God Almighty

[catholicinsd]

Would all you, kindly lead by example? We subject to a peaceful God, a God that loves us all. He doesn't care how He is peacefully gloried. He only desires that our hearts be His. Lookong at this debate board, I must ask- are we truly serving our Sovereigh God? Or our own interests?

[dairygirl4u2c]

i question my motives all the time. part of me seeks the truth, and part of me seeks to rationalize my sins and pride etc. if i could know what the trut hwas, i'd be more willing to go full force. when it gets blurry, it's hard to know if i dissent for reasons of truth or for self.

[prose]

Are you serious? (I am assuming you are, that was a rhetorical question).

This board is specifically for apologetics. That is what it is for. The fact that there is debate going on is a GOOD thing. St. Paul told us to always be able to give reason for the faith we have. I think this board exemplifies that.

Disagreeing is not being unchristian. I think the majority of this board debates in a christian way. I think God is almost always numero uno in discussions.

If debate makes you uncomfortable, I would suggest spending time in open mic. There are plenty of gentle, non-combative, Christ centered conversations there.

[catholicinsd]

Are you doing it for God or for yourself?

[T-Bone _]

[quote name='catholicinsd' post='1385541' date='Sep 14 2007, 02:18 PM']Are you doing it for God or for yourself?[/quote]

Are you acting "holier-than-thou" and judgmental for God, or for yourself?

[catholicinsd]

[quote name='T-Bone _' post='1385543' date='Sep 14 2007, 04:22 PM']Are you acting "holier-than-thou" and judgmental for God, or for yourself?[/quote]
If I am, than I'm acting just like the great majority of Debaters on PM.

[prose]

[quote name='catholicinsd' post='1385541' date='Sep 14 2007, 03:18 PM']Are you doing it for God or for yourself?[/quote]

Why would I debate Truth for my own sake?

Besides the fact that I am following the instruction to always be ready to give reason for the faith I have.

[Winchester]

[quote name='catholicinsd' post='1385541' date='Sep 14 2007, 04:18 PM']Are you doing it for God or for yourself?[/quote]
You're one of those people who prays really loudly in Church, aren't you?

[ironmonk]

First off, you can't tell how anyone is acting... any acting is in your head. People write differently. You cannot always tell tone let alone how someone is acting from a forum. Everything you can tell about tone and "acting" is in your head because you imagine the way someone is saying something from your preconceived notions.

People debate because they think they're right. People debate to learn. People debate to help others learn.

Please teach us this "lead by example" because "We're not worthy"
[img]http://img243.imageshack.us/img243/9910/notwortyfz3.jpg[/img]

[jeffpugh]

Yeah. Seriously, take a break if this is too hard for you. I got some advice for you though: words are harsh. Seriously, without those smiley faces , words standing alone without gesture or tonal expression are harsh. Plain and simple.

[rollingcatholic]

[quote name='catholicinsd' post='1385545' date='Sep 14 2007, 04:24 PM']If I am, than I'm acting just like the great majority of Debaters on PM.[/quote]

Excusing your own judgmental, hypocritical and obnoxious behavior by pointing out that you think others are behaving in a similar way is dishonest, and not anyway to win a debate. Knock off the blanket accusations and take a good look at your own heart before you start to criticize others.

I am sick of your behavior here, and am blocking you.

[T-Bone _]

[quote name='catholicinsd' post='1385545' date='Sep 14 2007, 02:24 PM']If I am, than I'm acting just like the great majority of Debaters on PM.[/quote]

So because others do it, that gives you the right to do it as well?

I'm so glad you paid attention in those logic classes...

[Aloysius]

God gave us intellects so that we could use them. Rhetoric is a great use of intellect, argument also. Argument is beautiful, it is the way through which two disagreeing parties peacefully seek resolution to their disagreement and through the process end up exploring all aspects of a given issue. It's a way for both sides to learn, even if there is never a resolution to the question posed in the debate.

Ironmonk is right, though, oftentimes people will read motivations into people's posts that are not there... if someone just tries to deal straightforwardly with the facts (a perfectly fine way to wright, ask Aquinas), someone might project upon him that he is cold, uncaring, and mean spirited. But of course, he probably goes back to his life, swings back a beer with his protestant friend, and jovially makes the same points he just made on PM with a good friend of his... and he probably had the same intention with both things, it's just that one was made in writing and the other in real life.

Chesterton said it best:
"It is not merely true that a creed unites men. Nay, a difference of creed unites men - so long as it is a clear difference. A boundary unites. Many a magnanimous Moslem and chivalrous Crusader must have been nearer to each other, because they were both dogmatists, than any two agnostics. "I say God is One," and "I say God is One but also Three," that is the beginning of a good quarrelsome, manly friendship."

I often feel closer to my friends with whom I can share a good debate than I do with my friends who agree with me (or my friends who are wishy-washy about any given issue)

[T-Bone _]

[quote name='Aloysius' post='1386041' date='Sep 15 2007, 02:18 PM']God gave us intellects so that we could use them. Rhetoric is a great use of intellect, argument also. Argument is beautiful, it is the way through which two disagreeing parties peacefully seek resolution to their disagreement and through the process end up exploring all aspects of a given issue. It's a way for both sides to learn, even if there is never a resolution to the question posed in the debate.[/quote]

Well said!

[CatherineM]

I'd like to think that I have my own mind, and not just some kind of robot that is turned out in the Vatican's basement. Last semester when I was teaching on the formation of conscience, I quoted something that Pope Benedict said at a workshop I attended in 1991. He was talking about a colleague who had told him that it was easier to get to heaven for unbelievers. That the burden of faith with all its moral obligations was just too great. This man's view was that faith would make salvation harder, not easier (to those given the greatest gifts come the greatest burdens so to speak). This man was arguing to then Cardinal Ratzinger that erroneous conscience sheltered a person from "the exacting demands of truth." I would have liked to have been in on his rebuttal.

The Catechism tells us that our "conscience must be informed and moral judgment enlightened. A well-formed conscience is upright and truthful" "The education of the conscience is a lifelong task." "In the formation of conscience the Word of God is the light for our path, we must assimilate it in faith and prayer and put it into practice."

What that has always meant to me is that I have to use my intellect and reason and experience to form my conscience. I can disagree with the church in my heart of hearts about some things (not the creed, or the ex cathedra type things) and still be a member in good standing; however, I can not publicly proclaim or teach as a catechist against the church's teachings. Plus, I must be willing to obey even those things I disagree with, or be willing to face the consequences. To be honest, I only disagree with the church on two things: priest celibacy and condoms. I know that priest celibacy is a discipline, and not dogma, and I think having enough priests to administer the sacraments is more important, and as for condoms, it is hard to talk out against them when you've seen a friend die of AIDS. That being said, I don't publicly talk about either topic one way or the other. I think this is the first time I've ever mentioned it outside talking to my husband or a close friend about it.