Piccoli Fiori JMJ Posted May 29, 2007 Share Posted May 29, 2007 Some stuff from a book I have: [quote]Saying God does not exist is like a young kid saying he has no grandfather just because he has never seen him. Why show so much animosity against God? Animosity must itself be directed against an illusion or a reality. If it is against a figment of a person's imagination (an illusion), then it would lead to questioning of the the person's mental balance. If there is no God, why the need to show such hostility? Is there anyone still around today who still vehemently opposes Cicero or Hannibal or Napoleon? They were all hated when they lived, but that hatred died when they died. Hate ceases when the thing hated ceases. Either the opposition is against something that does not exist, leaving them bereft of reason for opposition, or the target of their hostility does in fact exist. From history, every civilization from every part of the world had some sort of religion professing a belief in a higher power or deity of some sort. No race has yet been found that did not believe in some supreme being, something greater than themselves. A belief so universal that it cannot b attributed to any one nation, that is present among tribes which have no contact with the rest of the world, cannot be due to chance. If we accept human reason as trust worthy, we must recognize the fact of the existence of God. In everything in the world, there is a long line of causes, each dependent on a higher one before it. No evidence can be found to contradict that assertion. We cannot go back through this list indefinitely, There has to be an uncaused cause that began that line of causes. If there ever was a moment at which nothing existed, nothing could ever exist. We believe that nothing can precede from nothing in the natural world, but when it comes to God's creation, some proclaim, "This is an exception." Yet they do not prove the exception, they merely deny the fact. They do not believe because they do not want to believe. It does not solve the problem to become vague by going to the distant past. Some say that the first living being came from lower beings. Then where did those beings come from? A being cannot cause itself. Some may suggest that the sun is responsible for life. Then where does the sun get the power to give life. You cannot give money to a person in need of money if you simply have no money. The idea that life just sprang up in the beginning and developed as time progressed is scientifically unsound and even Pasteur through his scientific findings proved the impossibility of spontaneous generation years ago. "Show me a watch without a watch maker, then I'll take a universe without a Universe-maker"--G.K. Chesterton Wherever we see a thing in perfect order or acting according to plan, our common sense tells us that there is an intelligent planner behind it. All over the earth there are things working in perfect order. Therefore, these things demand some Intelligent Planner. Suppose we paid taxes according to our own conscience and nothing else? Perhaps a few would pay more than their share; some would give what they pay now, but the vast majority would pay little or nothing at all. The government simply could not function! Private judgment and individual opinion are just as unreliable in determining whether worship is to be paid to God as in determining the taxes to be paid to the government. There are standards outside ourselves regulating religion, governing our relations with God. Even all nations have possessed at least some primitive form of religion. It is a part of our very nature. Otherwise people would have abolished it as unnecessary a long time ago.[/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted May 29, 2007 Share Posted May 29, 2007 [quote name='hot stuff' post='1283469' date='May 29 2007, 03:26 PM']I'm not looking for a good cop bad cop thing here Al. I'm just being as straightforward as I can with the Godless.[/quote] I know. I wasn't really doing anything like that. I'm just introducing myself by exhibiting how I can make points on both sides and how I'm really more interested in the truth than in just defending my position (it seems clear that most Christians they get over there just go in and try to advance the idea that there is a God by any means necessary) [quote]maybe in a couple weeks Aloysius will be able to move past the existence of existence.[/quote] lol. I am quite enjoying myself in that discussion, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scardella Posted May 29, 2007 Share Posted May 29, 2007 (edited) Some of these arguments are absolutely hilarious! A lot of these are arguments against Christianity anyway, not that God does not exist. "Jesus is a jerk" therefore there is no God... I love this one: Pascal's wager is wrong because different people believe in different gods. Who formulated these arguments? I suppose the person was completely unbiased and logical because he was an atheist? eh? I'm no philosopher, but I could refute a bunch of these... Edited May 29, 2007 by scardella Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prose Posted May 29, 2007 Share Posted May 29, 2007 [quote name='Revprodeji' post='1283212' date='May 29 2007, 01:42 AM'][img]http://www.vampirerave.com/premium/files/moonmystic/scary%20bunny.jpg[/img] hot stuff link me...I wanna play.[/quote] That should be the FBC logo!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XIX Posted May 29, 2007 Share Posted May 29, 2007 Al, your stuff is too dense for me. : That's what I get for being a business major. : Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prose Posted May 29, 2007 Share Posted May 29, 2007 Which forum are you posting in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Posted May 29, 2007 Share Posted May 29, 2007 questions and debates Al is already beating me. someone gave him a positive karma point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted May 29, 2007 Share Posted May 29, 2007 haha yep. we should compete for karma points. haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Posted May 30, 2007 Share Posted May 30, 2007 [quote name='Aloysius' post='1283731' date='May 29 2007, 05:56 PM']haha yep. we should compete for karma points. haha[/quote] you're on! But I'm trying to figure out which is better, getting karma points or not.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Posted May 30, 2007 Share Posted May 30, 2007 KnightofChrist has joined the ranks!! Woohoo!! I haven't had this much fun online in a while! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightofChrist Posted May 30, 2007 Share Posted May 30, 2007 Indeed! But I return to work tomorrow... I will most likely have to bow out for the most part... I hope not... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnydigit Posted May 30, 2007 Share Posted May 30, 2007 kinda disappointed. after seeing the topic i thought the website would have some somewhat convincing arguments that go more in depth. instead they only go as far as the basic fundamentals which any confirmation student should be able to answer.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sojourner Posted May 30, 2007 Share Posted May 30, 2007 The forum is where all the fun is Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scardella Posted May 30, 2007 Share Posted May 30, 2007 Where's the forum? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sojourner Posted May 30, 2007 Share Posted May 30, 2007 [quote name='scardella' post='1284262' date='May 30 2007, 09:52 AM']Where's the forum?[/quote] [url="http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forum/index.php"]here[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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