Holy Father, Communion Only To People Kneeling And On The Tongue Only

[johnnydigit]

[b]Kneeler in St. Peter[/b]

For the Mass for St. Peter and St. Paul, the Holy Father is distributing Communion only to people who are kneeling and on the tongue only.

[url="http://www.gloria.tv/?video=bvydszy4qil3o6vwlzpv"]http://www.gloria.tv/?video=bvydszy4qil3o6vwlzpv[/url]


Cardinal Arinze, "leave them in peace, not in pieces!"
[url="http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=CXdmrUwGPjI"]http://de.youtube.com/watch?v=CXdmrUwGPjI[/url]

[johnnydigit]

forgot something very important.

[Saint Therese]

[quote] [/quote]
I agree.

[MissyP89]

AWESOME.

[CatherineM]

Again, the lone dissenting person. Mainly because I am disabled, and can not physically kneel. My husband wants to go back to Rome for a visit, but I think I'll talk him into somewhere else. Not that I wouldn't love to see Rome. He had a personal audience the last time he went (he gave John Paul the Papal flag he took to the South Pole). I would feel so bad being there in his presence, and then not being able to receive communion would devastate me.

[Archaeology cat]

[quote name='CatherineM' post='1586420' date='Jun 29 2008, 08:44 PM']Again, the lone dissenting person. Mainly because I am disabled, and can not physically kneel. My husband wants to go back to Rome for a visit, but I think I'll talk him into somewhere else. Not that I wouldn't love to see Rome. He had a personal audience the last time he went (he gave John Paul the Papal flag he took to the South Pole). I would feel so bad being there in his presence, and then not being able to receive communion would devastate me.[/quote]
I was thinking about you when I saw this. Wouldn't there be some provision for those who truly cannot kneel? I would like to think there would be, at least. I wasn't able to kneel for a few years due to my bad knees (which are thankfully much better now), so I can somewhat relate. I certainly would love to have a communion rail (or rather, to actually use the communion rail at my parish), but I know there are those who cannot physically receive in that way.

[CatherineM]

I suppose I could try to kneel for the Pope, but I suspect there would be ambulances involved after mass at best, and at worst, fire/rescue and/or news cameras.

[Chiquitunga]

[quote name='johnnydigit' post='1586219' date='Jun 29 2008, 08:59 AM']forgot something very important.

[/quote]

[url="http://wdtprs.com/blog/2008/06/communion-on-the-tongue-kneeling-benedict-xvis-good-example/"]http://wdtprs.com/blog/2008/06/communion-o...s-good-example/[/url]

[Aloysius]

you wouldn't be denied communion for not kneeling if you were disabled. Seeing as at St. Peter's you probably wouldn't have someone that knew you were disabled ahead of time, if there is no visible way to tell that you are disabled, then you might want to bring something that indicates it. I don't know what type of disabled you are... but maybe just bring a cane or something and that would clearly indicate to them you're not just trying to break the norm.

being disabled is no reason to be against having the norm of receiving kneeling. the norm has ALWAYS been excepted from for those who are too disabled to kneel. are you against all kneeling in the mass because you are unable to do it? if not, you shouldn't be against the kneeling here. anyone who came up who appeared disabled or had a cane or a wheelchair or kretches or some sort of brace on their legs... even if they just came up with a limp or looked to clearly not walk with full ease or something... anything that indicated they couldn't kneel and they clearly wouldn't be asked to do so, it wouldn't be a big deal at all (apparently at the papal masses now you'd still have to receive on the tongue)... and in an ordinary parish setting the priest would know who physically could and couldn't kneel.

don't not go to Rome because of this, you wouldn't be denied communion.

[Brother Adam]

Catherine, even in the Tridentine Mass 50 years ago when kneeling was required by all, those who were disabled still did not have to kneel. The Church graciously and willingly makes concessions from the norms for those who are unable to follow them for medical reasons. Christ is the divine healer and he would never deny Himself to those who are sick or live with a disability. At our local Latin Mass there is a gentleman who is there daily and stands by the kneeler to receive because he physically cannot kneel. I've never seen anyone bothered by this.

