Hell... How Easy Is It?

[friendofJPII]

I think it depends on what a person knows. If a person knows that the CC is the one true Church and rejects it, or willing dies in a state of mortal sin, they are in big trouble. That being said, my gut feeling is that most people go to purgatory, very few go straight to heaven, and quite a few are going to hell these days. I think in a Medjugorie apparation Mary (which of course you don't have to believe) said that although most people go to purgatory, "souls are falling into hell like snowflakes." And in the Fatima appartion one of the children's friends was going to be in purgatory "until the end of time...." Geesshh......what did she do???? If people where sinful in 1917, can you imagine now?

Edited December 11, 2007 by friendofJPII

[Socrates]

Easy as Hell . . .

[carrdero]

I voted other. No such condition as hell exists.

Edited December 11, 2007 by carrdero

[MIKolbe]

[quote name='carrdero' post='1432742' date='Dec 10 2007, 10:18 PM']I voted other. No such condition as hell exists.[/quote]
Obviously, you've never met my mother-in-law.

[Justin86]

[quote]How easy is it to go to Hell?[/quote]
So easy, a caveman could do it.

[cathoholic_anonymous]

[quote name='Ash Wednesday' post='1432469' date='Dec 10 2007, 08:11 PM']I voted that "there is a special place in heaven for Phatmassers."

I really don't like to speculate too much, because God only knows. If I put a lot of thought into it one way or another, I would become either 1.) lax with complacency and indifference or 2.) frozen with fear and despair.

I trust that whatever the amount is would be perfectly just, because God judges with perfect justice and mercy.[/quote]

Amen.

I voted that there is a special place in Heaven for Phatmassers. I also said that "good" people go to Heaven, as I am not defining goodness as stereotypical niceness - I'm defining good as a burning, passionate desire for God. Beyond that, I don't feel very confident in my judgement.

[CrossCuT]

[size=1]I believe there is an acception to every option on the poll.
I only chose one:

All "good" people will go to Heaven whether Christian or not.
[/size]

[KnightofChrist]

Many "good" people will burn in the fires of hell. While those outside the church have the smallest shred of hope of being saved on the mercy of God, there is no promise given to them. While neither can be absolute, because God alone absolutely knows, there is more evidence that person outside the church go to hell than there is they go to heaven.

Even for us in the Church we must work out our faith in fear and trembling.

[Church Punk]

What constitutes a good person? Am I a good person.

What about the sinfulness inside of me? What about all the times that I have turned my back on Christ, on other people? What about my involvement in the slaughter of millions of innocences everyday, simply carried out by the daily choices I make?

If God does not act with justice for these crimes he is not God.

The only hope I have is in His mercy. To speculate what his Divine Mercy is like for others I do not know. I just hope he has room for us after all this. I practice the sacraments and struggle through my own sinful inclinations. I pray that i will have the strength to overcome these problems and to one day gaze upon his face in eternity.

[Lena]

[quote name='KnightofChrist' post='1433920' date='Dec 13 2007, 03:01 PM']Many "good" people will burn in the fires of hell. While those outside the church have the smallest shred of hope of being saved on the mercy of God, there is no promise given to them. While neither can be absolute, because God alone absolutely knows, there is more evidence that person outside the church go to hell than there is they go to heaven.

Even for us in the Church we must work out our faith in fear and trembling.[/quote]

"Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God" sounds right up your alley.

[KnightofChrist]

[quote name='Lena' post='1433957' date='Dec 13 2007, 05:33 PM']"Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God" sounds right up your alley.[/quote]

Nope. I am Catholic not a follower of the Heretic Calvin.


---------

“Whoever wishes to be saved, needs above all to hold the Catholic Faith; unless each one preserves this whole and inviolate, he will without a doubt perish in eternity … This is the Catholic Faith; unless each one believes this faithfully and firmly, he cannot be saved.”

(Athanasian Creed; quoted and solemnly ratified [b]ex cathedra[/b] by Pope Eugene IV, Council of Florence, session 8, November 22, 1439)

“There is indeed one universal Church of the faithful, outside of which nobody at all is saved, in which Jesus Christ is both priest and sacrifice.”

(Pope Innocent III, Fourth Lateran Council, Constitution 1, 1215)

"The Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes, and preaches that all those who are outside the Catholic Church -- not only pagans but also Jews or heretics and schismatics -- cannot share in eternal life, and will go into the everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels, unless they are joined to the Church before the end of their lives; [the Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes, and preaches] that the unity of this ecclesiastical body is of such importance that only those who abide in it do the Church's sacraments contribute to salvation and do fasts, almsgivings and other works of piety and practices of the Christian militia productive of eternal rewards; and [the Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes, and preaches] that nobody can be saved, no matter how much he has given away in alms and even if he has shed blood in the name of Christ, unless he has persevered in the bosom and unity of the Catholic Church."

