Aloysius Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 by the way, hyper hit the nail right on the head. :cool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BullnaChinaShop Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 by the way, hyper hit the nail right on the head. I agree. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLAZEr Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 he's obviously never heard of a little nun i like to call "mother teresa" (actual name, Mother Teresa) who said, "It is not our job as Christians to convert...it is our job to make muslims better muslims, hindus better hindus, and christians better christians. How you find your way to God is up to you, whether through islam or any other religion. Its that you find a way, my way just happened to be through catholocism." or a little book i like to read called the "what i believe that my church teaches book" or "CCC" for short where it says: "Believing in Jesus Christ and in the One who sent him for our salvation is necessary for obtaining that salvation. "Since "without faith it is impossible to please [God]" and to attain to the fellowship of his sons, therefore without faith no one has ever attained justification, nor will anyone obtain eternal life 'But he who endures to the end.'" CCC 161 both of these things, although conflict messages when speaking of non-christians, still allow for Mrs. Gibson to go to heaven... sorry mel. THERE IS NO WAY THAT MOTHER TERESA SAID THAT. NO WAY!!! The part about making muslims better muslims and hindus better hindus is ok . .. BUT THAT "MY WAY JUST HAPPENED TO BE" Is a load of mularky. She never said that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrsFrozen Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 (edited) he's obviously never heard of a little nun i like to call "mother teresa" (actual name, Mother Teresa) who said, "It is not our job as Christians to convert...it is our job to make muslims better muslims, hindus better hindus, and christians better christians. How you find your way to God is up to you, whether through islam or any other religion. Its that you find a way, my way just happened to be through catholocism." I somewhat agree. I do believe we should try to convert people into Christianity. As Catholics, it's our job to spread the word on Catholicism and make the information known. It is God who leads them to the right place. If he really said this, then God bless Mel, he's confused. It's wonderful to see someone tied to Hollywood who is a Christian, but I think he needs to read up on the Catechism! God bless. :) Edited February 10, 2004 by MrsFrozen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash Wednesday Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 *sighs* You know, I think it's sad that Mel was suicidal. I'm really concerned for him. I can't help but wonder why he was feeling so miserable in the first place. I hope and pray that he can find more peace and come to a greater understanding of the Church's teaching and abandon his schismatic interpretation of the Church. We can't know the state of anyone's soul. We can't be complacent and say "one is as good as the other" and "what you believe doesn't matter" of course, but on the other hand it's equally not right to take on the Jansenist/Father Feeney viewpoint of salvation. We should pray for him and his family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrishG8s Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 I think he is just stressed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 i dont think it is wrong at all to say outside of the Church there is no salvation. that's a dogma. he was stating an objective truth, like hyper said. he didn't need to go into his wife's whole case, his wife is not within the normative means of salvation.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pontifex Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 (edited) Please notice that at the top of the article in question it says: "Gossip" I think it should be taken with a grain of salt, and find it very hard to believe that he thinks his wife is a part of the damned. Fr. P Edited February 10, 2004 by Pontifex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IXpenguin21 Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 blah blah blah, okay. it's the general assumption that that MT quote is out of context... but you took it out of my contex, as i did NOT aply it to anyone else other than Christians, which the CCC says nothing specificaly against in the excerpt i pulled from it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pontifex Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 No Salvation Outside the Church, is indeed a dogma, but please do not say that it means non-Cathollics will not be saved. Indeed salvation comes from Christ, through the Church, but it is extended to all the world, as we say in the Eucharistic prayers. Peace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyperdulia again Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Father no one here has advocated a feeneyite interpretation of that phrase. We have simply said that the Church is a normative necessity for salvation, and part of that normative necessity includes the fact that no matter how good one's ife is if one culpibly rejects the Bride one rejects Christ. If one rejects Christ one cannot expect to spend eternity with him. Please forgive me if I've spooken out of turn Father. *Kisses the hands that elevate Christ in the Blessed Sacrament* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marielapin Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 No Salvation Outside the Church, is indeed a dogma, but please do not say that it means non-Cathollics will not be saved. Indeed salvation comes from Christ, through the Church, but it is extended to all the world, as we say in the Eucharistic prayers. Peace Thanks Father. I still think the article is misquoting Mel, until proven otherwise. This is just because the media seems to misquote or misconstrue even the most well-thought out quotes (see Mother Teresa's quotes I posted earlier). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thy Geekdom Come Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 I don't think he believes in desired baptism or any of that other stuff in the Catechism... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oik Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 As for the whole Mel Gibson quote, it's true and I agree that it should be taken with a grain of salt. However, even if he was quoted correctly, he is right. "We believe in One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic (sp?) Church." It is also true that there is no salvation outside of the church, because the church "holds the fullness of Truth." It's hard to hear for those who are not Catholic, even those who are. The Truths that the Church teach are the glimpse of the Truth of Heaven. The Truth that the church teaches is the Truth of what Heaven is. If you reject the Truth when you die, then you only have one other option, Hel. Where else would you go? l Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oik Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Also, I don't think Mel is schismatic. I am pretty sure that he recognizes the authority of the Pope and the Church. His father was SSPX, but Mel is not. As far as I understand, Mel Gibson prefers the Latin Mass (that would make him a traditionalist, not a schismatic). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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