The "born Gay" Hoax

[Farsight one]

[quote name='Socrates' post='1501371' date='Apr 16 2008, 08:55 PM']As I've said plenty of times before, God (who is All Good, and can do no evil) is NOT the author of inclinations toward objective moral evil.[/quote]
He's not? So genetic predispositions towards alcoholism or gambling addiction don't actually exist? You don't think that mutations caused by chemicals in utero can create excessive sex drives? I'm not saying He's the author of evil, but I can't imagine He wouldn't challenge us in any, way, shape or form.

There's a whole heap of difference between a person that is good because they were never exposed to the bad and a person who is good because they fought the bad and overcame.

[quote]God "creates people gay" no more than He creates people as drunkards, wastrals, or fornicators.[/quote]You're still equating the homosexual orientation with the ACTIONS. A drunkard is a person that drinks too much. A homosexual is not by default a person that has homosexual sex too much(or at all...which I guess would be the same thing in this case)

[Alycin]

I smell of elderberries at science and have absolutely no credentials that would make my opinion on this subject anything more than an opinion.

I have an eating disorder.

I don't want it or like it. I hate (don't hate, appreciate) it. I have to battle the temptations to binge, to purge, to not eat, to overeat... on a daily, sometimes hourly basis.

Other girls, it's very sad to say, think it's "cool" or glamorous or something to have an eating disorder because our culture praises underweight celebrities in the same way it gives the "gay is okay" thumbs up.

"They" don't know if it's genetic, because not enough studies have been done. But there have been lots of cases with anorexia that give people enough reason to think that it may be genetic, or that some people may be more prone to develop eating disorders due to their mother, aunt, grandmother, whatever... having them.

I think it could be the same with homosexuals that don't want to be homosexuals...

'Cause I don't think that God created me to be bulimic. It's gross and very much contrary to what my body was created for, contrary to what food was created for. But I think that it very well could be due to some genetic predisposition to it.

I don't think that because someone has some weird mutated gene, that means that God is responsible for their "defect", so to speak. The fall of man is the reason everything has been slowly deteriorating since the beginning of time... sin is responsible, our sin. So someone being born with a predisposition to becoming eating disordered, sexually disordered, alcohol addicted, or anything else... it's not because "God made them that way", it's because sin has been screwing things up for forever, and it effected everything... even our genes.


I could be way off though.

[thessalonian]

[quote name='Farsight one' post='1501219' date='Apr 16 2008, 06:10 PM']But homosexuality is NOT an evil. Homosexual ACTIVITY is. For your logic to follow, it would have to appear that God is creating people in the ACT, and not simply with the orientation.

Creating a person gay would be no more evil than creating a person easily tempted by alcohol, or gambling, or extramarital sex. It is the act that is the sin.[/quote]

It is not an evil but it is a disorder.

[Didacus]

[quote name='CatherineM' post='1500822' date='Apr 16 2008, 11:38 AM']The will be lining up to attack him, so I hope he has a thick skin and some good lawyers.[/quote]

Some support from those who shares his opinion at least in part wouldn't hurt either.

[carrdero]

[quote]Kujo writes: God doesn't "give" anybody any temptations. We are tempted by the devil and we fall short because of our human weakness.[/quote]
Where do you think the devil acquires permission to do this?

[color="#000080"][b]Job 1:10[/b] Hast not thou made an hedge about him, and about his house, and about all that he hath on every side? thou hast blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land.
[b]1:11[/b] But put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee to thy face.
[b]1:12 [/b]And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the LORD.[/color]

Edited April 17, 2008 by carrdero

[carrdero]

[quote]Goldenchild17 writes: Exactly, but the way I see it, homosexuality as it exists is a perverted view of human sexuality.[/quote]
The way I see it, it exists as someone else’s preferred view of sexuality.
[quote]Goldenchild17 writes: But I don't believe God would create a person with that perverted orientation as it is against His very nature and law.[/quote]
I do not think that it is against GOD's nature. In many instances, the human sexual organs respond as if a homosexual was having straight sex or if they were alone masturbating. I do not think that it is against GOD's law because if it was, there would be some type of swift and immediate judgment or punishment. There is no evidence that GOD is offended or appalled by homosexuality.

Have you ever considered that GOD doesn’t create or decide sexual orientation for humans? Have you considered a GOD who allows free will and the decision for adults to make their own choices regarding consentual sexual expressions of love?

Edited April 17, 2008 by carrdero

[Scofizzle]

[quote]Have you ever considered that GOD doesn’t create or decide sexual orientation for humans? Have you considered a GOD who allows free will and the decision for adults to make their own choices regarding consentual sexual expressions of love?[/quote]


God gives us the free will to make the choice. We have the opportunity to choose homosexuality. Just because we have the ability to choose does not mean that our choices will be objectively good, or not offensive to God.

