Galloglasses Posted June 19, 2008 Share Posted June 19, 2008 btw RKWright, I've already hammered the fact that the Historical Jesus did exist in the Bible Thread, he's starting the exact same arguement here with 'the other Jesus' idea, for some reason. [quote]But what if people believed Jesus was not actually god. There were certainly people who taught that. Or what about people who taught that Jesus was more militant, that they were to rise up. Or people that taught that these new believers needed to be circumcised.[/quote] Very subtle Ice Burn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkwright Posted June 19, 2008 Share Posted June 19, 2008 Yea I kinda see that in this thread and the others... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reyb Posted June 19, 2008 Author Share Posted June 19, 2008 [quote name='rkwright' post='1576087' date='Jun 19 2008, 12:17 PM']But what if people believed Jesus was not actually god. There were certainly people who taught that. Or what about people who taught that Jesus was more militant, that they were to rise up. Or people that taught that these new believers needed to be circumcised.[/quote] [quote name='Galloglasses' post='1576170' date='Jun 19 2008, 01:22 PM']btw RKWright, I've already hammered the fact that the Historical Jesus did exist in the Bible Thread, he's starting the exact same arguement here with 'the other Jesus' idea, for some reason. Very subtle Ice Burn.[/quote] [quote name='rkwright' post='1576182' date='Jun 19 2008, 01:29 PM']Yea I kinda see that in this thread and the others...[/quote] [indent]I have said this in my previous post and I will say it again so that you may know I have no bad intention for being here. [post="1312672"]Thank you Lord Philip for being good to me and though you do not know me personally, you prayed for me and I am hoping you will always pray for me. I feel your good intentions – the more it weakens me to ask reasonable and valid questions which may hurt you in anyway. I wish, one day, Protestants will learn to listen to the arguments of Roman Priest and Bishops and vice-versa – setting aside small differences and religio-political-leadership. Today is the day, here in Phatmass[/post][/indent]. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkwright Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 I don't think you have bad intentions at all, I'm sorry for my example using the term 'nonsensical'. I actually used that to demonstrate a 'false gospel' because so far I feel like your posts have not been nonsensical. Could you respond to my post #89, it may help facilitate the entire discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reyb Posted June 20, 2008 Author Share Posted June 20, 2008 (edited) ... Edited June 20, 2008 by reyb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reyb Posted June 20, 2008 Author Share Posted June 20, 2008 [quote name='rkwright' post='1576086' date='Jun 19 2008, 12:15 PM']It seems to me that your argument is spread over 3-4 different topics. Is there some way you could post, one coherent argument here? I don't want to present a strawman, but this is what I gather your argument is... If there are these multiple Jesuses how do we know who the true one is? And if all the churches are referencing to the same 'historical' Jesus, then how can they all be wrong? Is this generally what you are arguing?[/quote] [indent]If there are these multiple Jesuses how do we know who the true one is? ------------------------------------------ Do not worry how to know who the true one is. Seek for the Truth and you will find it. [/indent] [indent]And if all the churches are referencing to the same 'historical' Jesus, then how can they all be wrong? ------------------------------------ Because they do no want to follow the Aposlte's instruction. Come together, Do not judge each other and wait for the lord to come. and he will come.[/indent] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galloglasses Posted June 20, 2008 Share Posted June 20, 2008 (edited) [quote name='reyb' post='1577373' date='Jun 20 2008, 09:34 AM'][indent]If there are these multiple Jesuses how do we know who the true one is?[/quote] The one thats answering your prayers. [quote]------------------------------------------ Do not worry how to know who the true one is. Seek for the Truth and you will find it. [/indent] [indent]And if all the churches are referencing to the same 'historical' Jesus, then how can they all be wrong?[/quote] Because the fault lies not with Jesus, but with the other Churches themselves. Heresy. [quote]------------------------------------ Because they do no want to follow the Aposlte's instruction. Come together, Do not judge each other and wait for the lord to come. and he will come.[/indent][/quote] We already do that. Which is why we are not compromising our teachings to suit the Protestants. Doesn't mean we should not defend the truth that is within us when we are challenged. To walk away from confrontation is Honourable, to fight to defend is Noble. Edited June 20, 2008 by Galloglasses Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reyb Posted June 21, 2008 Author Share Posted June 21, 2008 [quote name='Galloglasses' post='1577618' date='Jun 20 2008, 02:06 PM']The one thats answering your prayers. Because the fault lies not with Jesus, but with the other Churches themselves. Heresy. We already do that. Which is why we are not compromising our teachings to suit the Protestants. Doesn't mean we should not defend the truth that is within us when we are challenged. To walk away from confrontation is Honourable, to fight to defend is Noble.[/quote] [indent]Can you please tell me where in the scripture, this instruction of the Aposltes that you are saying? (from where you said 'we already do that'?[/indent] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jnorm888 Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 (edited) [quote name='reyb' post='1348983' date='Aug 3 2007, 07:05 PM'][indent]The subject of all faith, belief and controversies in Christianity and even other religion like Islam is Jesus himself. As some sayings of story- teller, the coming of Jesus is best story ever told in the history of humanity, may I ask, is there really a solid evidence of Jesus’ existence besides the Holy Scripture?