Lil Red Posted July 19, 2007 Share Posted July 19, 2007 if a couple knows that they are sterile before they get married, are they still allowed to get married within the Catholic Church? Please provide documentation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scardella Posted July 19, 2007 Share Posted July 19, 2007 Impotence is an impediment to marriage, but apparently not sterility, cf Catholic encyclopedia - [url="http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07695a.htm"]http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07695a.htm[/url] [quote]The impotency which is a cause of nullity is the incapacity of having conjugal relations (impotentia coeundi), not incapacity of engendering (impotentia generandi), in other words, sterility.[/quote] I think there are probably better references, but this is a start, at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adt6247 Posted July 19, 2007 Share Posted July 19, 2007 [quote name='Lil Red' post='1334707' date='Jul 19 2007, 12:50 PM']if a couple knows that they are sterile before they get married, are they still allowed to get married within the Catholic Church? Please provide documentation.[/quote] Sarah was barren, but Abraham married her anyway. It was a valid marriage, and through this marriage Isreal descended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragamuffin Posted July 19, 2007 Share Posted July 19, 2007 [quote name='scardella' post='1334793' date='Jul 19 2007, 12:41 PM']Impotence is an impediment to marriage, but apparently not sterility, cf Catholic encyclopedia - [url="http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07695a.htm"]http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07695a.htm[/url] I think there are probably better references, but this is a start, at least.[/quote] I don't understand this. If Mary was a virgin and was pledged to be one for her whole life as the Catholic Church believes, yet Joseph married her though he knew he wasn't to have sex with her, why would being unable to have sex because of a physical problem be a reason not to allow someone to get married? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adt6247 Posted July 19, 2007 Share Posted July 19, 2007 [quote name='scardella' post='1334793' date='Jul 19 2007, 02:41 PM']Impotence is an impediment to marriage, but apparently not sterility, cf Catholic encyclopedia - [url="http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07695a.htm"]http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/07695a.htm[/url] I think there are probably better references, but this is a start, at least.[/quote] I don't think the contents of this article apply; it states that marriage to a non-Christian are null and void. This is not true under the 1983 code of canon law. It should still be in effect, as should the prohibition of marrying a heretic without dispensation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adt6247 Posted July 19, 2007 Share Posted July 19, 2007 [quote name='Ragamuffin' post='1334852' date='Jul 19 2007, 03:21 PM']I don't understand this. If Mary was a virgin and was pledged to be one for her whole life as the Catholic Church believes, yet Joseph married her though he knew he wasn't to have sex with her, why would being unable to have sex because of a physical problem be a reason not to allow someone to get married?[/quote] The nature of marriage was changed when Christ elevated it to a sacrament. Also, one normally isn't brought into this world by Virgin birth; I'd say Mary and Joseph are the exception, not the rule. Finally, it is never stated that Joseph was impotent; he had the capability of performing the nuptial act, even if he did not do so. This post is all speculation by me; do not take it as me reciting church dogma. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StColette Posted July 19, 2007 Share Posted July 19, 2007 [quote name='Ragamuffin' post='1334852' date='Jul 19 2007, 01:21 PM']I don't understand this. If Mary was a virgin and was pledged to be one for her whole life as the Catholic Church believes, yet Joseph married her though he knew he wasn't to have sex with her, why would being unable to have sex because of a physical problem be a reason not to allow someone to get married?[/quote] Because the institution of marriage ( the Sacrament of Marriage ) is ordered toward unity and procreation. For a person who knows that they are impotent enters into marriage and then later reveals to the his/her spouse that they are impotent and did not share this information would invalidate the marriage. According to Canon Law [quote]A person, who suffers from impotence either physically or psychologically, cannot enter into marriage because they cannot physically consummate the marriage. According to the Code of Canon Law 1084, antecedent and perpetual impotence at the time of marriage invalidates the marriage. What this means is that a person who is impotent cannot enter into marriage validly. However, infertility does not prevent a person from validly entering into marriage.[/quote] Because impotence will not allow them to physically consummate the marriage, the marriage is not valid. However, Canon Law is clear to point out that infertility does not prevent a person from entering into marriage. Women can easily have times in their lifespan where they will be infertile. There's a difference between impotence and infertility. Some other quotes: [quote]CCC 1652 "By its very nature the institution of marriage and married love is ordered to the procreation and education of the offspring and it is in them that it finds its crowning glory." The Church also teaches that marriage has two main purposes: the more important is procreation, the begetting and education of Children, raising them to worship God; the second, is the consortium vitae, the companionship and union of married love.[/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scardella Posted July 19, 2007 Share Posted July 19, 2007 Code of Canon Law from vatican.va: [quote]Can. 1084 §1. Antecedent and perpetual impotence to have intercourse, whether on the part of the man or the woman, whether absolute or relative, nullifies marriage by its very nature. §2. If the impediment of impotence is doubtful, whether by a doubt about the law or a doubt about a fact, a marriage must not be impeded nor, while the doubt remains, declared null. §3. Sterility neither prohibits nor nullifies marriage, without prejudice to the prescript of ⇒ can. 1098.[/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scardella Posted July 19, 2007 Share Posted July 19, 2007 As a side note: Can a woman be impotent? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StColette Posted July 19, 2007 Share Posted July 19, 2007 [quote name='scardella' post='1334933' date='Jul 19 2007, 02:27 PM']As a side note: Can a woman be impotent?[/quote] While I was a Biology major I had to read an article on this. And if I'm not mistaken it says it is possible just not as common as impotence in men. Hmm wonder where all my bio notes and books are Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted July 19, 2007 Author Share Posted July 19, 2007 what if a woman (before she is married) has to have surgery to have her ovaries removed or something else that would mean she would never have children? this is still not an impediment to marriage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adt6247 Posted July 19, 2007 Share Posted July 19, 2007 [quote name='Lil Red' post='1334953' date='Jul 19 2007, 04:52 PM']what if a woman (before she is married) has to have surgery to have her ovaries removed or something else that would mean she would never have children? this is still not an impediment to marriage?[/quote] Depends on the reason for the surgery. For instance, if a woman has a hysterectomy, and she does so because she has uterine cancer, that's perfectly legitimate. Inability to conceive is a side effect of an operation intended to produce a good (save her life). If, however, she does so electively in order to prevent pregnancy, that's not legitimate. But in terms of validity of marriage, sterility, whether from birth defect, chemical imbalance, truama, age, or surgery, is NEVER an impediment to marriage. Inability to perform the nuptial act, however, is. Even in the case of infertility, God can choose to create life through the nuptial act, otherwise Isaac would have never been born to Sarah. But the nuptial act is necessary for a canonically valid marriage; in fact, a marriage never consummated may be declared null at any time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted July 19, 2007 Author Share Posted July 19, 2007 [quote name='adt6247' post='1334963' date='Jul 19 2007, 02:16 PM']But the nuptial act is necessary for a canonically valid marriage; in fact, a marriage never consummated may be declared null at any time.[/quote] i get that, i just needed clarification on the other. God bless you! : Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kateri05 Posted July 20, 2007 Share Posted July 20, 2007 [quote name='StColette' post='1334949' date='Jul 19 2007, 01:44 PM']While I was a Biology major I had to read an article on this. And if I'm not mistaken it says it is possible just not as common as impotence in men. Hmm wonder where all my bio notes and books are [/quote] i'm really interested to know how. the only thing i can think of is female genital mutilation, practiced in some african cultures, could create female impotence. let me know if you find those notes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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