The Holy Father is recognizing the dignity of the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass and how much of that dignity is lost in the execution of the Novus Ordo Mass. When we strip the Mass of its dignity, a loss of respect for the Mass quickly follows and we get statistics like "30% of Catholics reject the real presence" and "30% of Protestants are ex-Catholics" and "65% of Catholics do not attend Sunday Mass". Losing 120,000 American Catholics every year is a very dangerous trend. I'm running a rediscovering Catholicism class right now and all of the ex-Catholics at the class all left for the same reason - the implementation of the new missal in their church. They didn't see any reason to go to a protestantized Mass when they could simply go to a Protestant church.

[CatherineM]

I know that everyone believes that the church is very accommodating to the disabled. That has not been my experience. I was in a wheelchair for 8 years. The only church in St. Pete that had a confessional I could enter with my wheelchair was the cathedral. I went there on Saturday afternoons. I could only get in the church about 10% of the time because the handicap accessible entrance was not opened on Saturday during confession time. My roommate would go around and up the steps to the open door, and ask the Deacon inside to please open the handicap door for me, and he always refused. Sometimes it would be accidentally left open, but rarely.

I'm not against people kneeling in church, although in this diocese, people stand during the consecration. I'm opposed to being a sore thumb. I don't like being singled out and made an object of curiosity. I didn't sing in church for 15 years because of my disabilities. I love to sing. I cantored for my old Archbishop, but didn't want to have to be carried to the choir loft, or have a special seated lectern be brought in for me. He was willing to do either one considering that I had been injured defending the faith. I was too stubborn and let my pride get in the way.

It actually took me a long time to even accept the fact that I was disabled. When I was able to walk again, someone asked me now that I was getting my life back, what I wanted to do with the rest of my life. The first thing I said was I wanted to sing in church again. My church here doesn't use the choir loft, and they have put a chair kind of hidden for me, when I need to sit down. I'm finally learning to let people help me, and that it's okay to show vulnerability, but I obviously still have a long way to go.

[Brother Adam]

Sometimes the Church does need to be better at accommodating those who are disabled - especially as it relates to access to facilities. I know parishes who do an excellent job and parishes that are horrible at it. The Mass though should not be changed to try to be accommodating to everyone. First, it simply can't be done - someone is always going to complain. Second, the purpose of the Mass is to worship God. There should be norms that everyone should strive to, but be excused from when disability or another reason necessitates it. No one should blink an eye when someone stands or comes up to communion in a wheel chair, but no one should complain if the norm at Mass is to kneel when receiving communion either. I think it calls more attention and singles those who live with disabilities out more when we make "concessions" at Mass - actually - I think it can become downright insulting at times to those with live with disabilities. For instance - Just because several people are unable to even come up for communion is no reason to have everyone receive sitting in the pew - it is much better for the pastor to simply bring communion to them at their seat.

[aalpha1989]

[quote name='CatherineM' post='1587131' date='Jun 30 2008, 12:49 PM']I know that everyone believes that the church is very accommodating to the disabled. That has not been my experience. I was in a wheelchair for 8 years. The only church in St. Pete that had a confessional I could enter with my wheelchair was the cathedral. I went there on Saturday afternoons. I could only get in the church about 10% of the time because the handicap accessible entrance was not opened on Saturday during confession time. My roommate would go around and up the steps to the open door, and ask the Deacon inside to please open the handicap door for me, and he always refused. Sometimes it would be accidentally left open, but rarely.[/quote]

That's awful. I'm sorry.

[quote]I'm not against people kneeling in church, although in this diocese, people stand during the consecration. I'm opposed to being a sore thumb. I don't like being singled out and made an object of curiosity. I didn't sing in church for 15 years because of my disabilities. I love to sing. I cantored for my old Archbishop, but didn't want to have to be carried to the choir loft, or have a special seated lectern be brought in for me. He was willing to do either one considering that I had been injured defending the faith. I was too stubborn and let my pride get in the way.[/quote]

Injured defending the faith? Sounds like there's a story... do you mind sharing?

