Evolution

[Vincent Vega]

Hey everyone,
I've heard varying viewpoints, and I'd like to hear your views.
Do you think evolution is compatible with the Church's teachings? Why or why not?
PAX,
Mitch

[Farsight one]

My approach is probably different from everyone else's here.

Ok. I know two things.

1. Church teaching is right. If it were ever found to be wrong, then we would have to conclude that Catholicism is false - not something I'm willing to do.
2. Evolution happens. It is directly observable in several species and reproducible in a lab. Even humans have evolved in the last 1000 years. (and yes, even mAcro evoltuion is observable)

Since evolution is fact(and theory), Church teachings cannot call it false, lest the Church itself be false. Therefore, Church teaching MUST be compatible with evolution.

[dairygirl4u2c]

links for things on traisitional fossils

[url="http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-transitional/part2a.html"]http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-transitional/part2a.html[/url]

[url="http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/homs/d2700.html"]http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/homs/d2700.html[/url]

[url="http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/homs/"]http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/homs/[/url]

[url="http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/homs/"]http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/homs/[/url]

[url="http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/id/program.html#ch05"]http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/id/program.html#ch05[/url]

[url="http://news.softpedia.com/news/Top-10-Exti...ans-62131.shtml"]http://news.softpedia.com/news/Top-10-Exti...ans-62131.shtml[/url]

[dairygirl4u2c]

[url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homo_%28genus%29"]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homo_%28genus%29[/url]

[Vincent Vega]

[quote name='Farsight one' post='1615494' date='Aug 1 2008, 08:37 PM']Since evolution is fact(and theory), Church teachings cannot call it false, lest the Church itself be false. Therefore, Church teaching MUST be compatible with evolution.[/quote]
Interesting approach...
So, I take it that you're of the persuasion that, no, we didn't all morph from primordial ooze, but yes, evolution by way of say, natural selection, has indeed occur, and continues to occur?

[TeresaBenedicta]

I don't really think it matters much, either way. I am of the belief that micro-evolution is scientifically proven, so I say it's true and in line with the Church.

As for macro-evolution?

I don't know. I haven't been convinced of its truth. Nor do I care. If humans did evolve from chimps, it doesn't have any impact on my belief in God. Because there still had to be a point in which the soul was infused into the animal, making us human.

So, in a sense, I don't really speculate, but yes I do believe it's compatible?

[CatherineM]

I can't think of a better way for an ancient scribe who has been given a revelation of the Big Bang to describe it other than, "and God said let there be light." I think when man finally evolved sufficiently to be worthy of souls, God put his hand upon us.

[Vincent Vega]

[quote name='CatherineM' post='1615514' date='Aug 1 2008, 09:00 PM']I can't think of a better way for an ancient scribe who has been given a revelation of the Big Bang to describe it other than, "and God said let there be light." I think when man finally evolved sufficiently to be worthy of souls, God put his hand upon us.[/quote]
So you, Miss Catherine, are of the persuasion that Adam was the first fully human ancestor?

[dairygirl4u2c]

[url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:The_Heidelberg_Man.gif"]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:The_Heidelberg_Man.gif[/url]

[url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Java_Man.jpg"]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Java_Man.jpg[/url]

[url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Peking_Man.jpg"]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Peking_Man.jpg[/url]

[CatherineM]

[quote name='USAirwaysIHS' post='1615520' date='Aug 1 2008, 09:07 PM']So you, Miss Catherine, are of the persuasion that Adam was the first fully human ancestor?[/quote]

Yep. There is a painting in the city hall here called Genesis, that shows a primitive man walking across the savanna in the distance, and the clouds above him remind me of the ones in Michelangelo's painting in the Sistine Chapel. That is exactly how I visualize it. One man, becoming self aware, having God reach out and give him a soul. Then the Father selected an Eve for him. Geneticists have traced the human race back to one Eve at a time when humans were just about wiped out.

I think the "7 days of creation" was like the 7 days of visions given to Joseph. The ancient scribe was given a revelation of God's creation over 7 nights, and he interpreted them to mean that God created everything in 7 days, and did the best he could to take something incomprehensible and put it on paper. I would never presume to tell God how long a day to him should be.

[Farsight one]

[quote name='USAirwaysIHS' post='1615511' date='Aug 1 2008, 09:56 PM']Interesting approach...
So, I take it that you're of the persuasion that, no, we didn't all morph from primordial ooze, but yes, evolution by way of say, natural selection, has indeed occur, and continues to occur?[/quote]I'm sorry, but I honestly fail to see the difference there.

[Vincent Vega]

[quote name='Farsight one' post='1615595' date='Aug 1 2008, 11:18 PM']I'm sorry, but I honestly fail to see the difference there.[/quote]
I suppose I do as well...I don't know what I was really thinking when I wrote that...
Moving forward, then.

[mortify]

I don't have a problem with a literal understanding of genesis, but who knows.

Evolution that doesn't have God guiding it is against Church teaching.

[Vincent Vega]

[quote name='mortify' post='1615610' date='Aug 2 2008, 12:12 AM']Evolution that doesn't have God guiding it is against Church teaching.[/quote]
Naturally, yes. But in question, at least as I originally intended, is whether or not the basic premise, in its own right, was against teaching.

[aalpha1989]

Micro-evolution is compatible with Church teaching. Macro-evolution is not, as long as by macro-evolution you are referring to the idea that man evolved from some "lower" primate. The Church teaches that man had the dignity of man from the beginning of his existence. Man was always the Lord of Creation, and Genesis teaches that God created man in His image. C.S. Lewis also argues (I forget whether its in Mere Christianity or Miracles; I think it is in Miracles) that order cannot come from chaos. Our reason did not evolve into reason from animal instincts, because it is impossible for that lower form of reasoning (instincts) could evolve into higher reasoning (morality, etc.).