Something Biblical And Scientific To Rebut The Big Bang Theory

[Adrestia]

[quote name='JesusIsMySuperHero' post='1525646' date='May 12 2008, 09:31 AM']Second, you are giving a completely non-related argument to my argument. I don't believe God evolved life, because the God who evolved life would mean God values the more fit over the less fit, which contradicts scripture - that he valued the less fit sinners over his son, by sending his son so that we could be with him![/quote]Do you think it would be wrong to say that God created life that has the ability to adapt to its surroundings?

IMHO, science can not be at odds with theology. Scientists observe and measure natural phenomenon. God created natural phenomenon. Therefore, no scientific "discovery" can dispute the existence of God. They only highlight what a great Creator He is.

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='tgoldson' post='1526860' date='May 13 2008, 09:08 AM']Do you think it would be wrong to say that God created life that has the ability to adapt to its surroundings?

IMHO, science can not be at odds with theology. Scientists observe and measure natural phenomenon. God created natural phenomenon. Therefore, no scientific "discovery" can dispute the existence of God. They only highlight what a great Creator He is.[/quote]

[JesusIsMySuperHero]

Guess what guys,

All the Fossils in the world were created by the flood, which happened 5000 years ago!

Because if you take billions, upon billions of gallons of water, which would cause massive land upheavals, animals that were not in the ark would quickly be encased in the mud and debris, and would fossilize!

Are you guys so ignorant of the flood? That is a sign of the times!

And why did God do that, he wanted to get rid of the more fit Giants, so Noah, a righteous man - who was less fit than a giant, and his family would live!

God has always been one who fights the battles of the weak, bringing the strong under his judgment when the strong decide it is their right to abuse the weak!

I hope to see you guys congratulate your Intelligence more and more! Pride cometh before a fall!

Edited May 13, 2008 by JesusIsMySuperHero

[HisChildForever]

[quote name='JesusIsMySuperHero' post='1526966' date='May 13 2008, 11:47 AM']Guess what guys,

All the Fossils in the world were created by the flood, which happened 5000 years ago!

Because if you take billions, upon billions of gallons of water, which would cause massive land upheavals, animals that were not in the ark would quickly be encased in the mud and debris, and would fossilize!

Are you guys so ignorant of the flood? That is a sign of the times!

And why did God do that, he wanted to get rid of the more fit Giants, so Noah, a righteous man - who was less fit than a giant, and his family would live!

God has always been one who fights the battles of the weak, bringing the strong under his judgment when the strong decide it is their right to abuse the weak!

I hope to see you guys congratulate your Intelligence more and more! Pride cometh before a fall![/quote]

[Archaeology cat]

[quote name='JesusIsMySuperHero' post='1526966' date='May 13 2008, 03:47 PM']Guess what guys,

All the Fossils in the world were created by the flood, which happened 5000 years ago!

Because if you take billions, upon billions of gallons of water, which would cause massive land upheavals, animals that were not in the ark would quickly be encased in the mud and debris, and would fossilize!

Are you guys so ignorant of the flood? That is a sign of the times!

And why did God do that, he wanted to get rid of the more fit Giants, so Noah, a righteous man - who was less fit than a giant, and his family would live!

God has always been one who fights the battles of the weak, bringing the strong under his judgment when the strong decide it is their right to abuse the weak!

I hope to see you guys congratulate your Intelligence more and more! Pride cometh before a fall![/quote]
Giants - are you by chance referring to the Nephilim? If so, they were not giants; they are referred to using classic warrior language common to Semitic languages.

And the stratigraphy does not your premise of all those fossils being formed at the same time. From the available evidence, one cannot conclude that all the fossils were formed in that way.

[CatherineM]

You don't have to be afraid of dinosaurs interfering with your faith. God just created them to warm up the planet for us, and to produce the fossil fuel we are so dependent on. He wanted us to use our minds, so he gave us lots of stuff to study, investigate, and ponder about.

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='JesusIsMySuperHero' post='1526966' date='May 13 2008, 11:47 AM']Guess what guys,

All the Fossils in the world were created by the flood, which happened 5000 years ago!

Because if you take billions, upon billions of gallons of water, which would cause massive land upheavals, animals that were not in the ark would quickly be encased in the mud and debris, and would fossilize!

Are you guys so ignorant of the flood? That is a sign of the times!

And why did God do that, he wanted to get rid of the more fit Giants, so Noah, a righteous man - who was less fit than a giant, and his family would live!

God has always been one who fights the battles of the weak, bringing the strong under his judgment when the strong decide it is their right to abuse the weak!

