Carmel Closing

[EWIE]

For those interested. The Indianapolis Carmel is closing. Such a shame that the order will be losing that gorgeous Carmelite building.

[Gemma]

[quote name='EWIE' post='1497904' date='Apr 12 2008, 01:06 PM']For those interested. The Indianapolis Carmel is closing. Such a shame that the order will be losing that gorgeous Carmelite building.[/quote]

Suppression doesn't happen overnight. Where will the nuns be going? They may have to have a caretaker for the building until it sells.

There are also plenty of new orders who can use the building.

Sorry to hear it, but I'm not surprised. (Please, folks, don't jump down my throat for saying that)!

BTW, EWIE--where'd you find your avatar? I'd been looking all over for that particular pic.

Blessings,
Gemma

[Graciela]

[quote name='EWIE' post='1497904' date='Apr 12 2008, 12:06 PM']For those interested. The Indianapolis Carmel is closing. Such a shame that the order will be losing that gorgeous Carmelite building.[/quote]

Carmelite sisters moving to Oldenburg

Mary Milz/Eyewitness News

Marion County - The Carmelites of Indianapolis have called Indianapolis home for 75 years. They've lived in a monastery on Cold Spring Road doing God's work through prayer and contemplation.

The nine Catholic sisters, whose median age is in the mid-70s, are moving. This summer they'll relocate to a building on the Franciscan sisters' property in Oldenburg, Indiana.

Prioress Sister Jean Alice McGoff said of the decision, "It takes a lot to run a place like this. Even though we've been able to live a life of prayer, we felt it was better to make the transition when we could do it for ourselves, we have the energy and we're well."

Also key is the Archdiocese of Indianapolis' offer to buy their property for a seminary. The seminary will house men preparing for the priesthood at nearby Marian College.

Sister Jean Alice said,"The fact this building would continue to be a house of worship was important to us. And we just felt it was a gift of God."

She and the other sisters are no strangers to change. Until the early 60s, they were cloistered, living behind the thick stone walls of the monastery, which they themselves maintained.

"We were always faithful to our life of prayer, but we did a lot of work to save money," Sister Jean Alice said. "I learned to push a wheelbarrow, dig up and cut down trees, transplant trees. I learned to use all kinds of tools - hammers and saws."

The sisters greeted visitors through a window with a thick screen, venturing out only for emergencies. That began to change in the mid-60s along with changes in the Catholic church. The Carmelites gradually opened up, having face-to-face interactions with visitors. They also began watching TV and reading the newspaper.

While the sisters still lead simple, mostly private lives, they're well read and, well connected thru their website, praythenews.org.

The sisters launched it as a way to introduce women to their way of life.

"Sometimes when you set out to do a goal, something else develops and that's what happened," Sister Jean Alice said.

While the website didn't result in any new vocations, it did draw worldwide attention, which was a bit overwhelming for the publicity-shy sisters.

Sister Jean Alice laughed, recalling one of the media requests: "and now we were going to be on the Today Show and I just said, 'Sisters, please don't do this!'"

As they do every Sunday, the sisters invited friends and visitors to join them for Easter Mass, but this time there were special prayers for the sisters. Visiting priest Father Tom Widner noted their leaving and influence on the community.

"They're just warm and affectionate and very considerate of people and loving. It's a loss for the local church and Indianapolis," he said.

Mary Ann Grogan, who's known the sisters for years, talked about the monastery being "a quiet space...and we like to think we take some of their goodness into our busy world."

Carolyn Fay agreed. "On a personal note, these sisters are my sisters and I'll miss them very much. They've introduced me to so many ways of looking at spirituality and finding God in each other."

Asked what message she wanted to share, Sister Jean Alice said, "There's a reverence in me and I think all the sisters, for every human being no matter who they are, we are all God-bearers."

She said while the sisters would take down their web site after moving, they would continue to do God's work, just from a different house of prayer. {End of report}

Good news that the building will remain in use as a seminary.

