Kindergartners To Be Taught Homosexuality, Bisexuality, And Transsexu

[Anthony]

[quote name='carrdero' post='1282332' date='May 27 2007, 07:20 PM']The Bible in not a required textbook in public school systems. Even if it was part of the curriculum it would be severely outdated.
Regardless of some people's heterosexual preference, homosexuality, bi-sexuality and trans-sexuality happens. It happens everyday, it is happening right now, with no evidence of a sentencing, punishment or judgment from a Higher BEing.[/quote]

Oh, so that makes it okay then? Dang it. You just wait until your final judgement. With that mentality that nothing has happened yet to these people. God has the final judgement and you will be judged accordingly. By the way, relativism is a dangerous tool of the devil.

[doe-jo]

[quote name='carrdero' post='1282283' date='May 27 2007, 04:10 PM']It will never hold in court, at the most, people will probably perceive this incident as an "accident".[/quote]

[url="http://youtube.com/watch?v=e6VctU5WsX4"]http://youtube.com/watch?v=e6VctU5WsX4[/url]

i would like you to watch this video and tell me who's fault this is.. i know its not as bad as getting hit by a car but it pretty much has the same concept. would this be the dancer's fault? probably not since that was their area and he did not see the kid. would it be the kid's fault? probably not because the kid did not know what was going on. she was probably wandering around. would it be the parent's fault? i would think so because the parent has full responsibilty on the kid and the parent knows that if the kid went to where she went, she'd probably get hit somehow.

but you say that this would be just an accident right?.. well, i agree that it was. but could this type of accident be avoided? definately. how? if the parent was paying attention to where the kid was going, then it could have been avoided.

Edited May 29, 2007 by doe-jo

[Socrates]

[quote name='carrdero' post='1282332' date='May 27 2007, 06:20 PM']The Bible in not a required textbook in public school systems. Even if it was part of the curriculum it would be severely outdated.
Regardless of some people's heterosexual preference, homosexuality, bi-sexuality and trans-sexuality happens. It happens everyday, it is happening right now, with no evidence of a sentencing, punishment or judgment from a Higher BEing.[/quote]
Murders, thefts and rapes are happening every day with "no evidence of a sentencing, punishment or judgment from a Higher BEing." This is one of the weakest lines of "reasoning" I've ever seen.

So nothing is to be considered wrong unless we see it immediately punished by God? As long as people get away with something, that makes it ok?

And just because something happens, it means it should be taught postively to our five-year-olds?

But since you have basically rejected any objective morality or right-and-wrong, it is pointless for you to discuss morality. You have destroyed and basis for your own arguments.

[Socrates]

[quote name='VaticanIILiturgist' post='1283126' date='May 28 2007, 10:44 PM']I guess it just shocks me how rarely discussion about helping the homeless, poor, sick, under-insured, over-worked, abused, forgotten occurs on these forusm, but if we talk about SEX everyone gets riled up and is calling for the death penalty. Why is biology so interesting to orthodox Catholics?

The embracing of hiphop culture and language such as "dopest" on these forums seems to me a perpetuation of a violent, dangerous culture but no one seems to mind. But dare we speak of letting kids know they're are other ways people have chosen to exist in and the dogs are unleashed. Double standards, me thinks.

I had to give a homeless man my lunch the other day at an intersection because he hadn't eaten in three days. Who's enraged about that?[/quote]
That is such a weak line of evasive liberal carp.

Orthodox Catholic: "Forcing schools to teach homosexuality to kindergardners is wrong!"
Liberal: "Obviously, you don't care about the poor!"

There have been plenty of discussions on poverty, charity, and economics on here.
And nothing is preventing you from starting a thread on such topics yourself, if it is of such pressing concern to you.

But it appears you are more intererested on posting on a thread concerning "biology" and "what goes on between people's legs" and self-righteously chiding people for being enraged at government forcing immoral "teaching" to young children.

If the topic of this thread is so unimportant and uninteresting to you, why are you even posting on here, much less getting riled up yourself?

[quote name='VaticanIILiturgist' post='1283127' date='May 28 2007, 10:46 PM']Most homosexuals I know could care less about YOUR CHILDREN. Get some perspective. Do you think there is a room somewhere where gay people sit plotting against your straight life?[/quote]
Then they can keep their homosexuality out of the kindergarten classroom, rather than vouching for laws to have it forced down the throats (maybe a bad image there) of kids barely learning to read!

This isn't about what people do at home behind locked doors, but about a [i]law[/i] [i]requiring[/i] immorality to be promoted to small children in school.

In the immortal words of Pink Floyd: "Leave them kids alone!"

[ofpheritup]

[quote name='carrdero' post='1283312' date='May 29 2007, 09:05 AM']It was written in and by the perception of primitive scribes and combined by the ancient idealistic endeavors of biased scholars which severely limits the foresight, wisdom and enlightenment that we have all come to understand as GOD. If I want to be informed and updated on the latest and most current developments, I wouldn’t pick up a newspaper from the Renaissance period.

