Lying To Nazis

[Jesus_lol]

[quote name='aalpha1989' date='07 May 2010 - 09:47 PM' timestamp='1273294061' post='2106720']
How are you going to do that when guns are illegal?
[/quote]

guns aren't illegal in canada, we have 5.




unless you mean in a period accurate nazi occupied country with a firearms ban? use anything you can. lots of axes, knives, etc lying around the house. it may be more messy, but it is the same morally.

[aalpha1989]

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='08 May 2010 - 12:49 AM' timestamp='1273294186' post='2106723']
I guess he'll just have to drown his sorrows in strong liquo- oh wait....... alcohol is immoral and probably illegal as well.

Maybe he can beat them to death with a crowbar.
[/quote]

crowbars are sharp and have also been registered and/or confiscated by the government.

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='aalpha1989' date='07 May 2010 - 11:52 PM' timestamp='1273294320' post='2106727']
crowbars are sharp and have also been registered and/or confiscated by the government.
[/quote]
How about cricket bats? They like cricket in Europe, right?

[aalpha1989]

[quote name='Jesus_lol' date='08 May 2010 - 12:50 AM' timestamp='1273294217' post='2106725']
guns aren't illegal in canada, we have 5.




unless you mean in a period accurate nazi occupied country with a firearms ban? use anything you can. lots of axes, knives, etc lying around the house. it may be more messy, but it is the same morally.
[/quote]

Haha, you were right. I meant Canada.

[quote name='Nihil Obstat' date='08 May 2010 - 12:54 AM' timestamp='1273294482' post='2106731']
How about cricket bats? They like cricket in Europe, right?
[/quote]

Ok, cricket bats it is!

[Jesus_lol]

[quote name='aalpha1989' date='07 May 2010 - 10:01 PM' timestamp='1273294872' post='2106738']
Haha, you were right. I meant Canada.



Ok, cricket bats it is!
[/quote]




[img]http://www.goodmoviestorent.net/date/shaun-of-the-dead.jpg[/img]

[ardillacid]

[quote name='Resurrexi' date='07 May 2010 - 02:27 AM' timestamp='1273213643' post='2106209']
I consider lying morally wrong under all circumstances.
[/quote]
If you wouldn't lie to save your friends' lives, then you really are a tool

[toledo_jesus]

wow, who voted to kill the jews?

If you are aware of what Nazis do to Jews then you lie through your German teeth when they ask you if there are any Jews in your house. You lie and lie and lie some more. Go to Confession if you [i]really [/i]feel bad about saving the lives of two innocent people from an oppressive genocidal regime...

Edited May 8, 2010 by toledo_jesus

[havok579257]

[quote name='sacredheartandbloodofjesus' date='08 May 2010 - 12:50 AM' timestamp='1273294209' post='2106724']
I would tell the Gestapo "I dont have any filthy pigs in my house!" Its true that I dont have pigs in my house instead I have Jewish human beings.
[/quote]


purposely being decitful is still lying.

[Sternhauser]

[quote name='havok579257' date='08 May 2010 - 09:47 AM' timestamp='1273330048' post='2106930']
purposely being decitful is still lying.
[/quote]

It is not.

~Sternhauser

[havok579257]

[quote name='Sternhauser' date='08 May 2010 - 06:42 PM' timestamp='1273358536' post='2107147']
It is not.

~Sternhauser
[/quote]


deliberately misleading: intentionally misleading or fraudulent
Given to cheating or deceiving
the act or practice of deceiving; concealment or distortion of the truth for the purpose of misleading; duplicity; fraud; cheating: Once she exposed their deceit, no one ever trusted them again.


so yes it is.

[MIKolbe]

[quote name='Sternhauser' date='08 May 2010 - 06:42 PM' timestamp='1273358536' post='2107147']
It is not.

~Sternhauser
[/quote]


[quote name='havok579257' date='08 May 2010 - 06:57 PM' timestamp='1273359473' post='2107152']

so yes it is.
[/quote]


I saw a bugs bunny cartoon like this once.....

[Nihil Obstat]

[quote name='havok579257' date='08 May 2010 - 09:47 AM' timestamp='1273330048' post='2106930']
purposely being decitful is still lying.
[/quote]
I showed you that that is technically incorrect above.

You have to *speak a falsehood* with the intention of deceiving. If what you're saying isn't technically a falsehood, it's not technically a lie either.


Thanks for completely ignoring that earlier, by the way. Makes me feel so awesome.

Edited May 8, 2010 by Nihil Obstat

[Sternhauser]

[quote name='havok579257' date='08 May 2010 - 05:57 PM' timestamp='1273359473' post='2107152']
deliberately misleading: intentionally misleading or fraudulent
Given to cheating or deceiving
the act or practice of deceiving; concealment or distortion of the truth for the purpose of misleading; duplicity; fraud; cheating: Once she exposed their deceit, no one ever trusted them again.


so yes it is.
[/quote]

Is deliberately misleading or deceiving "lying?" If you have no ammunition, but someone breaks into your house and you rack a pump-action shotgun, and he flees because your action has caused him to believe you are armed with a lethal weapon, (which you are not), have you lied? No words were spoken. If you wear shabby clothes and sit on a street corner, and people assume you are homeless, have you lied, even if you dressed like a homeless person to purposefully deceive them? If there is an intruder at your door, and you ask him, "Do you think you can outrun a German shepherd? Would you like a ten second head start, or not?" and then whistle, prompting him the intruder to run, have you lied? I will side with the Catechism on this one: "A [i]lie [/i]consists in speaking a falsehood with the intention of deceiving." Those behaviors, or asking those questions, while intentionally deceptive, do not involve speaking falsehoods.

