Generation Gap Shapes American Catholics

[Socrates]

[quote name='Ash Wednesday' post='1494348' date='Apr 7 2008, 04:29 PM']They write as though, opposed to youth, the older generation cared about going to church -- which generation are they talking about? Our grandparents?

The older generation, i.e. baby boomers, aren't exactly known for their traditional churchgoing ways, either.[/quote]
It was the baby-boomers who largely began defecting from or dissenting with the Church in large numbers. Presented with the wishy-washy watered-down religion of their elders, of course many of the younger generations were given no solid foundation, and now are lost, and effectively or actually stop being Catholic.
While this is true in much of the Church, I think there is a growing Catholic revival in areas in which orthodoxy is taught and practiced.

In places where "liberal Catholicism" dominates, things will only get worse.
If my only experience of Catholicism were wishy-washy "liberal Catholicism," it's doubtful I'd currently have anything at all to do with the Church.

I think the media likes to present "liberal Catholicism" as the wave of the future - as if the direction of the Church will be decided by those who don't bother to go to church.
And unfortunately, I also think too many "conservative Catholics" prefer wallowing in gloom and despair to evangelizing.

[quote name='Ash Wednesday' post='1494419' date='Apr 7 2008, 05:46 PM']Also -- the Catholicism of many hispanics is cultural Catholicism, so it's hard to compare with average American Catholicism as well, as far as the motivation behind devotion or church attendance. So to me it seems hard to guage if one group is more "devout" than the other, when the ways average Americans and immigrants approach the faith may be different. To me it would seem that there are more hispanics filling the pews in proportion to average Americans simply because U.S. the population of hispanics is rising.[/quote]
The number of hispanics in my town has risen sharply over the past couple decades, yet hardly any of them can be seen in our Catholic church.
I'm afraid most hispanics are simply "culturally Catholic" but don't actually practice the faith for the most part. Of course many Americans are "cultural Catholics" too.

[CatherineM]

I got this in my Ecclesiology class today from Joseph Eagan's book, "Restoration and Renewal: The Church in the Third Millennium." The church will be radically demographically different than the church in the recent past. He lists several key things. "1. no longer a ‘Western’ Church but a Church of the poor in impoverished
countries – “Of more than one billion Catholics by the year 2000, roughly twothirds
will live in Africa, Asia, Central and South America. Since the majority in
these continents are poor, the Catholic Church will increasingly be a church of
the poor.”
2. free church – “Catholics will more and more make their own free conscience
decisions to remain in the church or to leave it.”
3. spiritual church – “…that satisfies the deeply felt religious needs of its
members, that nourishes them with the Word of God in the Bible, as well as
with sacraments, that provides faith communities in which to find and
experience God.”
4. ecumenical church – “…since the Catholic Church’s relation to other
Christian churches will change as faith and theological agreement become
ever more evident and the consequent scandal of separation in an
increasingly secular world becomes more intolerable.”
5. church of the laity – “…the third millennium will be the age of the laity and of
lay ministry, profoundly altering present church structures and relationships.”
6. church of young people – “Finally, it will be a church of young people, at
least in the Third World, where 42% of the population is under 15 years of
age!”

That 42% under the age of 15 is staggering. I think the church can go for renewal or schism.

[kujo]

[quote name='Justin86' post='1493015' date='Apr 5 2008, 05:00 PM']1. If Hispanics worry about being considered a separate ethnic Church then they need to abolish Spanish Masses in the United States.[/quote]

True. I think if Hispanics are concerned with being respected in America, they need to start speaking English and stop waving the flags of other countries.

[catholicinsd]

[quote name='Justin86' post='1493015' date='Apr 5 2008, 04:00 PM']1. If Hispanics worry about being considered a separate ethnic Church then they need to abolish Spanish Masses in the United States.[/quote]

I have agree with Justin on this. Foreigners will never learn English if we keep catering to this handicap.

[CatherineM]

My Godparents were from Mexico, but they only spoke English in their homes, and attended English only masses. Of course there were no Spanish masses then. All 5 of their kids got advanced college degrees. If they had only spoke Spanish at home, I'm not sure the same would have happened. Immigration isn't easy. It wasn't easy for me, and they at least mostly speak English up here, but most of the time, people will tell you that they immigrated to give their kids a chance at a better life. If that is so, then you have to give them the best chance to succeed, learn English. They in no way lost their cultural heritage by doing so.

[StColette]

[quote name='Ash Wednesday' post='1494348' date='Apr 7 2008, 05:29 PM']They write as though, opposed to youth, the older generation cared about going to church -- which generation are they talking about? Our grandparents?

The older generation, i.e. baby boomers, aren't exactly known for their traditional churchgoing ways, either.[/quote]

I was wondering the same thing. My dad's generation (born in the 50s and grew up in Catholic school during the 60s) isn't a very active generation at all. Now our grandparents generation is a completely different story. And well now our generation is showing a renewed thirst for the faith, from what I have seen.

Springtime takes place in some places way before it does in others. I've seen the new Springtime cropping up in certain areas. It just takes time for it to spread throughout.

[Paladin D]

[quote name='catholicinsd' post='1495443' date='Apr 9 2008, 10:43 AM']I have agree with Justin on this. Foreigners will never learn English if we keep catering to this handicap.[/quote]

My European ancestors came to this country and had to learn English, there was no excuse. I'm not saying English is the easiest language to learn, but it's certainly not impossible. I have no problem living in a society with multiple languages, but I find it annoying that someone expects me to learn their language just because they believe they're the 'exception to the norm'. English is the majority spoken language, please learn it.

Edited April 9, 2008 by Paladin D

[MissScripture]

My grandparents came as immigrants and learned the language. Their entire families did. My grandpa's brother cannot spell very well, but he speaks and reads English perfectly fine, and, honestly, I find his spelling absolutely adorable, because he WRITES with a German accent, since everything is spelled phonetically. But all of them are absolutely irate that people will come to this country and expect things to be in their language. For one thing, it's shooting yourself in the foot, because it's going to make it that much harder to find a decent paying job and support your family.

[somethingfishy]

I don't think there's a problem with having Spanish masses. Generally your first language is the language you think in, and pray in. Mass should be in the language of the people, and there are a lot of people in the U.S. whose second (or third or fourth) language is English and they'd prefer to have Mass in a language they're more comfortable with. How is this wrong? Immigrants have enough hardship without getting flak from the Church.

[Paladin D]

[quote name='somethingfishy' post='1495817' date='Apr 9 2008, 08:01 PM']I don't think there's a problem with having Spanish masses. Generally your first language is the language you think in, and pray in. Mass should be in the language of the people, and there are a lot of people in the U.S. whose second (or third or fourth) language is English and they'd prefer to have Mass in a language they're more comfortable with. How is this wrong? Immigrants have enough hardship without getting flak from the Church.[/quote]

I don't have a problem with ethnic Masses actually, I mean there are Polish and Italian Masses as well. What I do have a problem with is when they (no matter which ethnicity) want society to conform to their language. This is different from bringing one's culture, cuisine, tradition, etc., which makes this country a 'melting pot' of the world... thus unique and something special to treasure. You can teach your kids your native tongue, I wish I knew how to speak fluent Polish (someday I will), but make sure you know how to communicate in English and not force others to try and learn your lanauge in an a predominately English speaking country.

By the way, welcome to Phatmass.

Edited April 10, 2008 by Paladin D