Q On Women Veiling

[adt6247]

[quote name='kenrockthefirst' post='1368927' date='Aug 23 2007, 01:14 PM']Look, I'm willing to be educated on this matter but if nearly all Catholic women in the US, not to mention much of Europe, were in a state of mortal sin, I'd imagine that someone would get pretty excited about it. Is what you're saying is that most Catholic women in the US and probably Europe are estranged from Christ through mortal sin because they're not veiled?[/quote]
Never said they are now. I was talking about people who stopped doing so BEFORE 1983. They were canonically required to do so by the 1917 code of canon law.

[photosynthesis]

[quote name='adt6247' post='1368937' date='Aug 23 2007, 01:24 PM']Never said they are now. I was talking about people who stopped doing so BEFORE 1983. They were canonically required to do so by the 1917 code of canon law.[/quote]

Yes, but did the Code of Canon Law state that it was a mortal sin for a woman to go without a headcovering?

[kenrockthefirst]

[quote name='adt6247' post='1368937' date='Aug 23 2007, 11:24 AM']Never said they are now. I was talking about people who stopped doing so BEFORE 1983. They were canonically required to do so by the 1917 code of canon law.[/quote]
In other words, under the current Catechism, it's not a sin NOT to wear a veil?

[adt6247]

[quote name='photosynthesis' post='1368954' date='Aug 23 2007, 01:39 PM']Yes, but did the Code of Canon Law state that it was a mortal sin for a woman to go without a headcovering?[/quote]
I was under the impression that willful violation of canon law held the penalty of mortal sin.

[photosynthesis]

But for it to be a mortal sin, the woman would have to know she is violating Canon Law and she would have to fully consent to it.

[adt6247]

[quote name='kenrockthefirst' post='1368962' date='Aug 23 2007, 01:48 PM']In other words, under the current Catechism, it's not a sin NOT to wear a veil?[/quote]
The Catechism has [i][b]nothing[/b][/i] to do with it. The Catechism isn't a legally binding document. The 1983 Code of Canon Law is. The Catechism is also not infallible; it's been corrected since its original publication. It's an excellent resource, but it doesn't contain all of Catholic teaching, theology, canon law, etc.; it is but a teaching tool.

[adt6247]

[quote name='photosynthesis' post='1368986' date='Aug 23 2007, 02:16 PM']But for it to be a mortal sin, the woman would have to know she is violating Canon Law and she would have to fully consent to it.[/quote]
I said "Catholic women took it upon themselves in the '60s, when they were still bound under penalty of mortal sin under canon law!"

I did NOT say that they incurred the penalty of mortal sin, only that they were bound.

[kenrockthefirst]

[quote name='adt6247' post='1368987' date='Aug 23 2007, 12:19 PM']The Catechism has [i][b]nothing[/b][/i] to do with it. The Catechism isn't a legally binding document. The 1983 Code of Canon Law is. The Catechism is also not infallible; it's been corrected since its original publication. It's an excellent resource, but it doesn't contain all of Catholic teaching, theology, canon law, etc.; it is but a teaching tool.[/quote]
While it's clear that you think women [i]should[/i] wear veils while praying, I'm still unclear as to whether it's your understanding that it's a sin NOT to wear a veil.

[adt6247]

[quote name='kenrockthefirst' post='1369001' date='Aug 23 2007, 02:34 PM']While it's clear that you think women [i]should[/i] wear veils while praying, I'm still unclear as to whether it's your understanding that it's a sin NOT to wear a veil.[/quote]
The answer is "I don't know", to be honest. It definitely used to be.

[kenrockthefirst]

[quote name='adt6247' post='1369007' date='Aug 23 2007, 12:45 PM']The answer is "I don't know", to be honest. It definitely used to be.[/quote]
Awesome!

[Romans1513]

[quote name='kenrockthefirst' post='1368806' date='Aug 23 2007, 10:35 AM']In my view, as I've stated before, anything that looks like the Taliban is a good reason [i]not to veil[/i].[/quote]

This is kind of a sidetrack, but this really struck me.

Look at your avatar picture. I would say Mother Theresa looks a lot more taliban-ish than a woman with a chapel veil. Should she (and all nuns, for that matter) not have worn a habit?

I think St. Paul was around saying to veil a long time before the taliban came about.

[Resurrexi]

[quote name='Romans1513' post='1369167' date='Aug 23 2007, 03:57 PM']This is kind of a sidetrack, but this really struck me.

Look at your avatar picture. I would say Mother Theresa looks a lot more taliban-ish than a woman with a chapel veil. Should she (and all nuns, for that matter) not have worn a habit?

I think St. Paul was around saying to veil a long time before the taliban came about.[/quote]

I concur

[kateri05]

[quote]There is no way that veiling your head, even if you are the only woman doing it, can cause anyone else to stumble.[/quote]

i'm sorry, but you're wrong. you don't know my family. it would definitely be a further point in their minds of equating orthodoxy with legalism and obsessive rule following piety, rather than with right worship and right theology. its all about picking your battles and since this isn't canonically required, i think its more important to stand up for Mass on Holy Days and not using contraception, etc etc.

and as for the other LA person, as i said before, its not really about the LA archdiocese people. they can go jump in a creek but my family (who isn't in this diocese) is the real issue, and if i only start wearing a veil or a hat part of the time, it just seems hypocritical to me.

Edited August 24, 2007 by kateri05

[eperez874]

now ask your self this question did archangel Gabriel apperead to virgin marry when she had a vareil or when she did not have a veil?God is who we must listen
at that times women are using veils even inside the jewish synagoge now in the church that i go they also wear veils. God never wanted changes but the church accepted it. but does that makes it correct? we can fail as hummans even the pope can fail as humman we are not angels so God told the girls to wear veils in order to honor God.

[jiyoung]

[quote name='kateri05' post='1369362' date='Aug 23 2007, 08:20 PM']and as for the other LA person, as i said before, its not really about the LA archdiocese people. they can go jump in a creek but my family (who isn't in this diocese) is the real issue, and if i only start wearing a veil or a hat part of the time, it just seems hypocritical to me.[/quote]
Yeah, I agree...heh. But I guess it's a matter of conscience...for me, being informed of what the veil was (and therefore, I felt, I was committing a sin if I didn't veil since I had concluded that it was required by the Church), I decided to wear it come stonings or shunnings, but if you don't believe it would be a sin not to veil and especially if you think it would cause a commotion that would actually repel your family from veiling and all things orthodox in particular, then it might be prudent to refrain from it at least when they're around and meanwhile pray that God will change their minds.