Fallen Away Catholics And Outsiders...

[Akalyte]

[quote name='Staretz' post='1435557' date='Dec 18 2007, 05:53 AM']If they do not believe what the chruch believes, they have no business receiving the Eucharist. thats just sad [/quote]

people have told me they spit the eucharist out of their mouth in the bathroom because they dont like the taste...I was like woah..That's called sacrilege and it's a grave offense.

[S][N]

[quote name='elizabeth_jane' post='1435839' date='Dec 18 2007, 05:10 PM']Then I guess you're discounting all Christianity?
Your second point is ambiguous--what exactly do you mean? As for Catholicism, while, of course, it is made up of men, and men are imperfect, Jesus said that the "gates of Hell shall not prevail against it." So even though it is run by imperfect people, God preserves it from teaching error. Now that's based on the "faulty book" and a "non-existent being", but that's what we've got.[/quote]

All religions.

Exactly..that's all you got. You've just got a book, that not only contradicts itself (OT -> NT), but as accurate to a degree as it is on a historical level, tt still comes down to just being a book.

It's no different than any other religious book, from the Egyptian book of the dead, to the Qur'an to the Vedas (sp?).

Edited December 18, 2007 by S][N

[jeffpugh]

[quote name='S][N' post='1435815' date='Dec 18 2007, 04:38 PM']
....roffle[/quote]
Lawl...

[quote name='Akalyte' post='1435863' date='Dec 18 2007, 05:58 PM']people have told me they spit the eucharist out of their mouth in the bathroom because they dont like the taste...I was like woah..That's called sacrilege and it's a grave offense.[/quote]
Umm, that's one where the priest needs to be informed by such a thing... then he should give a fire and brimstone sermon (maybe)... or at least outlines that you are not required to receive our Lord Jesus Christ... the Eucharist!! I'd like to say that the priest may be not giving catechesis at the pulpit. That's an abuse too, because it's not a podium for political talks and happy happy talks about how much God loves you, or obscure excegesis on a verse from the gospel... Grr... I'll stop.

[elizabeth_jane]

[quote name='Akalyte' post='1435863' date='Dec 18 2007, 06:58 PM']people have told me they spit the eucharist out of their mouth in the bathroom because they dont like the taste...I was like woah..That's called sacrilege and it's a grave offense.[/quote]




I cannot BELIEVE that.

[prose]

[quote name='Staretz' post='1435557' date='Dec 18 2007, 04:53 AM']If they do not believe what the chruch believes, they have no business receiving the Eucharist. thats just sad [/quote]

Some people have no idea what the Eucharist is nor what to believe about it because they have never actually been taught. And these are Catholics.

How often does your priest explain it to the congregation? I think mine touches on it a few times a year and that is it.

[kafka]

yeah unreal Akalyte! I've done some bad things, but I wouldnt dream of doing that

[elizabeth_jane]

[quote name='prose' post='1435883' date='Dec 18 2007, 07:51 PM']Some people have no idea what the Eucharist is nor what to believe about it because they have never actually been taught. And these are Catholics.

How often does your priest explain it to the congregation? I think mine touches on it a few times a year and that is it.[/quote]

I read a stat a few years ago that said only 25% of Catholics believe in transubstantion.
Couldn't believe it. I was taught that in [i]first grade[/i]!

[Dave]

If they don't like the taste of the Eucharist, then why go to the trouble of spitting It out and thus committing sacrilege? Why not just not receive? Do they think that receiving Communion is just what you're "supposed to do" when you go to Mass?

[Deb]

[quote name='Akalyte' post='1435367' date='Dec 17 2007, 06:13 PM']I come across a lot of fallen away catholics and outsiders who all share the same understanding about religion and the church in general. They think the church is greedy, the dont trust religion, they dont trust the pope (especially Benedict XVI) They tend to all have the same politics (liberal). I come across these kind of people A LOT. I end up debating with them. Many of them have the same old "my church is at home and in my heart" kind of thinking. What is all this madness???[/quote]


Many of those people lead lives that they know to be sinful although, they do not admit that to themselves. It is easier to find fault with the Church then to admit their own faults. If they can turn the church away, they justify their own behavior. Then, they start to search among other religions etc to find a church that fits the rules they want to live by.
Sometimes they are lucky and they find their way back to the truth about themselves and GOD.

[jeffpugh]

I had the same thought, Dave.

[Adrestia]

[quote name='Dave' post='1435888' date='Dec 18 2007, 06:02 PM']Do they think that receiving Communion is just what you're "supposed to do" when you go to Mass?[/quote]
Yes.
They do the same as the people in the first few pews...
like lemmings.