[/indent][/quote] As takin from my blog: [quote][size=3]"Did Jesus really exist? Dispite the obvious answer to the question, I still find some Atheists and agnostics on myspace that believe he never existed, and that outside of the Bible there is no evidence that he actually existed. If you ever run into any silly comments like that just mention: Josephus. He mentions Jesus and his brother James, now some Atheists will try to deny that by saying, it was christian forgery by christian monks, but the truth is the first christian monk was Saint Anthony. And he lived around 270 A.D. And people knew of Josephus's mentioning of Saint James and Jesus long before then. Alot of modern scholars .......even some Jewish ones believe that those statements were indeed authentic. One can also mention The early second century Roman historian Tacitus. He not only mentions Jesus, but also mentions that He was put to death by Pontius Pilate, the procurator of Judea in the reign of Tiberius Ceasor. One can also add to that the pagan critic Celsus. Origen gave rejoinders for his arguments so we still have what this christian hating pagan had to say......and he never doubted the existence of Jesus. So where does this doubt come from? It comes from Germany!!! In the mid to late 18 hundreds the German highercritical/philosophical naturalistic scholar [b]Bruno Bauer[/b] invented the argument that Jesus never existed. The idea is less than 150 years old. It was a naturalistic reconstruction of history. Today, most modern scholars will not risk their reputation by saying something silly like "Jesus never existed". Most modern scholars believe Jesus was a real historical person. So if you ever run into someone that thinks Jesus never existed....... give them the facts, pray for them, so that God will open up a window of oppurtinity by giving them eyes to see & ears to hear, then share Jesus with them so they too can know His ever-Existence."[/size][/quote] JNORM888 Edited June 23, 2008 by jnorm888 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galloglasses Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 (edited) [quote name='reyb' post='1578478' date='Jun 21 2008, 08:47 AM'][indent]Can you please tell me where in the scripture, this instruction of the Aposltes that you are saying? (from where you said 'we already do that'?[/indent][/quote] (1 Peter 3:15)"Always be prepared to make a defense to any one who calls you to account for the hope that is in you." This is why we so vigorously defend our claim to legitimacy and authority. And denounce heresy as what it is; lies. And: (Matthew 7:1, 2) "Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you." We judge others according to the truth. So in turn God will Judge us in accordance with the truth. We leave them alone if they do not want the truth, we are not allowed to exact wrath upon them. But this does not stop us from tearing into their arguements when they, or anyone else, sees fit to challenge us. Now don't be confused, you often hear people say only the first part of this verse, ""Do not judge, or you too will be judged." While ignoring the rest of it. To expose Christians as hypocritical in their arguements. The passage is not telling us not to judge, but be careful when judging. (It is impossible for a human being not to judge other human beings on SOMETHING. Otherwise we become passive. For example, if we where not allowed to Judge others, we could not judge a criminal) Edited June 23, 2008 by Galloglasses Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reyb Posted June 23, 2008 Author Share Posted June 23, 2008 [quote name='Galloglasses' post='1580105' date='Jun 23 2008, 10:03 AM'](1 Peter 3:15)"Always be prepared to make a defense to any one who calls you to account for the hope that is in you." This is why we so vigorously defend our claim to legitimacy and authority. And denounce heresy as what it is; lies.[/quote] [indent]So you are defending your faith against other believers (for example Protestants)[/indent] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galloglasses Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 If neccesary? Yes. Because they have accepted a Heresy, I need to defend the Faith against falshood. Even if it means i'm on the defensive all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reyb Posted June 23, 2008 Author Share Posted June 23, 2008 [quote name='Galloglasses' post='1580105' date='Jun 23 2008, 10:03 AM'](1 Peter 3:15)"Always be prepared to make a defense to any one who calls you to account for the hope that is in you." This is why we so vigorously defend our claim to legitimacy and authority. And denounce heresy as what it is; lies.[/quote] [indent]This is one of the teachings of the Roman Catholic Church or any Protestant Churches that to me is not acceptable as teaching of an apostle. Let me post our subject verse: 1 Peter 3:8-18 [color="#FF0000"]13 Who is going to harm you if you are eager to do good? 14 But even if you should suffer for what is right, you are blessed. "Do not fear what they fear; do not be frightened." 15 But in your hearts set apart Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect, 16 keeping a clear conscience, so that those who speak maliciously against your good behavior in Christ may be ashamed of their slander. 17 It is better, if it is God's will, to suffer for doing good than for doing evil. [/color]NIV In other translation: 1 Peter 3:13-17 [color="#FF0000"]And who is he who will harm you if you become followers of what is good? 14 But even if you should suffer for righteousness' sake, you are blessed. "And do not be afraid of their threats, nor be troubled." 15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts, and always be ready to give a defense to everyone who asks you a reason for the hope that is in you, with meekness and fear; 16 having a good conscience, that when they defame you as evildoers, those who revile your good conduct in Christ may be ashamed. 17 For it is better, if it is the will of God, to suffer for doing good than for doing evil. [/color]NKJV Are these verses really meant to defend your faith against each other? Or it means ‘to explain the reason to those who ask you about the hope that is in you.’[/indent] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reyb Posted June 24, 2008 Author Share Posted June 24, 2008 [quote name='jnorm888' post='1579764' date='Jun 22 2008, 08:01 PM']As takin from my blog: JNORM888[/quote] [indent][post="1438688"]Please read this regarding 'other Jesus'.[/post].[/indent] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galloglasses Posted June 24, 2008 Share Posted June 24, 2008 Why do I feel like we are running in cricles? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts