How To Get Out Of The Perpetual Discernment Group

[Marieteresa]

Just wondering if there are any other individuals in this same boat of perpetual discernment. Also suggestions on removing one self from that group. Oh for those who don't know what perpetual discernment group is....Its a person who pretty much stays in discernment and doesn't take any real action toward religious life, makes excuses to why a community isn't a perfect fit. Any suggestions would be great!

[Thomist-in-Training]

Sort of... I'm terribly scared that I've gotten into an awful habit of inquiring after orders merely to pass the time until I can visit somewhere.

Well, if there is somewhere that seems almost right, and the only thing that puts you off is some detail which does not bear on what is fitting in the worship and service of God, I would say apply to enter there, and see how it goes. If it's wrong, then leave. I know this is very bold advice and you can accuse me for it if you like because I've never done it myself. But this is something that a sister sent to me (she fulfils a quasi-spiritual-directorly role):

[quote]I've taken up reading Suor Maria Consolata Betrone again because she had a very interesting mission. She started with a desire to be very good but when she started going to school became swayed by the world, boys etc. She herself said that she would have been lost if not a particular grace had saved her (her future spiritual director told her that he saw Our Lady with St. Joseph interceed for her conversion due to Suor Consolata's devotion to the rosary). Suor Consolata finally plucked up the courage to enter the convent after terrible persecution from the family. Entered into 2 institutes (even the novitiate) but left because she couldn't find peace. Finally she was advised to enter into the Cappuccine Clarissans, [ed.--Poor Clares] I report what her spiritual director wrote in her biography:

[ed.--my transl. from an Italian passage]
[quote]> Pierina [her baptismal name], who was so devoted to St. Joseph, entered the "Monastero di Borgo Po" at Turin on the Feast of her Patron, April 17, 1929, putting herself under his special protection. But while she had entered with enthusiasm the Daughters of Mary Auxiliatrix & at Cottolengo, she admitted then "Nothing attracts me to the Capuchins." And really that is an authentic sign of a vocation. It is the Lord, and He alone, Who calls the soul to where He has marked since eternity the place of its rest. In "true" vocations there is nothing of the human.[/quote]

It was the path God had wanted for her and she finally became a professed religious. Suor Consolata was inspired to take on a special mission from God - to be a victim of love, especially for her brethren religious and priests. God allowed her to suffer all the temptations the religious of all times would suffer - temptations against obedience, chastity, repugnance, aridity, etc etc, which she fought and won, until her death. [/quote]

(This is the Sr. Consolata of the Unceasing Act of Love--"Jesus, Mary, I love you, save souls!")

HTH a little!

[gloriagurl]

[quote name='Marieteresa' post='1480223' date='Mar 19 2008, 05:48 PM']Just wondering if there are any other individuals in this same boat of perpetual discernment. Also suggestions on removing one self from that group. Oh for those who don't know what perpetual discernment group is....Its a person who pretty much stays in discernment and doesn't take any real action toward religious life, makes excuses to why a community isn't a perfect fit. Any suggestions would be great![/quote]


The absolute best piece of discernment advice I have ever received was "Dont judge the life, just live it". Take the plunge...go, LIVE with a community. There is simply no better way to know something than to live it.

It's quite common for people to go live and then leave, but you can't leave unless you go....and obviously you can't stay either....unless you first go.

So go go go....be free and fearless.....God always goes before you.

[DameAgnes]

I second the "take the plunge" gameplan. As long as you stay in a holding pattern, you're keeping the Lord from guiding you. I recall I was literally about to enter a Poor Clare community when the Lord all but threw my husband into my arms (literally). Without going into details, if I hadn't made the serious move toward the monastic life, the circumstances of my husband and I ever meeting would probably not have happened...I mean...we lived a whole continent away from each other!

It took me "making a move" to set that particular play in motion.

Things you never in a million years think could possibly happen just fall into place when you give God the control. Seriously. People in my family STILL talk about the way my husband and I came together and marvel at it.