Well then if GOD is Eternal, I’m sure you wouldn’t have any problem agreeing with me that the Bible is unfinished.
Yes, well before you outfit me for one of those latex gloves, I’d like to introduce you to an amazing concept called the fingerprint.[/quote]



Sorry, no one home, maybe you try next door.

[carrdero]

[quote]Anthony writes: Oh, so that makes it okay then? Dang it. You just wait until your final judgement. With that mentality that nothing has happened yet to these people. God has the final judgement and you will be judged accordingly. [/quote]I shall. What is most disturbing is receiving comments from other people who are more interested, concerned and eager of this Day of Judgment than I am. Some people have already pronounced Final Judgment on me and I haven’t even passed away yet.

[quote]Anthony writes: By the way, relativism is a dangerous tool of the devil.[/quote]

How about thinking? Is questioning, wondering, understanding and reasoning tools of the devil too?

[carrdero]

[quote]doe-jo writes: i would like you to watch this video and tell me who's fault this is.. i know its not as bad as getting hit by a car but it pretty much has the same concept. would this be the dancer's fault?[/quote]
To be honest, with all the open space I was led to believe that the break dancer was going to get hit by a car. It is a little difficult to tell who’s fault it was because by the counter, the little child comes strolling out about 00:20 of the video. We are not given enough previous information. What were the circumstances before the child starting running out? Did the child break away from a guardian who was struggling to keep them close and secure? Children can become quite unpredictable you understand. This is the same thing that I have been discussing to SJP about (see Post #99). In many cases we do not have enough information to find blame or to make sound judgments on any one. GOD does though. Conclusion: Let GOD find blame and make sund judgments. Interesting video by the way.

[Guest stillpolski...]

[quote name='carrdero' post='1282244' date='May 27 2007, 04:24 PM']Because of its continued existence, I too believe that it is not an offense or concern with God. Informing children about the knowledge of this existence promotes understanding. Let the parents deal with the morality issues and let children make their own choice.[/quote]

If you dont necessarily support the position of the Catholic Church on this subject, then what position do you support? the one that suits your own needs and wants? the one that accepts our deteriorating culture? the position that attacks the family, the union of marriage, and the innocence of children?

I am very curious on how these subjects will be taught to 4,5 and 6 year olds. Is it really going to teach how to respect and love the person, or is it going to promote and encourage their wrongdoings? Brutal stuff... Brutal!

Homosexuality, Bisexuality and Transexuality threaten the true meaning of Love and human dignity. We must show the same respect and love towards people who choose to live these lifestyles as any other lifestyle, however as Catholics, we should never accept these acts, the same way I dont accept my own sins. With that said...all this talk is WAY to advanced for a child to understand correctly.
I have an idea, lets' start teaching 5 years olds about Abortion, and how they are the lucky ones, cause the unlucky ones were murdered by the governments that support and promote this horrible crime against humanity.

I'm not attacking anyone, I'm just opening windows to a discussion.

[carrdero]

[quote]Socrates writes: Murders, thefts and rapes are happening every day with "no evidence of a sentencing, punishment or judgment from a Higher BEing." This is one of the weakest lines of "reasoning" I've ever seen.[/quote]Do you have another fundamental line of reasoning? Again I am not disagreeing with the existence of GOD I am more concerned about His methods of judgment. Have you ever witnessed another person on the receiving end of God’s justice?

[quote]Socrates writes: So nothing is to be considered wrong unless we see it immediately punished by God? As long as people get away with something, that makes it ok?[/quote]

What I believe is that [b][i]we[/i][/b] are the only ones to make these decisions about [b][i]ourselves[/i][/b]. If you don’t like to murder for one reason or another, don’t do it. You don’t like to steal for one reason or another, don’t do it. Does the thought of rape repulse you, don’t do it. Don’t agree with abortions, don’t put yourself in a position to have one but don’t expect other people to agree with the judgments and decisions that you have outlined for yourself. Such hopes or impractical and unrealistic because everyone is different and everyone is experiencing and existing under different cirumstances that you are.

[quote]Socrates writes: And just because something happens, it means it should be taught postively to our five-year-olds?[/quote]Just because it is taught positively does not mean that a child will use this knowledge effectively, practically or expectantly when they grow older. Look at the many religions and all the invested knowledge that parents rear children in. As they grow up, children usually stay in their religion, convert or eventually drop religious matters altogether. When it comes to knowledge and understanding there are no guarantees that children will remain with or even remember what they have learned, there is just too much other knowledge and beliefs to understand and accumulate.

[quote]Socrates writes: But since you have basically rejected any objective morality or right-and-wrong, it is pointless for you to discuss morality. You have destroyed and basis for your own arguments.[/quote]

If you want to discuss why [b][i]you[/i][/b] believe that stealing and murder is incorrect for [b][i]you[/i][/b] I would be very content and patient to listen and understand the reason why [b][i]you[/i][/b] encourage these beliefs. But if you want to discuss why cmotherofpearl has suddenly developed a killer’s lust and an obsessive compulsion for all my materialistic possessions we could only speculate, which may only conclude with unfair misunderstandings, misrepresenations and misplaced judgment. It would be best if we asked cmotherofpearl ourselves as to the reasons why she desires to kill and steal (though I sincerely suspect that she secretly covets my Fast Food Toy Collection).

