Christians To Seek Converts At Mosques’ Doorsteps

[homeschoolmom]

The Golden Ruuuuuule... the Golden Ruuuuule... Oh it's a very useful tool to figure out what you're to do....

(Sorry... my kids were in a musical... )

[Aloysius]

Budge acts as if the Apostles were total fanatical idiots running around shouting things at people. Her view of the Apostle's style of preaching, a result of his misinterpretation of the Bible, really feels quite blasphemous to me...as if the Apostles would have been as obnoxious as willfully ignorant modern day fundamentalists. Sickens me the way you have this charicature in your mind of Apostles who were not "wise as serpents yet simple as doves" the way Our Lord commanded them to be.

[Sojourner]

Budge is a "her"

[kateri05]

yea, i noticed that. silly al

[catholicinsd]

Let's hope the Christians don't get shot.

[T-Bone _]

[quote name='catholicinsd' post='1351625' date='Aug 6 2007, 08:17 PM']Let's hope the Christians don't get shot.[/quote]

Um...Why would they be shot?

[jeffpugh]

Funny thing is, that was sorta one thing that came up in my mind when I first read this post... but then, they become Martyrs... but then... they might actually start a war with the radical sect of Islam. I'm reading too much into this? yes, most likely...

Yeah, so never mind my inane babble.

[abercius24]

There is a quote from St. Paul's character in the movie A.D. that sticks with me whenever I think of the proper approach to evangelization. He says, "Conversion is a painful and slow, yet strikingly beautiful process." I believe those words to be very true. Conversion should not be something you find at a fast food restaurant or in a bad of microwave popcorn. If it is truly the process of finally discovering the absolute meaning of one's life, it should be more profound than anything else we experience. It should be deeper than the longest and most romantic of courtships. It should involve a paradigm shift of thought greater than the biggest fool who finally sees his shortcomings. As the scriptures say, one should find in himself "a new man." Why do so many people try to force such beauty into the world? Would you force a flower to bloom? Can you physically force someone to smile? No. These things happen with careful handling, patience and time. So it should also be with evangelization and conversion. Let it be a wonderful event that comes in God's time.

Steve S. -- abercius24
CatholicQandA.com

[Farsight one]

[quote name='Budge' post='1349477' date='Aug 4 2007, 12:03 PM']Were the apostles obnoixous when they did open air preaching?[/quote]No, they were not, but they did so only to the people who wanted to listen, and only in places that people could easily avoid if they didn't want to listen. I would be extremely insulted and even LESS open to conversion if someone tried to tell me about Christianity outside of my mosque.

I'm all for attempting to convert people, but there are some down right crappy ways to attempt it, and that would be one of them. Telling people to "convert or go to hell" is another. I personally make sure to become someone's friend first before even doing something so simple as to ask them to come to church with me. They're much more receptive to evangelization if you're their friend. I've gone through five atheist friends. And by "gone through", I don't mean that they're no longer my friends, but that they're no longer atheists.

[catholicinsd]

[quote name='T-Bone _' post='1351631' date='Aug 6 2007, 10:20 PM']Um...Why would they be shot?[/quote]

Shairia law demands death to those who convert away from Islam

[abercius24]

[quote name='catholicinsd' post='1351809' date='Aug 7 2007, 12:36 AM']Shairia law demands death to those who convert away from Islam[/quote]

Very true. Try prostelytizing inside the Moslim city of Mecca. They will publicly execute you there.

[T-Bone _]

[quote name='catholicinsd' post='1351809' date='Aug 6 2007, 10:36 PM']Shairia law demands death to those who convert away from Islam[/quote]

The article is about the activities of Christians in Seattle, Washington. Sharia law doesn't apply.

[jeffpugh]

[quote name='Farsight one' post='1351797' date='Aug 7 2007, 12:05 AM']... I've gone through five atheist friends. And by "gone through", I don't mean that they're no longer my friends, but that they're no longer atheists.[/quote]
That is really really awesome. Made my night reading that line

[quote name='abercius24' post='1351885' date='Aug 7 2007, 02:56 AM']Very true. Try prostelytizing inside the Moslim city of Mecca. They will publicly execute you there.[/quote]

... If you can get inside the city without being caught...

[cathoholic_anonymous]

The penalty for proselytising in Saudi Arabia is not execution. If you are a Saudi you will get fined. Heavily. If you are a foreigner from the West, you will get deported to your home country. If you are a foreigner from India, Bangladesh, or the Far East (especially the Philippies) you will get flogged and then deported. A testament to the ingrained racism in the Saudi justice system.

Ironically, racism is a much bigger problem over there than religious discrimination. I am aware that I enjoyed a privileged status just for being white and British - a status that was denied to, say, most Bangladeshi Muslims. I can't help wondering what people on here would say if they knew that many Saudi-based Brits and Americans (yes, the good guys! The heroes!) are guilty of encouraging and fostering that racist climate because it is advantageous to them. And I'm not just talking about individuals here. I'm talking about prominent officials sitting behind desks in embassies.