[CatholicCid]

[quote name='CatherineM' post='1587131' date='Jun 30 2008, 11:49 AM']I know that everyone believes that the church is very accommodating to the disabled. That has not been my experience. I was in a wheelchair for 8 years. The only church in St. Pete that had a confessional I could enter with my wheelchair was the cathedral. I went there on Saturday afternoons. I could only get in the church about 10% of the time because the handicap accessible entrance was not opened on Saturday during confession time. My roommate would go around and up the steps to the open door, and ask the Deacon inside to please open the handicap door for me, and he always refused. Sometimes it would be accidentally left open, but rarely.

I'm not against people kneeling in church, although in this diocese, people stand during the consecration. I'm opposed to being a sore thumb. I don't like being singled out and made an object of curiosity. I didn't sing in church for 15 years because of my disabilities. I love to sing. I cantored for my old Archbishop, but didn't want to have to be carried to the choir loft, or have a special seated lectern be brought in for me. He was willing to do either one considering that I had been injured defending the faith. I was too stubborn and let my pride get in the way.

It actually took me a long time to even accept the fact that I was disabled. When I was able to walk again, someone asked me now that I was getting my life back, what I wanted to do with the rest of my life. The first thing I said was I wanted to sing in church again. My church here doesn't use the choir loft, and they have put a chair kind of hidden for me, when I need to sit down. I'm finally learning to let people help me, and that it's okay to show vulnerability, but I obviously still have a long way to go.[/quote]

I was actually thinking about this other day while visiting a local, old cathedral. The cathedral, due to it's age, really is in no way pratically handicap accessable unless there is are accomidations made out of sight within the rectory. Even then, the 'handicap' seating is such that one could not really turn a wheelchair correctly in the area. I was in a wheelchair for a time as well, so I do know the feeling. At that time, I would just sit next to the first pew and the Priest would approach me so that I could recieve. At a Church I attend in a Hospital that does have, but does not utilize, communion rails, the Priest also approaches those with visible handicaps. I would assume that, when the rails were in use, the same was done.

As for sticking out like a sore thumb (I originally wrote "thore sumb" ), when approaching Communion, I assume we are attempting to give ourselves totally to Christ, to completely humble ourselves to Him. For those who stick out as a sore thumb and yet still approach Him, we are but in one way physically showing our humility, by putting Him before ourselves, before our fears.

Edited June 30, 2008 by CatholicCid

[MissyP89]

Catherine, though I personally think the Holy Father's new statement is wonderful, I can sympathize with you, too, being disabled (I prefer 'handicapped') myself.

When it came time for me to begin CCD when I was 6, my home parish refused to catechize me. I walked with a walker, and they didn't want to be responsible if I fell on the property. They told my mother they would only let me attend if I came in a wheelchair. I've never in my life been wheelchair-bound--there's never been a need for that--and we weren't about to start.

I left my home parish for that reason. Mom went in to a parish about 20 minutes away, said a few choice words to a sister, and I received my sacraments there and go to Mass there today. We've since then have tons of problems while visiting other, older churches...people that just don't *understand* that it's not as easy to do a flight of stairs as it would be for an able-bodied person. My parish, on the other hand, has been really supportive, especially my priests, which is a blessing.

Not to mention that many people do some...sweet, yet awkward...things for me. Ex. Pray over me, etc. I find that kind of thing very embarrassing and would be content to blend in. So I understand about sticking out a bit. For me, though, it's been this way all my life, so I've learned to disregard what others may think or say in the way I do things, at Mass or otherwise.

Do what you're able. You should still go to Rome! It's an opportunity that doesn't come around that often. Though it may be disrespectful of me to say, if people give you a hard time, forget them. What matters is Christ Who you're receiving...it isn't anyone's right to force you to kneel when you can't, or judge.

Pax!

Edited June 30, 2008 by MissyP89