Edited March 19, 2008 by DameAgnes

[Mari Therese]

[quote name='Marieteresa' post='1480223' date='Mar 19 2008, 03:48 PM']Just wondering if there are any other individuals in this same boat of perpetual discernment. Also suggestions on removing one self from that group. Oh for those who don't know what perpetual discernment group is....Its a person who pretty much stays in discernment and doesn't take any real action toward religious life, makes excuses to why a community isn't a perfect fit. Any suggestions would be great![/quote]

You should go for it, if you get accepted to an order then you can assume that it's God's will. Believe me, you don't want to spend the rest of your life wonderig if you should of entered religious life. No community is ever perfect because it is a community of human beings:) A priest once told me that as long as you like most of the way the community lives, that's a good sign. The parts that you don't like will be part of your formation, because challenges can help you to grow.

Please don't be a perpetual discerner!

[Sister Rose Therese]

Just a word of caution on the just take the plunge thought.
You have a duty to discern whether this is God's will for you. You don't want to act just because you're tired of waiting.
It is always a matter of balance.
You need to discern whether joining a particular community is God's will for you. They need to discern whether they should accept you, but you can't leave this discision all up to them. That would be like diciding that it was God's will that you marry a particular man just because he asked you to marry him.
I think the problem often is that you can concentrate too much on the problems with the community and not enough on whether that is where God is calling you.
You can't be lazy in this, you have to seek the truth.
You can't be scrupulous in this, you have to seek the truth.
It isn't like God is trying to hide your vocation from you, he is calling you.
If you listen and obey he will tell you when it is right.

[AccountDeleted]

The only extra advice I can offer you is to ask Jesus to do it for you. Every time I try to do something myself, I seem to mess it up

For example, my confessor told me that my next step was to find a spiritual director, so I immediately set about doing this (on my own) when I realised that what the confessor had actually said to me was "Pray to God to send you a good spiritual director." This is a whole different thing!

So I took it to Jesus in prayer and told Him that I would make my efforts but that I would leave it up to Him to find the right one for me. I sent emails, made phone calls and left it in His hands. He took care of it for me, and today someone called me with the name of a director who has had experience with Religious and ex-Religious. He is an older priest and is very traditional. He sounds like a gift from God

So, ask Jesus to help you make the next step. Tell Him of your fears and ask Him to soothe them and to show you what you need to do to help ease them. If you don't know what is stopping you from moving forward, then ask Him what it is - He knows. If you really want to offer Him your life, start now by taking everything to Him in prayer.

Prayers and more prayers for you

Edited March 20, 2008 by nunsense

[praying4carmel]

I secone Nunsense's post..Do you have a spiritual Director to hold your feet to the fire so to speak!

[AccountDeleted]

You might try listening to this link too.

[url="http://www.religiouslife.com/free_audio.html"]AUDIOfile[/url] The full file is at the bottom of the page - click on download and save it as a mp3 file and then open with Windows Media.

I just found out that this priest, Father Thomas Nelson is the one whose name has been given to me as a possible spiritual director! He is national director of the Institute on Religious Life and has a licentiate in sacred theology from the Pontifical University of St. Thomas Aquinas in Rome! Wow - I sure hope he will take me on!

This audio is very informative, especially when he gets to the part about entering a religious order expecting to be joining a community of saints, when really what we are doing is entering a community of sinners (like ourselves). He also talks about fears and the lies of Satan.

Edited March 20, 2008 by nunsense

[shortnun]

I really second all the posts who have urged action toward prayer and spiritual direction. But I will have to disagree somewhat with the "go for it" folks. You see, "perpetual" is entirely subjective. Some people might think three years is "perpetually" discerning and others might not think that until it's been 30 years.

I'll speak from my own experience and the wisdom others have shared with me in prayer and counsel. I have thought about a religious vocation since fourth grade--so the past 16 years. I really began thinking about that as a life path (vocation) since high school. Then in the end of college, the past 5 years or so, I began to actually visit communities and have a spiritual director. For me, I do not think that my five years of discernment has been "perpetual" though I have certainly met vocation directors who have thought so. Yes, there have been times where I've run out of patience with myself (and God), but I see now how all this time is necessary for me to grow in holiness and a sense of who I am as a daughter of Christ.

If someone thinks that he/she is a perpetual discerner, I would seriously ask "why" and "how" they arrived at that decision. And furthermore, bring that to prayer in front of the Blessed Sacrament and to your spiritual director. There are some very valid reasons that God choses one person's discernment to be many years while another person's may be very short. Inaction due to a lack of trust in God is never a place we want to be. However, who are we to impose our expectations on the movement and working of the Holy Spirit when things aren't going as fast as we'd like?