This is the second CCA Carmel this year that has had to leave their monastery and relocate to another place because they had become too old to take care of the property. Really it feels like it is not a closing, since the community is staying together. Elysburg PA Carmel also moved to Danville PA as a group. When Brooklyn Carmel closed in the 1990's, their nuns dispersed to different Carmels which feels like a really difficult and different way of closing a monastery.

[EWIE]

[quote name='Gemma' date='Apr 12 2008, 01:36 PM' post='1498036'

BTW, EWIE--where'd you find your avatar? I'd been looking all over for that particular pic.

I was first intoduced to it in high school, then when I entered my religious community, it was again given to me by someone else. Then again and again. Seems to have popped up at all the junctures of my life.

I have a picture in my computer and can send it to you if you want.

[jkaands]

Does anyone know if the Carmel will continue to accept applicants?

I, for one, thought that the building looked very impractical and forbidding, and was probably always hard for the typical Carmelite sized community to maintain. I would also be interested in what is happening to the traditional Carmels. Many of these don't have websites and many seem small. What is their average age? Have any of [i]these[/i] folded? A fast review of the Guide reveals about 12-15 Carmels, of all persuasions, with 8 nuns and fewer, some down to 4 nuns. Some Carmels don't list their numbers. The Indy Carmel has 10.

Also: a correction and an address for the [b]Guide to Religious Ministries:
[/b]
It's $10.00, still a bargain, from:

Catholic News Publishing Co
210 North Avenue
New Rochelle NY
10801

914-632-1220

email: info@religiousministries.com

website: www.ReligiousMinistries.com, with a not-very-good search engine(the last time I checked), which is why I recommend the book.

Edited April 12, 2008 by jkaands

[Guest ambrose]

A Carmelite friar I knew spoke highly of these sisters, and he was a prayerful, very holy man. Let's be charitable and pray for their new direction.

BTW I'd really like to see this building now it's been mentioned, are there photos available? (I did google, no luck). Are they the sisters who have that big old castle, or is that another Carmel?

Funny, today I visited the Philadelphia Museum that contains a French Cloister inside. While beautiful, it really affirmed to me how external appearances aren't everything, because it didn't *feel* holy because Our Lord wasn't There. (well, I know He is Everywhere, I hope you know what I mean).

[Gemma]

[quote name='ambrose' post='1498288' date='Apr 12 2008, 09:46 PM']A Carmelite friar I knew spoke highly of these sisters, and he was a prayerful, very holy man. Let's be charitable and pray for their new direction.

BTW I'd really like to see this building now it's been mentioned, are there photos available? (I did google, no luck). Are they the sisters who have that big old castle, or is that another Carmel?

Funny, today I visited the Philadelphia Museum that contains a French Cloister inside. While beautiful, it really affirmed to me how external appearances aren't everything, because it didn't *feel* holy because Our Lord wasn't There. (well, I know He is Everywhere, I hope you know what I mean).[/quote]

Their community was the subject of the book "Cloister and Community."

The Indy library might have pix.

praying4carmel has a pic of it for her avatar.

Blessings,
Gemma

[Chiquitunga]

a couple pages on them from the Carmel in the US book

[img]http://img120.imageshack.us/img120/4379/carmeloftheresurrectionvc4.jpg[/img]

[img]http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/6688/carmeloftheresurrectionkq2.jpg[/img]

Interesting, it says at the end, notable persons have visited this Carmel like Mother Mary Elias and Bishop Fulton J. Sheen. That statue of St. Teresa looks beautiful.

[jkaands]

I can't imagine trying to heat that interior room where the statue of (I presume) Mother Teresa is! It also looks dark and gloomy.

Here's the link to the Oldenburg Franciscans. They look like they have quite a lot of masonry, too, plenty to spare!

[url="http://oldenburgfranciscans.org/"]http://oldenburgfranciscans.org/[/url]

Edited April 13, 2008 by jkaands

[praying4carmel]

I waited to share this news until it got out formally. They told me 2 months ago when I visited them and asked me not to spill the beans until after they had notified the other Carmels.