I hope to see you guys congratulate your Intelligence more and more! Pride cometh before a fall![/quote]
We are not the least bit ignorant of geology, palentology, archaeology, anthropology, or mineralogy etc because scientific inquiry is simply using the brains God gave us. THe only fall I can see is trying to explain to God that you think people should refuse to use the brains He granted them. God is Truth, and scientific facts are a part of God's truth because of His Creation.

[ironmonk]

[quote name='genxcathedra' post='1525540' date='May 12 2008, 03:08 AM']...but, even to some "reasonable" Catholics, he is probably a reject, uninformed, ignorant, biased or any other slander one can think of in their insecurity as a "reasonable" Catholic since the scientific community is given the blind authority that Catholics once gave priests. Maybe priests screwed up once and lost people, but don't think those atheists and neo-pagans of the scientific community who have an agenda miss what power they have to declare anything as truth because they are scientists. Despite what some of them say, Einstein stated the interdependence between science and religion to come to realize what God has been doing here. Of course, dogma rules it all and so some things will be true if science is hesitant--like contraception being a bad thing.

If you are truly open-minded, you'll at least give this a listen and hear the priest's other sermons about scientific things. The long Lenten talks, as well as other sermons on this site have very interesting things to know, even if you don't believe him on topics of science!

it's audiosancto dot org.[/quote]

Catholic teaching and real science do not conflict.

Even if Darwin was right, that does not mean that God is not real... evolution is one theory on how God did it. The Big Bang is another... neither disprove God... they more prove God than anything else....

Something cannot come from nothing. If we poofed into existance without there being a God to make it happen then everything would be poofing into and out of existance and only chaos would be... but there is not chaos... there is order.

i.e. A simple light sensitive spot cannot evolve into a complex eye without God telling it to. People who try using these kind of science arguement to "prove" there is no God, often do so because they are mad at God and this is their way of "getting Him back".

Science, logic, reason, and historical facts easily prove God's existence... and the fact that the Catholic Church is His Church.


God Bless,
ironmonk

[Spamity Calamity]

[quote name='ironmonk' post='1527655' date='May 13 2008, 09:03 PM']Catholic teaching and real science do not conflict.

Even if Darwin was right, that does not mean that God is not real... evolution is one theory on how God did it. The Big Bang is another... neither disprove God... they more prove God than anything else....

Something cannot come from nothing. If we poofed into existance without there being a God to make it happen then everything would be poofing into and out of existance and only chaos would be... but there is not chaos... there is order.

i.e. A simple light sensitive spot cannot evolve into a complex eye without God telling it to. People who try using these kind of science arguement to "prove" there is no God, often do so because they are mad at God and this is their way of "getting Him back".

Science, logic, reason, and historical facts easily prove God's existence... and the fact that the Catholic Church is His Church.
God Bless,
ironmonk[/quote]
i like this. I have always been really confused by the idea that science and religion are at odds with each other.

[Farsight one]

Some random tidbits generally related to the subject-

1. According to YEC's, the earth is only 6000 years old, and therefore, they believe that beer pre-exists the earth by a couple thousand years.

2. I like to think of Biology (and Logic, literature, math, other sciences, etc) to be the gifts of the holy spirit - things that the bible says that we should use. The bible is God's word. These gifts should be used to help one understand God's word. To reject geological and paleotological evidence for evolution is to reject the gifts of the Holy Spirit. It is prideful to refuse to trust in what an evolutionary biologist has to say about evolution, when they've spent their life studying it, and you haven't spent more than a couple days studying it. At least, that's how I view it.

3. Dating methods (e.g. Carbon 14) are not innaccurate, unless used on something younger than it's half-life, which has been tried in the past (these instances are commonly used by creationists to attack such dating methods)

4. Dark Matter most certainly is real. First of all, we can actually see the outlines it makes in front of some stars and galaxies. Secondly, without dark matter, the entire theory of gravity has to be thrown out the window.

5. I luuuurrvvvee dinosaurs...

[Archaeology cat]

[quote name='Farsight one' post='1528162' date='May 14 2008, 12:36 PM']Some random tidbits generally related to the subject-

1. According to YEC's, the earth is only 6000 years old, and therefore, they believe that beer pre-exists the earth by a couple thousand years. [/quote]
Beer is a marker of civilisation.

[quote name='Farsight one' post='1528162' date='May 14 2008, 12:36 PM']3. Dating methods (e.g. Carbon 14) are not innaccurate, unless used on something younger than it's half-life, which has been tried in the past (these instances are commonly used by creationists to attack such dating methods)[/quote]
Exactly. I mean, of course potassium-argon dating won't work if you try to use it on something only 3000 years old, but it does on things >100,000 years old. Most samples are also sent to multiple labs in order to get the most accurate results. At least that's the case w/ C-14 dating.