[carrdero]

[quote]PapaHilarious writes: The funny thing about "proof" is that it is subject to the eye of the beholder. We cannot prove love, after all, and yet we know it to exist.[/quote]
I believe there is a way to discern and prove love or at least in a way in which the receiver can decide whether it is something that they want to accept in their life.

[quote]PapaHilarious writes: Should you refuse to acknowledge that air is necessary to your being, to you then, there is no air and no one will ever dissuade you with any theories, examples, or explanations.[/quote]

Many people take breathing for granted. Unless someone or something reminds one about breathing, it is usually not recognized or considered.

[quote]PapaHilarious writes: If you refuse to accept 1+1=2, then you are free to live life with your own equation, but would you be right?[/quote]

Easily proven, as is the fact that people are allowed to refuse Truth. I guess it would depend on how much people rely on mathmatics.

[quote]PapaHilarious writes: To think relatively is to deny all absolutes across the spectrum, not just in human relations and experiences but in math and science. Proof of God is science.[/quote]

But unfortunately our individual purpose is not qualified by science nor religion.

Edited December 19, 2007 by carrdero

[carrdero]

[quote name='Deb' post='1435901' date='Dec 18 2007, 09:05 PM']Many of those people lead lives that they know to be sinful although, they do not admit that to themselves. It is easier to find fault with the Church then to admit their own faults. If they can turn the church away, they justify their own behavior. Then, they start to search among other religions etc to find a church that fits the rules they want to live by.
Sometimes they are lucky and they find their way back to the truth about themselves and GOD.[/quote]
I think that could be done without the assistance of a religious organization. This is how Patrickism began. I finally realized that it is not the groups that I am associated with or the place that I go to that GOD will be impressed with, but that it just comes down to me and GOD and that this is and always will be a personal REALationship. No traveling, no complicated doctrine or human-made rituals, no faith and most importantly, it's free and costs absolutely nothing. I can discuss interests and receive advice pertinent to my life without having to rely on another’s relationships with GOD.

Edited December 19, 2007 by carrdero

[PapaHilarious]

[quote name='carrdero' post='1435998' date='Dec 18 2007, 10:22 PM']I believe there is a way to discern and prove love or at least in a way in which the receiver can decide whether it is something that they want to accept in their life.[/quote]

Ah, but "belief" has no place in an argument about absolutes and quantifiable proof. Should you wish to prove a feeling, love in particular, you will find little help in the realm of the objective.

[quote]Many people take breathing for granted. Unless someone or something reminds one about breathing, it is usually not recognized or considered.[/quote]

Taking air for granted does not make it any less necessary. Nor does denying the existence of air make it any less true. [Not sure from your tone if we actually disagree on this subject.]

[quote]But unfortunately our individual purpose is not qualified by science nor religion.[/quote]

If purpose is left to individuals and thereby relative, then purpose - ultimately the entire value of human dignity - will always be subject to human whims. The purpose of life [u]must[/u] be absolute, else there is no ground for racial equality, sexual equality, or any form of uniform equality and inalienable rights. Without a common, indisputable purpose, humanity is nothing more than the strong dictating and forcing their view of justice on the weak.

[carrdero]

[quote]PapaHilarious writes: Ah, but "belief" has no place in an argument about absolutes and quantifiable proof. Should you wish to prove a feeling, love in particular, you will find little help in the realm of the objective.[/quote]
I believe because I am uncertain of the Truth about Love. I am still examining, comparing and reasoning this concept not only towards my individual purpose but to see if there is a Universal purpose to it as well.

[quote]PapaHilarious writes:If purpose is left to individuals and thereby relative, then purpose - ultimately the entire value of human dignity - will always be subject to human whims.[/quote]

Isn’t that exactly what we are perceiving today? The entire value of human dignity is being defined every day. It sort of like observing the stock market.

[quote]PapaHilarious writes: The purpose of life must be absolute, else there is no ground for racial equality, sexual equality, or any form of uniform equality and inalienable rights.[/quote]

GOD created homo-sapiens, not robo-sapiens for individual spirits to inhabit. Without individual purpose, how does one allow for human identity, personality and individuality? What would be the reason to come to a physical existence if one didn’t have a plan or personal agenda to fulfill? My purposes, my ambitions, my desires, my beliefs, my environments, my upbringing, my experiences, my very reason for physically existing are my own and will greatly differ from anyone else’s. It will differ because before I arrived to this physical realm, I planned for this existence. No one purposed this life for me, I chose to live this physical existence at this moment.

[quote]PapaHilarious writes: Without a common, indisputable purpose, humanity is nothing more than the strong dictating and forcing their view of justice on the weak.[/quote]

Welcome to planet earth!!

Edited December 19, 2007 by carrdero