([b]Ex cathedra solemn definition[/b] of Pope Eugene IV, Council of Florence (Ecumenical Council), "Cantate Domino," 1441; Denzinger)

“It is impossible for the most true God, who is Truth itself, the best, the wisest Provider, and the Rewarder of good men, to approve all sects who profess false teachings which are often inconsistent with one another and contradictory, and to confer eternal rewards on their members ... By divine faith we hold one Lord, one faith, one baptism, and … this is why we profess that there is no salvation outside the Church.”

(Pope Leo XII, Ubi Primum, May 5, 1824; paragraph 14)

Edited December 14, 2007 by KnightofChrist

[Lena]

that's ok, it was a joke anyway

[KnightofChrist]

[quote name='Lena' post='1434045' date='Dec 13 2007, 08:13 PM']that's ok, it was a joke anyway [/quote]

Oh well it was hard to tell...

[XIX]

[quote name='KnightofChrist' post='1434042' date='Dec 13 2007, 08:09 PM']Nope. I am Catholic not a follower of the Heretic Calvin.
---------

“Whoever wishes to be saved, needs above all to hold the Catholic Faith; unless each one preserves this whole and inviolate, he will without a doubt perish in eternity … This is the Catholic Faith; unless each one believes this faithfully and firmly, he cannot be saved.”

(Athanasian Creed; quoted and solemnly ratified [b]ex cathedra[/b] by Pope Eugene IV, Council of Florence, session 8, November 22, 1439)

“There is indeed one universal Church of the faithful, outside of which nobody at all is saved, in which Jesus Christ is both priest and sacrifice.”

(Pope Innocent III, Fourth Lateran Council, Constitution 1, 1215)

"The Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes, and preaches that all those who are outside the Catholic Church -- not only pagans but also Jews or heretics and schismatics -- cannot share in eternal life, and will go into the everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels, unless they are joined to the Church before the end of their lives; [the Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes, and preaches] that the unity of this ecclesiastical body is of such importance that only those who abide in it do the Church's sacraments contribute to salvation and do fasts, almsgivings and other works of piety and practices of the Christian militia productive of eternal rewards; and [the Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes, and preaches] that nobody can be saved, no matter how much he has given away in alms and even if he has shed blood in the name of Christ, unless he has persevered in the bosom and unity of the Catholic Church."

([b]Ex cathedra solemn definition[/b] of Pope Eugene IV, Council of Florence (Ecumenical Council), "Cantate Domino," 1441; Denzinger)

“It is impossible for the most true God, who is Truth itself, the best, the wisest Provider, and the Rewarder of good men, to approve all sects who profess false teachings which are often inconsistent with one another and contradictory, and to confer eternal rewards on their members ... By divine faith we hold one Lord, one faith, one baptism, and … this is why we profess that there is no salvation outside the Church.”

(Pope Leo XII, Ubi Primum, May 5, 1824; paragraph 14)[/quote]
This is one of the reasons why I hate these kinds of discussions. Isolated, doom and gloom assertions that pretty much everybody is going to Hell. The other reason is people who want to put everybody in Heaven. Both viewpoints are absolute poison to the Catholic faith, as the Church has never taught either (even if they are just held as opinions). Honestly, I could go out and read the entire documents from which you got those quotes, and I'm sure that it would at least sound different from what those isolated quote look like.

I've read plenty of this carp and it really does nothing but drive a wedge of fear (not awe, the other kind of fear) between myself and Christ. Honestly, what do you hope to accomplish by claiming to have all of this evidence for the damnation of souls? Really. You come across as a Calvinistic fundamentalist--and I am not joking when I say that. I know you *profess* to be Catholic; maybe you should start acting like one.

Reading these quotes makes me wonder why I'd ever want to stay in the Catholic Church. I don't want to belong to a Church of Holy Fearmongers. Certainly, the Popes you quoted certainly are not out to scare us into the Church, but you sound like you are. And you know what? Maybe you're right. Maybe you actually guessed correctly, and non-Catholics have no more than a shred of hope of being saved. But to act like your guess is more than a shot in the dark is sheer foolishness.

[KnightofChrist]

The Church has taught that by the Mercy of God someone [b]maybe[/b] be saved outside the Church, however there is no promise, there is nothing close to a guarantee. This is a shred of hope. But those within the Church with the light of Christ have the promises from Christ that if we remain in Him until the end we can be saved. Again those outside in the darkness do not have this promise, and as long as they remain outside in the darkness they will never have this promise.

Again, God alone knows, but there is more evidence (ie from Holy Scripture, popes and saints throughout time) that persons outside the church go to hell than go to heaven. And it is God that has revealed it.

I believe whatever the Church believes. I would challenge you to an actual debate with facts than judgmental attacks on my person which are nothing less than hypocrisy.