Fighting Abortion

[LivingStone]

Thanks all for the responses, they are all well and good. Just to keep terminology consistent, a rescue is when hundreds if not thousands of people physically block the entrance to an abortion clinic by putting themselves in front of the door.

Just for the record, I want to say that I am not condemning Operation Rescue, as I feel that it can be justified only under certain circumstances, and mainly, it depends on the law and ordinances of the city in which the abortion clinic is. There is a time and place for civil disobedience, but Rescues are not it.

I. Practical Reasons Not to Support Operation Rescue

A. It will be detrimental to yourself
- In 1994, the FACE Act (Freedom of Access to Clinic Entrances) was passed (by Bill Clinton). This means that a person participating in a Rescue, even a first time offender, can have anywhere from 1-10 years of jail time AND a $100,000 fine.
- How effective would it be for thousands of pro-lifers to sit in jail for ten years because they spent one day outside and abortion clinic? We need those people outside the abortion clinic every day the abortion clinic was opened- not once every ten years.

B. It will be detrimental to the Pro-Life Movement as a whole - especially in Pittsburgh
- I understand that having thousands of people arrested could make a profound statement to the American people. The thing is, though - how are the American people going to know about a Rescue? Through the media. However, the secular media does not always do the best job of portraying the pro-life movement. Take, for example, their coverage of March for Life and the Pro-Choice march. If you have ever seen the media coverage of these two events, though there are thousands and thousands more people at the March for Life, camera shots can easily make you think that these two events were equally attended. Rescue has and will be portrayed as a condemnatory, extremist movement in the media - there's no way around it.
- Without going into too much detail here - Pittsburgh, PA, as is many other cities around the nation, has an awful pro-life history, beginning with Rescues that took place there in the 80s and 90s. Over the last ten years, our situation in Pittsburgh has improved more than you can imagine, though it is still very poor. The police, the general population, even the churches generally want nothing to do with pro-lifers in Pittsburgh. All of the ground we have gained over the last ten years will be lost. Our ministry in Pittsburgh will be crippled. The abortion industry in Pittsburgh has a lot of sway over Pittsburgh law, as we have recently seen with the enforcement of the Bubble Zone legislation in January 2006. This law was put in place because of "violence at the clinic" which didn't even occur - so it scares me to consider what kind of laws could be put in place if violence actually did occur. One day of Rescue will set us back at least 10 years, guaranteed.

C. There is a time and place for civil disobedience - but Rescue is not it
- Operation Rescue likes to compare itself with the work of Martin Luther King Jr. Martin Luther King Jr., in a letter written from jail in Birmingham - spoke about his stance on civil disobedience. He makes it very clear that civil disobedience, for him, is the last measure taken. He says that he took every possible measure he could within the law - it was only when all means under the law were not effective that he resorted to civil disobedience.
- If there are more effective measures of saving lives and converting hearts that are not illegal - why use means that are? Statistics on the lives saved from Operation Rescue are hard to come by. Though 100% of the women with scheduled appointments will not enter that abortion clinic on that day - we have no way to know how many of them either returned to the same abortion clinic or went to another. Further, rescues do not and cannot take place every day - [b]but sidewalk counseling and prayerful presence outside of abortion clinics can and does. Msgr. Phillip Reilly, who counsels six days a week in Brooklyn, NY regularly has anywhere from 20-40 women every day decide to keep their children. People all over the country and all over the world are using Msgr. Reilly's sidewalk counseling methods and having success without breaking the law.[/b]


