86]

While I think the return of triumphalism would ultimately be a good thing as in my view it reflects the authority the Vicar of Christ has on earth, it also came from a time in which the Holy Father had much more political power than he needed. This lead to incredibly corrupt Popes, and quite possibly one of the most dysfunctional governments in history.

Basically, I would like to see the gestures come back, but the secular world should be allowed to keep it's temporal power.

[nowak.chris]

There is a debate going on in another forum over this (well the tiara specifically). I think that there is nothing wrong with triumphal gestures, except that they can easily be carried too far. I do not think a return to the full regalia/ ceremonials from before the Council is prudent (or desirable), however the return of some elements all the time and others for highly historical moments (the tiara for the coronation) would do well to strengthen Catholic identity.

[aalpha1989]

I think that in time it would dramatically increase respect for the pope among the faithful, but I am not sure that ALL of the aforementioned things should return, and therefore gave a null vote.

[Theosopher]

I am all in favour of it. I believe that these things add a spirit of transcendence to church, which we need in these times. I am of the school that still kneels to kiss the Bishop's ring (which greatly startled at least one liberal bishop I met), begin my addresses in the presence of a Priest to "May it please Your Reverence," etc.

In fact there is a funny story about this.. A few years ago I approached the Archbishop after Mass to ask him to bless an object. He extended his hand for me to shake it, and I turned it and began to kneel to kiss the episcopal ring. Apparently he was not expecting me to kneel, because when he realized I was going to kiss his ring, he began to raise his hand to meet my mouth, just as I was descending to kneel. In other words, *POW*

[fides quarens intellectum]

Sweet! i stand alone!! i didn't like the wording of the choices, but i went with it being "bad," only because i personally don't find it appropriate within an early 21st century cultural context.

The height of papal triumphalism, as you are calling it, coincided with the height of regal pomp/etc in Europe (and to some extent, North America). Today, though, things are a wee bit different - for example, how many people do you know who still wear ornately decorated ribbons and medals on their suits, as markers of what organizations/societies they belong to? My point is, Amer-European culture has greatly changed in the past 100 years, leaving much of the high ceremonialism, and subsequent symbolism, behind.

i personally just don't see what the benefit would be, especially to those watching the Church from the outside (they just wouldn't get it). Just my opinion, though - if Papa decides to start wearing a tiara, well, you won't hear any complaints from me.

[Deb]

I think we should be able to kiss a priests hands without fear of being locked up in an insane asylum.