Edited May 30, 2007 by carrdero

[carrdero]

[quote]Stillpolski writes: If you dont necessarily support the position of the Catholic Church on this subject, then what position do you support? the one that suits your own needs and wants? [/quote]I do not need or desire any sexual preference for myself or others. As I mentioned before (Post #44) that I do not believe we require sex to live a fulfilling existence.


[quote]Stillpolski writes: the one that accepts our deteriorating culture? the position that attacks the family, the union of marriage, and the innocence of children?[/quote]

Homosexuality is not a threat, it is another sexual preference and like heterosexuality, it has its fair share of concerns and values.


[quote]Stillpolski writes: I am very curious on how these subjects will be taught to 4,5 and 6 year olds. Is it really going to teach how to respect and love the person, or is it going to promote and encourage their wrongdoings? Brutal stuff... Brutal![/quote]I am curious too.

[quote]Stillpolski writes: Homosexuality, Bisexuality and Transexuality threaten the true meaning of Love and human dignity.[/quote]
How so? And how do you compare this True Love and dignity to the rate of divorce and adultery of married couples or the love and dignity shared between a man and a woman who aren’t married? I don’t believe that sex is a True measure of Love though it could be an extension.

[quote]Stillpolski writes: We must show the same respect and love towards people who choose to live these lifestyles as any other lifestyle, however as Catholics, we should never accept these acts, the same way I dont accept my own sins.[/quote]Respecting does not mean the same thing as accepting. A woman or a man who is in an abusive relationship does not have to stay in that relationship and accept this abuse but if they wanted to leave or break off the relationship they should respect this person and leave in peace.

[quote]Stillpolski writes: With that said...all this talk is WAY to advanced for a child to understand correctly.[/quote]
Depends on a few factors; The intelligence and the ability and understanding of the child (and I have been in the presence of some very sharp 5 year olds), how it is taught and if parents prefer their children learning this.

Edited May 30, 2007 by carrdero

[SJP]

[quote]carrdero writes: This is the same thing that I have been discussing to SJP about (see Post #99). In many cases we do not have enough information to find blame or to make sound judgments on any one. GOD does though. Conclusion: Let GOD find blame and make sund judgments. Interesting video by the way.[/quote]

Just for the sake of clarification, it's really not the same thing. The previous scenario was one in which a parent allowed their children to make their own decision about playing in the street. In the event that that child was hit by a car, this could not be considered an "accident", but negligence on the part of the parent.

[carrdero]

[quote name='SJP' post='1284166' date='May 30 2007, 08:43 AM']Just for the sake of clarification, it's really not the same thing. The previous scenario was one in which a parent allowed their children to make their own decision about playing in the street. In the event that that child was hit by a car, this could not be considered an "accident", but negligence on the part of the parent.[/quote]
The negligence begins when one thinks that they or their loved ones are guaranteed to go anywhere, anytime in complete peace and security. Yes, by all means keep that child and parent together at all times, secured in a house in the sight of each other until the child grows old enough to know better but this may not be the kind existence that each person would believe to be fulfilling .

[SJP]

[quote]carrdero writes: The negligence begins when one thinks that they or their loved ones are guaranteed to go anywhere, anytime in complete peace and security. Yes, by all means keep that child and parent together at all times, secured in a house in the sight of each other until the child grows old enough to know better but this may not be the kind existence that each person would believe to be fulfilling.[/quote]

There is a line that can be drawn between what could properly be called an accident and what should be termed neglignce. I admit that at times the line may be blurry, but there is no doubt that true negligence exists.

For example, A father who ecourages his children to play with guns in the backyard while he takes a knap is most certainly negligent.

A mother who gives her 6 year old a bottle of whisky to quench her thirst is negligent.

This is just common sense.

[misereremi]

[quote name='Aloysius' post='1282095' date='May 27 2007, 06:58 PM']This is sexual abuse of minors, pure and simple[/quote]
Totally.

[Sirklawd]

This is really simple.

The state government of CA has decided that all parents are unable to teach their children about sex, gender, where babies come from, and other basics of human life. It says "parents either do not teach children about these topics, or do not teach them correctly. Our teachers, using a program we have engineered, will make up for where the parents failed"

I sure as hell will not be dictated to on how to raise my children by some government body that is pressured by a group of people most of which wont create kids of their own. They can do whatever they want with their lives, but the moment they start cutting off my ability as a parent, thats when I roll up the sleaves.

I've never been particular fond of public schools, as they give up the parental duty to total strangers, but this seals the deal. I will be homeschooling.

Honestly, do you think after a visual explaination of what anal sex is the teacher will say to the students "now some people think this is wrong because it doesnt produce life. Many religions out there believe this also to be morally wrong, and these religions play a huge role in the present-day political landscape of our country" ?

NOT. AT. ALL.