[gloriagurl]

[quote name='shortnun' post='1481570' date='Mar 22 2008, 12:02 PM']I really second all the posts who have urged action toward prayer and spiritual direction. But I will have to disagree somewhat with the "go for it" folks. You see, "perpetual" is entirely subjective. Some people might think three years is "perpetually" discerning and others might not think that until it's been 30 years.

I'll speak from my own experience and the wisdom others have shared with me in prayer and counsel. I have thought about a religious vocation since fourth grade--so the past 16 years. I really began thinking about that as a life path (vocation) since high school. Then in the end of college, the past 5 years or so, I began to actually visit communities and have a spiritual director. For me, I do not think that my five years of discernment has been "perpetual" though I have certainly met vocation directors who have thought so. Yes, there have been times where I've run out of patience with myself (and God), but I see now how all this time is necessary for me to grow in holiness and a sense of who I am as a daughter of Christ.

If someone thinks that he/she is a perpetual discerner, I would seriously ask "why" and "how" they arrived at that decision. And furthermore, bring that to prayer in front of the Blessed Sacrament and to your spiritual director. There are some very valid reasons that God choses one person's discernment to be many years while another person's may be very short. Inaction due to a lack of trust in God is never a place we want to be. However, who are we to impose our expectations on the movement and working of the Holy Spirit when things aren't going as fast as we'd like? [/quote]

I think perhaps I did not say enough.....my "go go go" was not meant to mean "leap without looking".....and certainly one's path of discernment - how long, how short - is a very personal thing...and one person's epic journey is another's mere jaunt around the block....so to speak.

What I meant to convey is simply....when/if the time comes that there is a good and reasonable sense of "rightness" about a community....it's OK to "jump in", in other words....the place doesn't have to be perfect and the discerner doesn't have to be absolutely sure in order to try the vocation in a particular place. In fact the "trying" part is in the "clothing formula" of many Benedictine communities(and perhaps others as well)....when asked what she seeks the very soon to be novice answers (among other things)...."to try my vocation in this house" (and sometimes the name or city/location of the community is mentioned".

I have personal experience with jumping in TOO SOON...ignoring my own sense of "not rightness".....I did it once and it was a disaster...I wouldn't do it again myself nor would I encourage others to do so. If my previous post sounded like that was what I was encouraging, I apologize for my failure to properly articulate my thoughts. I promise to re-read my posts more carefully in the future.

Good thing no one listens to me anyway. <LOL>

[shortnun]

Gloriagurl, thanks for your clarifying post. I hope you don't think I came off too strongly against your "go, go, go" mentality. There is great prudence to be taken whenever making a life decision--just as there is a need to place all our trust in God.

You're 100% right, we don't have to be 100% sure that a community is "it." But at the same time, I've wondered why I've visited communities before but haven't been able to make that "jump." Again, this is just coming from my experience, but I began to question the authenticity of my vocation. But, in the process of much prayer, I've discovered that there were reasons I wasn't able to "jump"--you see, those communities (no matter how hard I wanted them to be) weren't "right" for me--they weren't the place that was going to lead me to happiness and wholeness and holiness. So I guess that's why I just wanted to give a little more caution behind the "jump in" mentality.

[dominicansoul]

I agree with Gloriagurl...if a congregation accepts you, then what is there but to assume this is the Will of God and go for it?

It's not gonna kill you if you take the plunge. It may be what a perpetual discerner needs to do to find out if they really do have a vocation --- or not!

It may be what God is calling them to do, just so they won't perpetually discern for the rest of their lives, (which is not really all that healthy...) And who knows, perhaps they will stay or perhaps they will go...but at least they tried...

[Marieteresa]

I just wanted to share this quote I came across on a website

In order to hear Him,
you must separate yourself from the question,
"what is in it for me?"
Otherwise, you will only hear the tumult
of your own self-interest.

Perhaps, this is why some of us remain in the perpetual discerning group...if we focus so much on what we want we will never hear what God asks of us.

To answer the question above about the SD, nope...I don't have one. They seem rather difficult to come by down here. I have looked and looked for several years and haven't found one. Yes, Iam still praying that God will send me one.

[Totus Tuus]

The cool thing about religious life as a vocation is that you can give it a trial run and leave with no shame if it's not right for you. That should encourage people to go for it more often!