I can choose to shoot and kill someone else for no particular reason. This choice I have made will certainly offend God and an evil act.

Edited April 17, 2008 by Scofizzle

[Fidei Defensor]

[quote name='Scofizzle' post='1501902' date='Apr 17 2008, 01:22 PM']God gives us the free will to make the choice. We have the opportunity to choose homosexuality. Just because we have the ability to choose does not mean that our choices will be objectively good, or not offensive to God.

I can choose to shoot and kill someone else for no particular reason. This choice I have made will certainly offend God and an evil act.[/quote]
The thing is, maybe to you, choosing to be homosexual would be "icky" and "unnatural." But what about those who are homosexual and the idea of choosing to be heterosexual is icky and feels unnatural to them? You aren't considering feelings. Choices and feelings are not the same thing. For the most part, feelings tend to govern our choices -- i.e. we choose what is good for us, avoid what is bad.

[ironmonk]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' post='1500653' date='Apr 16 2008, 10:36 AM'][url="http://www.massresistance.org/docs/gen/08a/born_gay_hoax/index.html"]http://www.massresistance.org/docs/gen/08a...hoax/index.html[/url][/quote]


Interesting...

Here is a link to the "Homosexuality and Hope" article that the Catholic Medical Association put out a few years ago. They compiled and analyzed homosexuality research over a period of thirty or so years which included sets of twins that grew up together and apart...

[url="http://web.archive.org/web/20060418213129/www.cathmed.org/publications/homosexualityarticle.html"]http://web.archive.org/web/20060418213129/...ityarticle.html[/url]


God Bless!
ironmonk

[CrossCuT]

[size=1]Homosexuality is a mental disorder. I cant see any other way around it.
[/size]

[Socrates]

[quote name='Farsight one' post='1501477' date='Apr 16 2008, 09:57 PM']He's not? So genetic predispositions towards alcoholism or gambling addiction don't actually exist? You don't think that mutations caused by chemicals in utero can create excessive sex drives? I'm not saying He's the author of evil, but I can't imagine He wouldn't challenge us in any, way, shape or form.

There's a whole heap of difference between a person that is good because they were never exposed to the bad and a person who is good because they fought the bad and overcame.

You're still equating the homosexual orientation with the ACTIONS. A drunkard is a person that drinks too much. A homosexual is not by default a person that has homosexual sex too much(or at all...which I guess would be the same thing in this case)[/quote]
You need to learn some basic theology.
God is ALL GOOD.
Evil and disorder are privations, something lacking a due good, which ought to be present.
Sin is that which is opposed to God.

God does not create disordered inclinations towards that which is sinful (opposed to God).
This is true whether we are speaking of homosexuality or anything else.

[rkwright]

[quote name='Socrates' post='1502254' date='Apr 17 2008, 09:39 PM']You need to learn some basic theology.
God is ALL GOOD.
Evil and disorder are privations, something lacking a due good, which ought to be present.
Sin is that which is opposed to God.

God does not create disordered inclinations towards that which is sinful (opposed to God).
This is true whether we are speaking of homosexuality or anything else.[/quote]

hmm... I don't have a theology degree, but something seems a bit off on your definitions. Can you provide some source that these definitions are correct?

Can something which is lacking in goodness not be opposed to God?

I've always thought that evil, lacking in goodness = sin.

[Socrates]

[quote name='rkwright' post='1502317' date='Apr 17 2008, 09:57 PM']hmm... I don't have a theology degree, but something seems a bit off on your definitions. Can you provide some source that these definitions are correct?

Can something which is lacking in goodness not be opposed to God?

I've always thought that evil, lacking in goodness = sin.[/quote]
?? How does that contradict what I wrote?
Sin is evil, and is lacking in goodness.

[rkwright]

[quote name='Socrates' post='1502322' date='Apr 17 2008, 10:01 PM']?? How does that contradict what I wrote?
Sin is evil, and is lacking in goodness.[/quote]

Compare that with the quote from Benedict you posted earlier, where he stated that homosexual inclination was a disorder, not a sin. You're above definitions seem to say that evil=disorder=sin.

[Alycin]

[quote name='Alycin' post='1501513' date='Apr 16 2008, 11:59 PM']I don't think that because someone has some weird mutated gene, that means that God is responsible for their "defect", so to speak. The fall of man is the reason everything has been slowly deteriorating since the beginning of time... sin is responsible, our sin. So someone being born with a predisposition to becoming eating disordered, sexually disordered, alcohol addicted, or anything else... it's not because "God made them that way", it's because sin has been screwing things up for forever, and it effected everything... even our genes.
I could be way off though.[/quote]