And for those who not only would lie to Nazis, or call people "sick" for refusing to lie to save a life, St. Thomas speaks to you from [i]De Mendacio. [/i]He rightly answered the "Nazis at the door" canard hundreds of years before the NSDAP came into being. In this poll, only three people have. That is a real shame.
[i]
"[/i]And as to those who take it ill and are indignant that one should refuse to tell a lie, and thereby slay his own soul in order that another may grow old in the flesh; what if by our committing theft, what if by committing adultery, a person might be delivered from death: are we therefore to steal, to commit whoredom? They cannot prevail with themselves in a case of this kind: namely, if a person should bring a halter and demand that one should yield to his carnal lust,declaring that he will hang himself unless his request be granted: they cannot prevail with themselves to comply for the sake of, as they say,saving a life. If this is absurd and wicked, why should a man corrupt his own soul with a lie in order that another may live in the body, when, if he were to givehis body to be corrupted with such an object, he would in the judgment of all men be held guilty of nefarious turpitude?"

[url="http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/1312.htm"]http://www.newadvent...athers/1312.htm[/url]

~Sternhauser

Edited May 9, 2010 by Sternhauser

[havok579257]

[quote name='Sternhauser' date='08 May 2010 - 07:52 PM' timestamp='1273362728' post='2107185']
Is deliberately misleading or deceiving "lying?" If you have no ammunition, but someone breaks into your house and you rack a pump-action shotgun, and he flees because your action has caused him to believe you are armed with a lethal weapon, (which you are not), have you lied? No words were spoken. If you wear shabby clothes and sit on a street corner, and people assume you are homeless, have you lied, even though the clothes have concealed the truth that you are not homeless? If there is an intruder at your door, and you ask him, "Do you think you can outrun a German shepherd? Would you like a ten second head start, or not?" and then whistle, prompting him the intruder to run, have you lied? I will side with the Catechism on this one: "A [i]lie [/i]consists in speaking a falsehood with the intention of deceiving." Those behaviors, or asking those questions, while intentionally deceptive, do not involve speaking falsehoods.

And for those who not only would lie to Nazis, or call people "sick" for refusing to lie to save a life, St. Thomas speaks to you from [i]De Mendacio.

"[/i]And as to those who take it ill and are indignant that one should refuse to tell a lie, and thereby slay his own soul in order that another may grow old in the flesh; what if by our committing theft, what if by committing adultery, a person might be delivered from death: are we therefore to steal, to commit whoredom? They cannot prevail with themselves in a case of this kind: namely, if a person should bring a halter and demand that one should yield to his carnal lust,declaring that he will hang himself unless his request be granted: they cannot prevail with themselves to comply for the sake of, as they say,saving a life. If this is absurd and wicked, why should a man corrupt his own soul with a lie in order that another may live in the body, when, if he were to givehis body to be corrupted with such an object, he would in the judgment of all men be held guilty of nefarious turpitude?"

[url="http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/1312.htm"]http://www.newadvent...athers/1312.htm[/url]

~Sternhauser
[/quote]


except in the above examples by the other posters they would be speaking a falsehood with the intent to decieve. when the nazi's ask if there are any jews hiding here and someone says only me and my brothers live here is a lie. since he is lying in saying that his brother's live with him since they are really jews and not his brothers. the person who never before referred to jews as his brother's suddenly now claims they are his brothers so he does not have to out them is a lie.

or saying that there are no filthy jews here but in actuality there are jews there is a lie. just because that person would not describe jews as filthy does not mean they did not lie when they said there were no jews there.

[havok579257]

[quote name='Sternhauser' date='08 May 2010 - 07:52 PM' timestamp='1273362728' post='2107185']
Is deliberately misleading or deceiving "lying?" If you have no ammunition, but someone breaks into your house and you rack a pump-action shotgun, and he flees because your action has caused him to believe you are armed with a lethal weapon, (which you are not), have you lied? No words were spoken. If you wear shabby clothes and sit on a street corner, and people assume you are homeless, have you lied, even though the clothes have concealed the truth that you are not homeless? If there is an intruder at your door, and you ask him, "Do you think you can outrun a German shepherd? Would you like a ten second head start, or not?" and then whistle, prompting him the intruder to run, have you lied? I will side with the Catechism on this one: "A [i]lie [/i]consists in speaking a falsehood with the intention of deceiving." Those behaviors, or asking those questions, while intentionally deceptive, do not involve speaking falsehoods.

And for those who not only would lie to Nazis, or call people "sick" for refusing to lie to save a life, St. Thomas speaks to you from [i]De Mendacio.

"[/i]And as to those who take it ill and are indignant that one should refuse to tell a lie, and thereby slay his own soul in order that another may grow old in the flesh; what if by our committing theft, what if by committing adultery, a person might be delivered from death: are we therefore to steal, to commit whoredom? They cannot prevail with themselves in a case of this kind: namely, if a person should bring a halter and demand that one should yield to his carnal lust,declaring that he will hang himself unless his request be granted: they cannot prevail with themselves to comply for the sake of, as they say,saving a life. If this is absurd and wicked, why should a man corrupt his own soul with a lie in order that another may live in the body, when, if he were to givehis body to be corrupted with such an object, he would in the judgment of all men be held guilty of nefarious turpitude?"

[url="http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/1312.htm"]http://www.newadvent...athers/1312.htm[/url]

~Sternhauser
[/quote]


if someone refuses to lie to the nazi's, yet hides jews in the house, then they would have the jewish blood on their hands. knowing you will tell the nazi's the truth and still hiding jews means your complient in their murder.