The Building will be used as it was purchased by the Archdiocese for the use of their seminarians. It was too much for them to handle. They are down to 9 sisters the youngerst is 51 and then an age gap to 75+. They are moving into the Former Postulancy house of the Oldenburg Franciscans in May.

This is heart wrenching for them.. and for me as well...I will share more Tommorrow when I have time..

P4C

[Guest ambrose]

Thanks for posting photos! Any photos of the outside?

Oldenburg - what an amazing building!

[HollyDolly]

Sorry to hear the sisters had to close their monastery due to increasing age,but at least the Church will be able to use it,and the sisters will be all together. What are CCA Carmels,Are those the Calced Carmelites?
In San Antonio we have the Discaled Carmelite Nuns,who live near Culebra. They used to have a convent on kentucky Street down near the National Shrine of the Little Flower which was built in the 1920s,I think consrtuction started in 1927 or 28. They moved because in their case, they would have druggies stopping by trying to borrow money or steal from the sisters.Don't know how many nuns they have,but they are getting vocations as far as I know.

[praying4carmel]

Please pray for my friends as they move to Oldenburg..

I was fortunate to be able to visit in February. I have known these sisters since 1985, when I first went to visit them and speak to them about my Vocation. Unfortunately at that time even though I had a vocation, I was not ready to embark upon it. The Lord had alot of work to do in me yet. Last year when He Called again and the Pieces were finally in place in the time of His Choosing, Indpls was the first place I contacted. I was very grateful that the sisters Invited me for a visit, and it was wonderful to see them. They let me participate fully in their Horarium, Meals, Prayer, Work, and Silence. There is Love and Laughter, as well as Peace and Deep, Deep, prayer.

They were midwives for me; that 's the best way that I can explain it. Sr. Helen carefully planted the seed of my Vocation, watered it and waited in faith trusting in our Lord and His timing.

Now here I am in active discernment, and amazed of the changes that the Lord has brought about. I can honestly say that I love these women dearly, their prayers have been so good for me and for others. They have done a wonderful work. I Pray for them each day and night.

I am grateful that the building was not sold to some celebrity Tony Robbins type person who likes castles. It's a beautiful building, It's Not dark and forbidding, There are alot of picture windows that look out to a traditional cloister, and garden. The grounds are lovely as well with hermitage and gardens and Pond. But it's alot of work to keep up, flat roofs, boilers etc.

I really am at a loss for words..my heart aches. The Happy Part is that their praying will not stop.

JK, I think Vocations are done.

[EWIE]

".....I am grateful that the building was not sold to some celebrity Tony Robbins type person who likes castles. "

Thank heavens for that.

"........It's a beautiful building, It's Not dark and forbidding, There are alot of picture windows that look out to a traditional cloister, and garden. The grounds are lovely as well with hermitage and gardens and Pond.


They do not wear the traditional Teresian habit though. Is that right?

".......But it's alot of work to keep up, flat roofs, boilers etc."

So true, even more remarkable is that the nuns built it. I may be wrong, but I seem to recall seeing photos of the nuns themselves doing a lot of the building. Correct me if I'm wrong.

[brendan1104]

I'm sorry praying4carmel, I know how much they mean to you. I know you're going to disagree with me here.

But they seem to be in the same spot as what happened to Reno and Cleveland: a self-destructive immersion in the false spirit of Vatican Two, none of which was asked for by the Council or the Magisterium.

They took down their grilles, threw off their already-modified habit and then published (a practice now strongly condemned) an inclusive language breviary. I also read Cloister and Community.

They just won't get any (especially young) vocations unless they resume the Teresian habit and enclosure.

Just look at Phatmass for proof: many of the young women have entered SSME, SSEW, PCPA or other similar communities in that they're not traditionalist, but traditional in their authentic religious life.

I don't believe St. Teresa of Avila if she were alive today and saw the Indianapolis sisters would imagine them to be Discalced Carmelite Nuns.

Unfortunately, they've already spent so much money and time trying to figure out how they can save their community when there is a simple answer, and now they're forced to sell their beloved monastery... something which could have been avoided if they had stayed the course. As a wise Jesuit formation director told me, "Virtue is in the median." And so it is.