II. Spiritual/Theological Reasons not to Support Operation Rescue XX

A. Following in the Example of Christ and Our Blessed Mother
- God gave each of us free will. While I cannot at all diminish the agony it is to stand and watch a woman enter an abortion clinic - this does not justify physically stopping them. First of all, it's not supposed to be easy to let them go in. When we go to the abortion clinic, we go to Calvary and stand with the Blessed Mother. We stand in prayer before the slaughter of the innocent. It was before the cross that Mary was given the title "Queen of Martyrs" - we too, are called to be martyrs with Mary at Calvary. This martyrdom of Mary was not a physical one, though, - it was a complete death to self - a total offering of one's self before the cross.
- Further, I do not see Christ physically obstructing a woman from entering an abortion clinic. Why? First, again, God gave each of us free will. Second, each woman going into that abortion clinic goes is need of conversion. Her soul is in grave danger. Physically preventing her from killing her child is good for the life of the child, but ignores the soul of the mother. Every person associated with an abortion needs a conversion of heart. Prayerful presence and sidewalk counseling are both concerned with the life of the child and the soul of each and every person we encounter.

B. "The Goal of the Pro-Life Movement"
-An official from Operation Rescue at our school asked a student here what she thought was the goal of the pro-life movement. She answered, "The salvation of souls." He replied - This is where you are wrong. The goal of the pro-life movement is not conversion to Christ - it is saving lives. Evangelization is not the solution to end abortion, says he.
- This view is very troubling. There is nothing in life, whether it be in pro-life work, other ministries, or our day-to-day activities, that should not be concerned with the salvation of souls.

C. "Make Love Your Aim"
- We have concerns that charity/love are not at the heart of the mission of Operation Rescue XX. An official from Operation to remain anonymous has said, on more than one occasion, that courage is the supreme virtue. Courage is important - Pope John Paul II made this clear in his call to young people. However, courage without love is nothing. "The greatest of these is love."
- Part of the mission of Operation Rescue XX is to "make life hell for the abortionists." This is not just a battle cry, an encouraging statement - Operation Rescue official to remain anonymous has given specific examples of how we are to do this. We, supposedly, should be "consumed with hate (don't hate, appreciate)." The only way to justifiably "make life hell for the abortionist" is with love - to drive them crazy with truth and love. hate (don't hate, appreciate), evil, violence - these can never be justified. Charity must be at the foundation of everything we are doing.

Closing Remarks:

I have seen how effective counseling can be: refer to the bold text above. If you aren't aware of what abortion clinics refer to as "pro-choice escorts", these are people ultimately hired or volunteered to escort and distract the mother so that sidewalk counselors cannot administer to her. These people are a financial defense to abortion clinics. These pro-choice escorts are a response to Operation Rescue, ultimately making it much more difficult for sidewalk counselors to convert. There is also another law such that a sidewalk counselor cannot "be within 15 feet of the door and cannot approach within 8 feet of the mother within 100 feet from the woman". These laws that hinder the effective counseling are a response to Operation Rescue.

Thanks people. Keep the debate going, its good clean stuff. Nothing personal against anyone, fyi. If you have questions of how effective Sidewalk Counseling can be, let me know: we'll talk about the psychological and spiritual situations that mothers can find themselves in. Chat it up!

[Brother Adam]

[quote]- In 1994, the FACE Act (Freedom of Access to Clinic Entrances) was passed (by Bill Clinton). This means that a person participating in a Rescue, even a first time offender, can have anywhere from 1-10 years of jail time AND a $100,000 fine.
- How effective would it be for thousands of pro-lifers to sit in jail for ten years because they spent one day outside and abortion clinic? We need those people outside the abortion clinic every day the abortion clinic was opened- not once every ten years.[/quote]

They would never, and have never put thousands of people in prison for 10 years, must less 1 year for blocking an entrance to an abortion clinic. There would be a public outcry (I hate (don't hate, appreciate) to say it, but NARAL figures are grossly misrepresented to the number of public who support abortions) and there is no way the government is going to pay the cost of keeping all those people in prison. What it the millions and millions Americans who opposed abortion all blocked abortion entrances every day? There would be no means to arrest them and the clinics would be forced to shut down. The genocide would be over.

