Stoicism And Christianity

[Innocent]

At times when I feel discouraged, reading Marcus Aurelius' [i]Meditations[/i] cheers me up a bit. So I was wondering, how much of Stoicism is compatible with Christianity?

Is Stoicism itself not the best way to go, I wonder? In C.S. Lewis' Till We Have Faces, there was a character, called The Fox, I believe who was depicted as a stoic. Though he was quite noble a character, I feel that C.S. Lewis was trying to say that for all his virtue, he still had something lacking. I have heard other fans of Lewis say that he was of the opinion that men don't have to aim to be Stoic, rather they must desire to have humility, like Christ.

On a related note, I learnt that C.S. Lewis in one of his essays talks about something he calls the "Stoic Fallacy" which is the belief that if a person does not exhibit maximum virtue in any situation, he had failed morally. But I couldn't find out exactly from which essay this comes from. Can anyone point out which essay it is from?

[MC IMaGiNaZUN]

I wish I could help in some way.

It is clear that there is much in stoicism that is compatible with Christianity, as you have found. However...

to relly on our own virtue or goodness is self righteousness.

Christ is our righteousness, benevellonce, goodness, and it is by his grace that we are transformed to his image.

SHALOM
Bro Mark

[Innocent]

[quote name='MC IMaGiNaZUN' post='1502719' date='Apr 19 2008, 01:57 AM']to relly on our own virtue or goodness is self righteousness.
Christ is our righteousness, benevellonce, goodness, and it is by his grace that we are transformed to his image.[/quote]

Good points. Okay, then, if one substitutes abandonment to Divine Providence and reliance on the Grace of God instead of utter reliance on one's own virtue, what other stumbling blocks are there?

Is it possible to be Stoic in a Christian way? I suppose the main thing that is attractive about Stoicism is that they can face pain without buckling under it, and that they seem to have a calm mind at all times, but on the other hand, these two effects are usually caused by a life of sincere Christian prayer, too, and so I suppose it's really superfluous to want to be Stoic.

Whatever is good in Stoicism is already contained in Christianity, I'm sure. A Christian can suffer stoically even when he is bearing the suffering lovingly. The way Mel Gibson depicted Our Lady in the [i]Passion of the Christ[/i] film, her suffering, full of love, is also strong, and she does not break under it.

I suppose the best we can do is admire Stoicism as a manly philosophy that tried to make sense of life with the limited knowledge of God they possessed, but since we have actually seen God face to face, the original Stoicism can never work for us, because we now have something better.

[Apotheoun]

"In accord with this ontology, the Stoics, like the Epicureans, make God material. But while the Epicureans think the gods are too busy being blessed and happy to be bothered with the governance of the universe (Epicurus, Letter to Menoeceus 123–4), the Stoic God is immanent throughout the whole of creation and directs its development down to the smallest detail. God is identical with one of the two ungenerated and indestructible first principles (archai) of the universe. One principle is matter which they regard as utterly unqualified and inert. It is that which is acted upon. God is identified with an eternal reason (logos, Diog. Laert. 44B ) or intelligent designing fire (Aetius, 46A) which structures matter in accordance with Its plan."

Taken from: [url="http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/stoicism/"][u]The Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy[/u][/url]

Both the materialism of Stoicism and its deterministic approach to existence are incompatible with Christian doctrine.

[Saint Therese]

The problem that I see is the de-valuation of the meaning/value of suffering. If we follow Jesus's example we are not to stoicly withstand suffering, but to embrace it out of love of him. Seriously, Jesus didn't stoicly suffer, he SUFFERED, intensely, and what power it had.