Hassan Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 This topic arose(somewhat) on another thread and I felt it merited its own thread. What exactly are the meaning of the terms. "Radical Islam" "Radical Muslim" "Islamfascism" These terms are thrown around often, yet I have always felt them quite vague. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortify Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 What we call radical Islam is actually Islam being practiced to it's full extent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hassan Posted July 19, 2008 Author Share Posted July 19, 2008 [quote name='mortify' post='1603072' date='Jul 18 2008, 10:43 PM']What we call radical Islam is actually Islam being practiced to it's full extent.[/quote] That means almost nothing. What YOU consider it's full extent, what exactly is that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lounge Daddy Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 Islamism. The totalitarian ideology. Not to be confused with Islam, the personal faith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hassan Posted July 19, 2008 Author Share Posted July 19, 2008 [quote name='Lounge Daddy' post='1603085' date='Jul 18 2008, 10:54 PM']Islamism. The totalitarian ideology. Not to be confused with Islam, the personal faith.[/quote] but what exactly does that mean, "Islamism"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pan!c139 Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 Wouldn't that be the plural sense of Islam, a collective noun? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hassan Posted July 19, 2008 Author Share Posted July 19, 2008 [quote name='pan!c139' post='1603105' date='Jul 18 2008, 11:08 PM']Wouldn't that be the plural sense of Islam, a collective noun?[/quote] It is, in most scholarly texts I read, generally used as a wide, sweeping term for political movements clocked in Islamic language. It would include anyone from Qutb Sayyid to Fethullah Gulen. Kind of like lumping Pope John Paul II with Jerry Falwell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pan!c139 Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 So then I'd like to know the difference between Islam and Islamism...cuz wouldn't that make them the same thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hassan Posted July 19, 2008 Author Share Posted July 19, 2008 (edited) [quote name='pan!c139' post='1603113' date='Jul 18 2008, 11:14 PM']So then I'd like to know the difference between Islam and Islamism...cuz wouldn't that make them the same thing?[/quote] The logic for the term, as I understand it, is that in numerous Muslims countries that are under secular/quasi-secular authoritarian governments the Mosque often become the hub of popular descent, and this and other factors lead many popular movements to be cloaked in religious language. The term is often used to refer populist movements articulated in religious language that take place under "secular" authoritarian regimes. Shariah law conjures up pictures of women in Burka's and thieves getting their hands chopped off in many Western minds. While in many Muslim minds it represents a system of government which places checks on even the most abusive leaders. In Authoritarian regimes it is easy to see why this becomes linked with popular movements. Like the Iranian Revolution, where fairly diverse movements becomes encompassed in a populist religious movement, rejecting the secular tyranny of the Shah, and his “Western Masters”. Edited July 19, 2008 by Hassan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lounge Daddy Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 [quote name='pan!c139' post='1603113' date='Jul 19 2008, 12:14 AM']So then I'd like to know the difference between Islam and Islamism...cuz wouldn't that make them the same thing?[/quote] Islam is the personal faith. Islamism is the totalitarian ideology. So someone who is "militant Islam" would be an Islamist. Personally I have been trying to avoid terms like "militant Islam" for the same reasons that I don't like the term "war on terror." It's a bit of a misnomer. Terrorism is just a tactic. The spread of Islamism is the goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pan!c139 Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 OK I get it a little better now...very heady stuff LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hassan Posted July 19, 2008 Author Share Posted July 19, 2008 [quote name='Lounge Daddy' post='1603127' date='Jul 18 2008, 11:28 PM']Islam is the personal faith. Islamism is the totalitarian ideology. So someone who is "militant Islam" would be an Islamist. Personally I have been trying to avoid terms like "militant Islam" for the same reasons that I don't like the term "war on terror." It's a bit of a misnomer. Terrorism is just a tactic. The spread of Islamism is the goal.[/quote] Well, I understand now a lot more what you mean, however I don't think "Islamist" necessarily implies totalitarianism. I mean if an organized group of Muslims protested the outlaw of abortion because of their religious beliefs (like with Catholic groups), would that be an "Islamist" movement? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pan!c139 Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 You would think... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hassan Posted July 19, 2008 Author Share Posted July 19, 2008 [quote name='pan!c139' post='1603141' date='Jul 18 2008, 11:35 PM']You would think...[/quote] Sure, and as long as the term is used like "The Christian Right" I really don't have a problem with it. But I seen people saying we must fight against all forms of "Islamism" I can't see this as helpful. Many popularist movements in Muslim countries hate the US our foreign policy and support of the authoritarian governments under which they live. Our right wing politicians labeling all such movements, universally as terrorist movements, saying we must fight against "Islamism" isn’t helpful, in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pan!c139 Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 Odd how one little suffix to a word can radically change its meaning in this case! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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