When Does Human Life Begin?

[Fidei Defensor]

[quote name='Madame Vengier' post='1620050' date='Aug 7 2008, 07:00 AM']You can do the research. Science has already provided the evidence and the proof. I'm not sure why I am expected to do the research for you.

??????? (Confused)[/quote]
Because when you are in a debate and trying to defend a position and someone asks you to provide proof, you don't just tell them to go look it up.

[dairygirl4u2c]

the bottom line is a zygote is a cell and not necessarily significant like an adult or a new born etc.

when i was in biology, they said that the difference between a cell and an unicellular organism isn't much. if that unicellurlar organism was part of something else, it wouldn't be an organism, but would still be the same as if it were in an organism.
ie, as i quoted,,, the zygote at its inception is just like cells thereafter, some of them. the only difference between the zygote and a cell in an adult, is that it's not a unique set.

being a unique set, isn't enough to say it's significant. we can quibble about whether it's an organism or person or not,,, the definitions themselves do not provide answers so it'd be just quibbling... but when it's all said and done, even if conceded for the sake of argument that it's an organism and so by extension for hte sake of argument a person.... it's still just a cell.
it's unique, granted, that's why there should be conscern there that maybe it is sigifant. but it's still just a cell and so on its face isn't signifiant.

[dominicansoul]

[quote name='fidei defensor' post='1620264' date='Aug 7 2008, 12:15 PM']Because when you are in a debate and trying to defend a position and someone asks you to provide proof, you don't just tell them to go look it up.[/quote]

But at the same time, you looking it up yourself will help you to discover even more facts and significant points about her position.

[Fidei Defensor]

[quote name='dominicansoul' post='1620393' date='Aug 7 2008, 02:02 PM']But at the same time, you looking it up yourself will help you to discover even more facts and significant points about her position.[/quote]
This is true. However, the one thing that hasn't been stated is that I [i]have[/i] looked up all sorts of things about abortion. But when someone is defending a position, they have the burden to provide the proof to support their argument. That's just a basic debate skill.

[dairygirl4u2c]

a problem being,,, if you define person as merely organism, then that might fly. but if you define person as something signifant, it's not so clear.
remember,,, even if it's an organism,,, it's still just a cell. it's not the same as you or me.

[Socrates]

[quote name='Madame Vengier' post='1620051' date='Aug 7 2008, 08:05 AM']Those links are awesome.

But see, this is my point. The information is available out there for EVERYONE. Anyone can do a Google search on "human embryonic development" or any variation of such. The fact that science has provided the information and the fact that it is readily available at the fingertips of anyone who wants it, is why I don't have patience for people saying "prove it". Um, it's already been proven. Just look it up. Why should I do the research for a person if they claim to be genuinely interested? Personally, when I want to know something then I look it up. I don't tell others to prove it or provide data to back up their opinions. I go find it myself. Asking someone to prove that life begins at conception is like asking to prove the grass is green. If people don't know by now that a human life begins at conception, then it's becuase they don't WANT to know.[/quote]
Yeah, but it's so much easier to ignore the facts, insist on calling the unborn baby a "clump of cells," and dismiss any opposition to that as religious extremism.
Much easier.