ironmonk Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 a note to anti-lifers Anyone who can seperate his "beliefs" in God, and civil law, if the law contradicts what God teaches.... DOES NOT BELIEVE IN God AT ALL. - they are ONLY "social believers". Facts are facts... if someone really believed in God, God would come first. End of story. God Bless, Love in Chirst & Mary ironmonk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
God Conquers Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 I wish Politicians would get this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreeSoul Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 lol...I am certainly not an anti-lifer, And I don't know how you could discern who believes in God or not, Ironmonk. For me God comes first, although I have to ask the question what is the best way to serve God...if I change the laws to cause imbitterment in peoples hearts, how is that doing God justice? I can't legislate that someone should believe in God or act as though they do....there is only so much that the law can do...and that is why I don't believe in letting that the sole factor that dictates peoples actions.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyperdulia again Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 I am not pro-Choice and I thank my former/future Church for what she taught me of Human Dignity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironmonk Posted July 3, 2003 Author Share Posted July 3, 2003 abortion has cause imbitterment in mens hearts, and has destroyed millions of lives - babies, and adults. Anyone who supports abortion has not kept their responsibility to study and learn of the Faith. Anyone who supports abortion does not know Christ. The Church has said is that those who vote for politicians that support abortion are cooperating in the advocacy of the sin: Our Holy Father John Paul II has stated that “abortion and euthanasia are crimes which no human law can claim to legitimize. There is no obligation in conscience to obey such laws; instead there is a grave and clear obligation to oppose them by conscientious objection. In the case of an intrinsically unjust law, such as a law permitting abortion or euthanasia, it is therefore never licit to obey it, or to ‘take part in a propaganda campaign in favor of such a law, or vote for it.’" (The Gospel of Life, no. 73) [emphasis added]. “Such cooperation [in evil] occurs when an action, either by its very nature or by the form it takes in a concrete situation, can be defined as a direct participation in an act against innocent human life or a sharing in the immoral intention of the person committing it. This cooperation can never be justified either by invoking respect for the freedom of others or by appealing to the fact that civil law permits it or requires it. Each individual in fact has moral responsibility for the acts which he personally performs; no one can be exempted from this responsibility, and on the basis of it everyone will be judged by God himself” (cf. Rom 2:6; 14:12) (The Gospel of Life, no. 74) [emphasis added]. So, if we knowingly support the immoral intention of a lawmaker who openly promotes the killing of innocent unborn children or sick or dying persons, then we run the risk of being guilty of mortal sin. Many priests have stated that it is scandalous for a Catholic could vote for a pro-abortion candidate when there is another candidate who is pro-life. So, on the contrary, it sounds like the Holy Father is clear on Catholic voting on the issue of abortion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FreeSoul Posted July 3, 2003 Share Posted July 3, 2003 I know what the Holy Father says. I just feel that there is a more productive way to support the journey towards valuing life. And that changing the law is a waste of time. I'd rather ACTUALLY stop a woman from having an abortion...then just having the prime minister tell her not to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironmonk Posted July 3, 2003 Author Share Posted July 3, 2003 I know what the Holy Father says. I just feel that there is a more productive way to support the journey towards valuing life. And that changing the law is a waste of time. I'd rather ACTUALLY stop a woman from having an abortion...then just having the prime minister tell her not to. I see your point... I want to do both. God Bless, Love in Chirst ironmonk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 I think we ought to stop calling supporting abortion being pro-choice. Let's start calling it for what it really is -- pro-abortion, pro-death, or pro-murder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littleflower+JMJ Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 I think we ought to stop calling supporting abortion being pro-choice. Let's start calling it for what it really is -- pro-abortion, pro-death, or pro-murder. AMEN! thank you dave! i know what you mean! thats what i think we should do too! they try to hide themselves behind a pretty picture for the media and what have you, but its not! its murder and theres nothing pretty about killing a unborn child... its either your pro-life....or pro-death....theres nothing else to it! God BLess! +JMJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
God Conquers Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 I call it poor-choice. It's catchy and true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasJis Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 posted by FreeSoul I just feel that there is a more productive way to support the journey towards valuing life. And that changing the law is a waste of time. I'd rather ACTUALLY stop a woman from having an abortion...then just having the prime minister tell her not to. Well, laws are a start and can be an asset. Anti-abortion laws by themselves may help diminish the symptom of abortion. Laws that make paternity tests mandatory and force fathers to share the burden would help. Laws that helped terminate parental rights would help adoption. Laws that helped foster parents become adoptive parents would help. My favorite charity is the Crisis Pregnancy Centers that help un-wed mothers. They recieve very little government aid. Pro-Abortion politicians see legal abortion as a cheap and easy way out and they don't have to address the 'tough' laws that would help determine parental responsibilities, wether to aid in the rearing of the child or to terminate to allow adoption. Laws like that would give other options to women and men who might have made a poor choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littleflower+JMJ Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 another law i think in texas passed that would soon required the mother/father to wait 24 hours before having a abortion done so they can know what really happens during a abortion and maybe change their minds.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironmonk Posted July 4, 2003 Author Share Posted July 4, 2003 I think we ought to stop calling supporting abortion being pro-choice. Let's start calling it for what it really is -- pro-abortion, pro-death, or pro-murder. I like to take it a step further... anti-Life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrysologus Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 Abortion is much too abominational for me to not be pro-life and vote pro-life. It's a basic principle of Christianity that the government's laws must conform to the laws of God, and God says "Thou shalt not kill." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dUSt Posted July 4, 2003 Share Posted July 4, 2003 I can't legislate that someone should believe in God or act as though they do....there is only so much that the law can do...and that is why I don't believe in letting that the sole factor that dictates peoples actions.... So, with this in mind, is it fair to assume that you believe that we shouldn't have laws against murder, rape, violence, etc? After all, there is only so much a law can do, right? Under what circumstances to you think that a law is valid? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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