[quote name='Farsight one' post='1528162' date='May 14 2008, 12:36 PM']5. I luuuurrvvvee dinosaurs... [/quote]
Me too! (Just don't ask archaeologists if we dig up dinosaurs; it's a major pet peeve of the field)

[Farsight one]

[quote name='Archaeology cat' post='1528199' date='May 14 2008, 08:13 AM']Me too! (Just don't ask archaeologists if we dig up dinosaurs; it's a major pet peeve of the field)
[/quote]You don't have to worry about that. I've been telling my teachers what is and how to spell "paleontologist" since I was in kindergarten. I know there's a difference.

Though I am interested to ask - have you or do you know any archaeologists who have come across dino bones on accident? And what might an archaeologist do with them if discovered?
[/hijack]

Edited May 14, 2008 by Farsight one

[Archaeology cat]

[quote name='Farsight one' post='1528207' date='May 14 2008, 01:23 PM']You don't have to worry about that. I've been telling my teachers what is and how to spell "paleontologist" since I was in kindergarten. I know there's a difference.

Though I am interested to ask - have you or do you know any archaeologists who have come across dino bones on accident? And what might an archaeologist do with them if discovered?
[/hijack][/quote]
I never came across dino bones. I'd imagine it would be unusual, since the strata archaeologists are interested in are usually much higher up than dinosaur bones would be. As for what they would do, that would probably depend on where they were. In the US or Europe they might be likely to call the nearest university with a paleontologist.

Oh, and yeah, I wanted to be a paleontologist in 2nd grade; then switched my allegiance over to archaeology in 5th grade, when I volunteered on a local dig with one of my dad's friends.

[JesusIsMySuperHero]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' post='1527148' date='May 13 2008, 12:46 PM']We are not the least bit ignorant of geology, palentology, archaeology, anthropology, or mineralogy etc because scientific inquiry is simply using the brains God gave us. THe only fall I can see is trying to explain to God that you think people should refuse to use the brains He granted them. God is Truth, and scientific facts are a part of God's truth because of His Creation.[/quote]

Well the Cmom, I am living proof God never evolved anything, because if his character was to allow the strong to survive over the death of the weak, then I should be dead right now. You see, there were a group of big bad Pagans who thought they were going torment me and kill me, because I love Jesus. They decided that they would try to give me a stroke on December 27th, 2007 - and while I felt about a couple of dozen hit me with powerful magic on the right side of my head, and another bunch hit me on the other side of my head, I immediately started to shake and sweat at my cubicle at work. Then my vision started to blur, and I couldn't do anything but tell my customer I was putting them on hold because of difficulties I was having - (they probably thought my computer system), and all I could do is say a silent prayer, God save me, You said one shall send a thousand to fight because you go out and fight your people's battles. I bind each of the evil spirits who are doing this to the bottomless pit in the holy name of your son.

Well, I guess God has changed. If he let the strong survive over the weak, he didn't that night, because there was nothing I could hope to do to fight those evil Pagans!

That is why I don't believe in Evolution. It's inconsistent with God's Character, nuff said!

[Archaeology cat]

[quote name='JesusIsMySuperHero' post='1529347' date='May 15 2008, 03:38 PM']Well the Cmom, I am living proof God never evolved anything, because if his character was to allow the strong to survive over the death of the weak, then I should be dead right now. You see, there were a group of big bad Pagans who thought they were going torment me and kill me, because I love Jesus. They decided that they would try to give me a stroke on December 27th, 2007 - and while I felt about a couple of dozen hit me with powerful magic on the right side of my head, and another bunch hit me on the other side of my head, I immediately started to shake and sweat at my cubicle at work. Then my vision started to blur, and I couldn't do anything but tell my customer I was putting them on hold because of difficulties I was having - (they probably thought my computer system), and all I could do is say a silent prayer, God save me, You said one shall send a thousand to fight because you go out and fight your people's battles. I bind each of the evil spirits who are doing this to the bottomless pit in the holy name of your son.

Well, I guess God has changed. If he let the strong survive over the weak, he didn't that night, because there was nothing I could hope to do to fight those evil Pagans!

That is why I don't believe in Evolution. It's inconsistent with God's Character, nuff said![/quote]
First off, I think it's great that you fully recovered from the stroke. Praise God!

Second, evolution and natural selection don't mean that there won't be any weaknesses or that the strong will always win in a fight. These changes occur over many generations, and it just means those who are better adapted to their environment are more likely to survive longer, and therefore more likely to pass on their genes. You have to look at the entire population to see what's happening, as it doesn't work to look at it on an individual basis. Perhaps one of the most used examples is of the [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peppered_moth"]peppered moth[/url]. Those that had the colouring to blend in with the trees the best survived longer (because birds couldn't see them as easily) and therefore more of them were able to breed and to pass on those desirable traits.