Internet Confessions

[Archaeology cat]

[quote name='homeschoolmom' post='1258357' date='Apr 28 2007, 12:31 AM']Or unless you go to a church built in the last 45 or so years... and you know it.
You've never heard of anyone making a face to face confession? Someone calling for an appointment to meet with Fr. in his office? Going to confession with a spiritual director?[/quote]

I only do face to face, because for me, it ensures that I hide nothing. I mean, the screen is there for those who want it, I just pull it aside.

[Resurrexi]

[quote name='VaticanIILiturgist' post='1259499' date='Apr 29 2007, 07:08 AM']Its in the rite...#46.

I make sure all the priests that I have celebrate penance at the parish I work for extend their hands.

Most people opt for a face-to-face confession at my parish, but even with a screen, the rite calls for extension of hands.[/quote]

Whether or not hands are supposed to be extended, it is not the necessary matter nor is it the necessary form of the Sacrament.

[quote][b]The Catechism of the Council of Trent, Part II:[/b]
THE MATTER



There is nothing that should be better known to the faithful than the matter of this Sacrament; hence they should be taught that Penance differs from the other Sacraments in this, that while the matter of the other Sacraments is some thing, whether natural or artificial, the matter, as it were, of the Sacrament of Penance is the acts of the penitent, - namely, contrition, confession and satisfaction, - as has been declared by the Council of Trent. Now, inasmuch as these acts are by divine institution required on the part of the penitent for the integrity of the Sacrament, and for the full and perfect remission of sin, they are called parts of Penance. It is not because they are not the real matter that they are called by the Council the matter as it were,22 but because they are not of that sort of matter which is applied externally, such, for instance, as water in Baptism and chrism in Confirmation.

As regards the opinion of some who hold that sins themselves are the matter of this Sacrament, it will be found, when carefully examined, that it does not really differ from the explanation already given. Thus we say that wood which is consumed by fire is the matter of fire. In the same way, sins which are destroyed by Penance may properly be called the matter of Penance.*





THE FORM OF PENANCE



Pastors should not neglect to explain the form of the Sacrament of Penance. A knowledge of it will excite the faithful to receive the grace of this Sacrament with the greatest possible devotion. Now the form is: I absolve thee, as may be inferred not only from the words, whatsoever you shall bind upon earth shall be bound also in heaven,23 but also from the teaching of Christ our Lord, handed down to us by the Apostles.

Moreover, since the Sacraments signify what they effect, the words, I absolve thee, signify that remission of sin is effected by the administration of this Sacrament; and hence it is plain that such is the perfect form of the Sacrament. For sins are, so to say, the chains by which the soul is bound, and from which it is freed by the Sacrament of Penance. And none the less truly does the priest pronounce the form over the penitent who, through perfect contrition, accompanied by the desire of confession, has already obtained remission of his sins from God.

Several prayers are added, not that they are necessary to the form, but in order to remove every obstacle that can impede the force and efficacy of the Sacrament owing to the fault of him to whom it is administered.

How thankful, then, should not sinners be to God for having bestowed such ample power on the priests of His Church! Unlike the priests of the Old Law who merely declared the leper cleansed from his leprosy,24 the power now given to the priests of the New Law is not limited to declaring the sinner absolved from his sins, but, as a minister of God, he truly absolves from sin. This is an effect of which God Himself, the author and source of grace and justice, is the principal cause.*
[url="http://catecheticsonline.com/Trent2.php"]http://catecheticsonline.com/Trent2.php[/url][/quote]

[Aloysius]

I do believe they extended their hand even in the old rite, and when they said "Absolvo te in nomine Patri et Filii et Spiritui Sancto" they made the sign of the cross as at a blessing.

Do not look for discord where there needn't be any, STM. sheesh.

[carrdero]

[quote name='Aloysius' post='1255884' date='Apr 25 2007, 12:26 AM']just to add a dynamic to this debate:

can sins be confessed over such a mode of communication, and then absolved in person? for instance, say some brillian priest came up with the idea of making confession more accessable and offered the oppurtunity of people emailing them a list of their sins; then advice is emailed as needed and at a specific time they come to receive absolution.

it may open itself to abuses and make it unwise in some ways, but it would seem to me that such a system would make for a valid sacrament.[/quote]
I am going to have to agree with Aloysius on this. As long as the practicing priest had the functioning keyboard letter keys to spell
“s-a-y t-h-r-e-e O-u-r F-a-t-h-e-r-s a-n-d t-w-o H-a-i-l M-a-r-y-s”
then I don’t see what the problem is.

[Aloysius]

uhh... I don't agree with you, though. lol, I was just probing into the nature of the sacrament; but no, at the very least the Absolution must be given in person; at the most, the confession of sins itself as well (I lean more towards the latter, but just wanted to add a dynamic of interest here)

[carrdero]

[quote name='Aloysius' post='1260405' date='Apr 30 2007, 01:00 AM']uhh... I don't agree with you, though. lol, I was just probing into the nature of the sacrament; but no, at the very least the Absolution must be given in person; at the most, the confession of sins itself as well (I lean more towards the latter, but just wanted to add a dynamic of interest here)[/quote]
my apologies, sorry about the misunderstanding

[bonoducchi]

[quote name='StThomasMore' post='1260215' date='Apr 29 2007, 11:21 PM']Whether or not hands are supposed to be extended, it is not the necessary matter nor is it the necessary form of the Sacrament.[/quote]

I never said it was....I was just pointing out that it is called for in the rite (are you saying we can change the rites and omit what we please? how liberal....) and correcting someone who said laying of hands was necessary form for absolution.

Saying you can omit extension of hands because it is not a form/matter issue is like saying you can omit the anamnesis from the EP...the form is a valid pronouncement of the consecratory prayer. You can mess with almost anything else and still have a valid consecration, so why bother with anything else... The sacraments are not about doing what's absolutely necessary. They are about engaging us body, mind and soul in an outpouring of grace.

Penance is such a great sacrament but some people (especially people over 55) have an express lane mentality. My district of parishes hosts 2 annual penance services during Lent and Advent. Every time, I have an old lady complain that individual confessions take too long - it should just be a quick list and you're done. That defeats the purpose of the sacrament. If we are truly to be reconciled with God through his Church, we must take time and delve into ourselves and then relish the absolving grace that we are in touch with in spite of the ugliness present within us. The extension of hands is such a powerful gesture of calling down God's grace - I would hate for it to be omitted.

A rant about almost nothing....I still am against internet confession.

[the Apologist]

[quote name='Pontifite 7 of 10' post='1258650' date='Apr 28 2007, 09:34 AM']I was just wondering because a while ago I was desperate, but I'm good now, and Its not like I've done it.[/quote]

I don't think anyone thinks you did it...(at least i don't) we are all just debating the topic... so it's all good.

Also i understand what you mean about feeling desperate. Sometimes the idea of just confessing by internet can be consoling and i think that is just our shame kicking in. But in time, like you said, it goes away.

Any, i definitely understand where you are coming from and can emphasis.