[quote]Rescue has and will be portrayed as a condemnatory, extremist movement in the media - there's no way around it.[/quote]

Frankly, who cares what the liberal media thinks? Evening news is a dying bread of media and radio, blogs, and other mediums are becoming more popular every day. Also, just because the movement is condemned in the media doesn't make it wrong. Catholics are condemned in the media every day. That doesn't make Catholicism wrong.

[quote]One day of Rescue will set us back at least 10 years, guaranteed.[/quote]

If and when it is done right, it will push the pro-life movement forward in ways you can't possibly imagine. Unfortunately, just like the book 1984, the general population don't think they can make a difference.

[quote]- If there are more effective measures of saving lives and converting hearts that are not illegal - why use means that are?[/quote]

Because it is used when legal means have failed to save lives, or did you forget this is a genocide? Nothing is truly legal if it rejects God's law.

[quote]Further, rescues do not and cannot take place every day - but sidewalk counseling and prayerful presence outside of abortion clinics can and does. Msgr. Phillip Reilly, who counsels six days a week in Brooklyn, NY regularly has anywhere from 20-40 women every day decide to keep their children. People all over the country and all over the world are using Msgr. Reilly's sidewalk counseling methods and having success without breaking the law.[/quote]

As has already been repeated, violence and forcibly stopping abortions is to be used as an extraordinary means, when ordinary means fail. Regular prayer, fasting, and sidewalk counseling are the ordinary means. When they fail, we still have an obligation to save these children from death at the hands of murders.

[quote]A. Following in the Example of Christ and Our Blessed Mother[/quote]

These examples are bankrupt of any logic whatsoever. Children are not being murdered for the salvation of the world, they are being murdered in a heinous demonic fashion. Jesus gives us free will, but he also gives us brains. Pacifism is not a Christian virtue. As we mentioned, there is certainly a place in and time when up to lethal force can be used in war as a last resort.

[quote]-An official from Operation Rescue at our school asked a student here what she thought was the goal of the pro-life movement. She answered, "The salvation of souls." He replied - This is where you are wrong. The goal of the pro-life movement is not conversion to Christ - it is saving lives. Evangelization is not the solution to end abortion, says he.
- This view is very troubling. There is nothing in life, whether it be in pro-life work, other ministries, or our day-to-day activities, that should not be concerned with the salvation of souls.[/quote]

The official is absolutely right. America liberated the Jewish people from the holocaust to save their lives, not simply to convert them. The final end of saving the life of the mother and child would be to see the salvation of their soul, but there is a much more serious need - to save their life. We can't save the soul of a dead mother in an abortion gone wrong.

[quote]Part of the mission of Operation Rescue XX is to "make life hell for the abortionists."[/quote]

If it is not provable that it is an official doctrine of OR that they want to instill hate (don't hate, appreciate) for other people, then it shouldn't be brought up, that is slander and libel. We have no clue who this official is or who they really represent. I think we should hate (don't hate, appreciate) the job of the abortionist with true righteous anger as God hates all sin. We can love the person who is committing murder just like we can love the person who is shooting up children in a school yard. That doesn't mean we aren't going to stop them if we get the chance.

[quote]There is also another law such that a sidewalk counselor cannot "be within 15 feet of the door and cannot approach within 8 feet of the mother within 100 feet from the woman". These laws that hinder the effective counseling are a response to Operation Rescue.[/quote]

Once again you are seeing the work of OR as totally mutually exclusive to counseling. It's not. It is to be used when counseling a mother fails. Just because the liberal pro-murder psychos respond to our tactics in this war doesn't mean we don't respond to their response and keep up the fight.

[dairygirl4u2c]

living stone... i agree you might have something with us hurting our cause and hardening eharts against us, if we were to attack them etc....

but, how is it any different than attacking someone when they are about to kill someone else etc, who is born?

everything you say, i think of that question, and it doesn't make your points make sense to me. (again, i concede other than the hardening hearts stuff which you might have a point on)