mortify Posted July 9, 2008 Author Share Posted July 9, 2008 [quote name='reyb' post='1596099' date='Jul 9 2008, 11:55 AM']My question is why this doctrine is necessary? I mean, what is the reason behind this doctrine?[/indent][/quote] It's necessary because it was revealed by God. It's purpose is to prepare saved souls for entry into heaven: [color="#0000FF"]"Nothing impure will ever enter it"[/color] Rev 21:27 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deb Posted July 9, 2008 Share Posted July 9, 2008 I feel that part of the message of purgatory is to not think that just because you call Jesus "Lord" means you are going to heaven. You will most likely be in purgatory a long time if that is ALL you do. You may end up in hell if you think whatever you do exempts you because you believe you have been "saved." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted July 9, 2008 Share Posted July 9, 2008 [quote name='friendofJPII' post='1595685' date='Jul 8 2008, 10:22 PM']In one apparation, Mary said that "souls are falling into hell like snowflakes..."[/quote] I'm not disagreeing by any means, but I think using a Marian apparition as an example is not the best of arguments. After all, even when officially approved by the Vatican, it is always made clear that the particular devotion is a matter of personal choice, and the faithful are free to believe that the apparition was not true. Don't get me wrong though, I believe people do go to hell (many more than we wish), and I believe that there are many legitimate Marian apparitions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deb Posted July 10, 2008 Share Posted July 10, 2008 [quote name='Nihil Obstat' post='1596404' date='Jul 9 2008, 06:05 PM']I'm not disagreeing by any means, but I think using a Marian apparition as an example is not the best of arguments. After all, even when officially approved by the Vatican, it is always made clear that the particular devotion is a matter of personal choice, and the faithful are free to believe that the apparition was not true. Don't get me wrong though, I believe people do go to hell (many more than we wish), and I believe that there are many legitimate Marian apparitions.[/quote] So, what exactly is your point? I am all confused. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Knight Posted July 10, 2008 Share Posted July 10, 2008 Purgatory is one of those issues, that I strongly believe bridge us from one point to another point in our eternal lives. I mean nothing ever unclean will EVER enter God's Paradise in Heaven, the Perfect Life with the Most Blessed Trinity, And I find it very difficult to believe that people who die, who like everyone else while alive on earth, I find it hard to believe that they die perfect and go straight to Heaven, Sorry, but I think its much harder than that. Most people if not all people, dont die perfectly in God's Grace, so therefore, a purification process has to be undergone, to clean us up, and to rid of all personal attachment to sins, The Bible and Catechism are very short and brief on this topic, but I believe in Purgatory aboslutely! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nihil Obstat Posted July 10, 2008 Share Posted July 10, 2008 [quote name='Deb' post='1596562' date='Jul 9 2008, 08:46 PM']So, what exactly is your point? I am all confused.[/quote] Just that there are much stronger arguments than Marian apparitions, since Catholics aren't necessarily united on the apparitions themselves. If we aren't even necessarily united, it's a lot harder to discuss it in a wider setting. Visions that saints had, of course, and a different matter, and much stronger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deb Posted July 15, 2008 Share Posted July 15, 2008 Okay. I get it. I personally believe the bible makes it pretty clear that we don't just get zapped in to heaven. The Saints have also reported that. I do believe the messages of the Gospa of Medjugorje. It all melds fine for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnydigit Posted August 4, 2008 Share Posted August 4, 2008 who wouldn't take purgatory over hell any day! should be like a country club in comparison. "one second in purgatory is worse than the worst suffering on earth." i think hell is even worse.. ===== what i've been wondering is, what's the point of indulgences and the issue of time in purgatory, if the end result is eternal heaven anyways? sort of like OSAS.. ah who cares really, as long as i'm in, i'm in! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortify Posted August 4, 2008 Author Share Posted August 4, 2008 [quote name='johnnydigit' post='1616821' date='Aug 4 2008, 02:32 AM']what i've been wondering is, what's the point of indulgences and the issue of time in purgatory, if the end result is eternal heaven anyways? sort of like OSAS.. ah who cares really, as long as i'm in, i'm in![/quote] The point is a quick entry into Heaven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnydigit Posted August 5, 2008 Share Posted August 5, 2008 [quote name='mortify' post='1617389' date='Aug 4 2008, 05:52 PM']The point is a quick entry into Heaven[/quote] i think i do them more so because they're helpful for my spiritual growth, and if they can help other people, but as far as time.. it doesn't seem that important to me.. 5 years.. 10 years.. 100 years.. aren't we taught that lifetimes are nothing compared to eternity? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortify Posted August 6, 2008 Author Share Posted August 6, 2008 (edited) [quote name='johnnydigit' post='1617509' date='Aug 4 2008, 09:36 PM']i think i do them more so because they're helpful for my spiritual growth, and if they can help other people, but as far as time.. it doesn't seem that important to me.. 5 years.. 10 years.. 100 years.. aren't we taught that lifetimes are nothing compared to eternity?[/quote] As was probably mentioned earlier time in purgatory is not like time on earth, a day in purgatory is like a century on earth. Considering the pain that the souls will experience, both separation from Supreme Happiness which is God, and the purging fire which strikes our innermost being, one can't imagine how truly dreadful the pains of purgatory are. It is why the poor souls in purgatory need our prayers, and why we must strive to prepare for our Judgment. God bless Edited August 6, 2008 by mortify Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnydigit Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 even then.. 1000 years.. 5000 years.. 1 million years.. still is nothing compared to eternity. thought: if you had to suffer 1 million years in purgatory for another soul, would you? you'd still get to the eternal heaven in the end of course.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortify Posted August 6, 2008 Author Share Posted August 6, 2008 Johnny, you're making it sound like purgatory is a walk in the park. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 11, 2008 Share Posted September 11, 2008 [quote name='mortify' post='1618842' date='Aug 6 2008, 12:29 AM']Johnny, you're making it sound like purgatory is a walk in the park.[/quote] as long as there is a basketball court. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Bone _ Posted September 14, 2008 Share Posted September 14, 2008 [quote name='mortify' post='1618842' date='Aug 5 2008, 10:29 PM']Johnny, you're making it sound like purgatory is a walk in the park.[/quote] As long as you can see the brass ring, you can endure anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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