[quote]Shairia law demands death to those who convert away from Islam[/quote]

Some Muslims interpret the Shari'ah that way. Most of them don't. Remarks like that sound to Aisha and Abdullah Average exactly how Budge's constant "Catholics worship cookies" refrain sounds to us. If you genuinely want to share the Gospel with Muslims, here are some tips:

[u][b]What Never to Do[/b][/u]

1.) Don't assume that you know more about Islam than the Muslim standing in front of you, just because you've read a Wikipedia article on jihad and have memorised a few Arabic terms that you can barely pronounce. You don't. Respect their knowledge and don't insult their intelligence.

2.) Don't argue about the Qur'an with Muslims. Again, their knowledge of its meaning and interpretation is likely to be far beyond yours - no matter how many pseudo-scholarly Robert Spencer books you've read. If you come out with the tired old "Islam preaches death to the infidel" line, the average Muslim will immediately think, "Here is another one who is trying to make out that I believe things that I don't. Why should I listen?"

3.) Don't make the mistake that Budge's article makes and assume that Islam is an Arab religion or that the majority of Muslims are Arabs. Be sensitive to the culture and nationality of the individual. They will respect you more for it.

4.) Do not drag up honour killings, female genital mutilation, or the death penalty for adultery. The majority of Muslims have no intention of committing a so-called honour killing, mutilating their daughters' genitals, or committing adultery, but nearly all of them will have misconceptions about the Trinity and what it means to profess faith in Jesus' divinity. Talk about stuff that they actually believe and that is actually relevant.

[u][b]Useful Topics to Discuss[/b][/u]

1.) Monotheism. Many Muslims have real difficulty with understanding how Trinitarian faith can be truly monotheistic. In Saudi curious and well-meaning people would quite often ask me, "Why do you worship three gods?" The more knowledgeable would ask, "How can God be three distinct Persons but still have the same essence?" This is a big area of interest and confusion, so make sure that you are knowledgeable. (It is also worth noting that a lot of people who convert [i]away[/i] from Christianity do so because of a poor grasp of Trinitarian theology.)

2.) The incarnation. A lot of Muslims have a hard time distinguishing the difference between the theology of the incarnation and outright idolatry. The best place to begin a discussion about Jesus' divinity is with Mary. Muslims have considerable respect for Mary (Marian-related sites in the Holy Land are places of pilgrimage for Muslims too, especially her well at Ein Kerem). There is Qur'anic support for both the Virgin Birth and the Immaculate Conception, so this is an ideal place to begin discussion about Jesus' life.

3.) The crucifixion. The primary Islamic argument given against Jesus' tormet is that God would never allow such a noble prophet to suffer such an agonising death. A different concept of God is at work here. Muslims envisage Him as being exalted, glorious - He would never share in human suffering. Yet the glory of Jesus was the cross. The entire suggestion is revolting to Muslims. This is a delicate topic for that reason and should be approached with sensitivity.

4.) Sin, free will, and the hope of redemption. Muslims are, by and large, believers in double predestination. (Not all of them are, so ask the person you are talking to what s/he thinks about this topic before proceeding.) As in Judaism, 'salvation' is a foreign concept to most Muslims. Forgiveness is not. One of the ninety-nine names of Allah is 'the Great Forgiver'. Talk about the person's image of divine forgiveness. Is there a limit to it? What must a person do to receive mercy? Is it a gift for everyone? Is there any tangible evidence of mercy on earth? (This discussion could lead to the centrality of the crucifixion and resurrection in Christianity.)

[u][b]Other Advice[/b][/u]

1.) Talk [i]with[/i] people, not [i]at[/i] them. Realise that their spirituality is not all about 'holy wars' and 'honour killings', that they have a genuine love for God, and that you are questioning something that is very precious to them. Be gentle. I've seen a lot of missionaries at work with Muslims, all with the best of intentions and many of them with the subtlety of your average kitchen mallet. They do more harm than good.

2.) Ask questions about the person's understanding of and concerns about Christianity. A lot of Muslims whom I've met are put off by the lack of structured, disciplined prayer that they see in Christianity. They are very attached to their five daily prayers and regular remembrance of God. (This is where the Divine Office comes in very useful.) Others may be worried by the lack of modesty that they see in the dress of Christians. Still others are concerned that they will be expected to start aggressively condemning their Muslim family and cut off all ties with their friends. The concerns vary from person to person. Listen and understand.

3.) Don't try to do any of these things outside a mosque.

Edited August 9, 2007 by Cathoholic Anonymous

[Mateo el Feo]

CA,

I think your post might be of better use in its own thread. It would seem a shame to hide your advice deep in one of Budge's threads.