Pentecostalism

[M.SIGGA]

In order to be fair like our Protestant brothers have been by using Catholic sources to reference Catholicism, I got this from a Protestant Source www.bible.ca and I believe that it is creditable because most of the arguments I've seen against the Catholic Church are repeated on this website and these people are all saved (there is a salvation link on the first page), so by Protestant standards they are definitly inspired by the Holy Spirit. These seem like pretty serious accusations, so are these folks really Christians or is it a cult?

Major errors of Pentecostalism

Characteristics Of the Pentecostal Movement:

1. CULTIC ORIGINS & INFLUENCES - The Word of Faith Movement owes much of its teachings to E.W. Kenyon who was heavily influenced by Mind Science and New Thought Christianity (what became known as Unity School) in the early 1900's.

2. OVERSIMPLIFICATION - Quick and easy solutions to life's problems are offered the believer. There are various "KEYS" or "STEPS" to healing, wealth, financial prosperity, victory in life, etc.

3. ABUSE OF THE BIBLE - A consistent misapplication of Scriptural Texts due to ignorance of Biblical, Systematic, and Historical theology. Analogies, Proof-texting, lack of formal training in Hebrew & Greek all lead to wrong conclusions.

4. FALSE TEACHINGS - WOF teachers promote a wide variety of false teachings regarding Healing, Health, Prosperity, Demons, Salvation and the Atonement.

5. SPIRITUAL PRIDE - Leaders of the WOF REFUSE to dialog with other members of the Body of Christ regarding their teaching. They claim their teachings come by direct revelation knowledge from God and are not subject to human scrutiny.

6. WORLDLY/HUMANISTIC THEOLOGY- WOF presents a distorted vision of God and the Christian life. God is the supplier of financial prosperity, health, and victory when the believer uses their faith. WOF holds the concept that God's children should "eat the best, drive the best, and wear the best." Little emphasis on suffering from Christ, the cross, self-denial.

7. EXPERIENTIALISM - There is a strong emphasis on feeling and emotionalism versus the use of the mind and intellect. Intuitive guidance from the "hidden man of the heart" versus Bible study.

8. HEDONISM - Stress is on man-centered happiness versus God-centered holiness. They strive for heaven-on-earth now. This is evident in their teaching regarding money and possessions. All of the leading WOF teachers are millionaires or multimillionaires.

9. EXCLUSIVISM - Those who do not subscribe to their beliefs are "carnally-minded." They see themselves as "God's Remnant" and/or His "overcomers."

10. POWER RELIGION - The majority of their teachings and conferences center around "power" and the "anointing." There is a stress on teaching the authority of the believer over Satan and demons. Angels are our servants and we are to command them.

11. LACK OF BALANCE - Teachings stress FAITH, HEALTH, WEALTH, GIFTS OF THE SPIRIT, DELIVERANCE, SUPERNATURAL POWER, VICTORY. Little theology is taught, no systematic Bible teaching.

[Dave]

:: :clap:

[ironmonk]

Pentecostalism

Encyclopædia Britannica Article

charismatic religious movement that gave rise to a number of Protestant churches in the United States in the 20th century and that is unique in its belief that all Christians should seek a postconversion religious experience called baptism with the Holy Spirit.

"Pentecostalism." Encyclopædia Britannica. 2004. Encyclopædia Britannica Premium Service.

28 Jan. 2004 <http://www.britannica.com/eb/article?eu=60609>.

[M.SIGGA]

This isn't concerning the Charisms of the Holy Spirt, but the actual Pentecostal churches.

[FX2]

i heard some kid talking about this at my school, how they walked into church and saw people talking in tounges and they grabbed him and shook him and he was weirded out by this. It weirds me out a little. I do believe in talking in tounges, but not on a regular basis like these people do. I get filled with the holy spirit many times, but never once have i talked in tounges or have seen anybody talk in tounges, even though i do believe it happens. I just dont think you can "summon" it on a regular basis like they do.

[willguy]

::shivers:: Oh, I can't stand health-and-wealth Gospels. Like on TV once, I saw these televangelists, and they had this program and one said, "Jesus came so that we could be free from debt." And she wasn't talking about sin. She was talking about MONETARY DEBT! I was almost sick and had to change the channel (back to good ol' EWTN). I'm not trying to say that all Pentacostals are like this or that they are the only ones who do this, but it absolutely sickens me.

[ironmonk]

This isn't concerning the Charisms of the Holy Spirt, but the actual Pentecostal churches.

The point is that the pentacostal churches started in the early 1900's.

It looks nothing like the Church of the bible.

Your Servant,

ironmonk

[M.SIGGA]

The point is that the pentacostal churches started in the early 1900's.

It looks nothing like the Church of the bible.

Your Servant,

ironmonk

I gotcha monk, I was just clarifying what I should have posted the first time.

will a protestant please be so kind to comment? how do protestants feel about these churches?

[M.SIGGA]

::shivers::  Oh, I can't stand health-and-wealth Gospels.  Like on TV once, I saw these televangelists, and they had this program and one said, "Jesus came so that we could be free from debt."  And she wasn't talking about sin.  She was talking about MONETARY DEBT!  I was almost sick and had to change the channel (back to good ol' EWTN).  I'm not trying to say that all Pentacostals are like this or that they are the only ones who do this, but it absolutely sickens me.

Pastor Jesse Duplantis was on TBN and he gave a sermon on why it was his blessing to be wealthy and why he needed a helecopter all because when he used to be broke and a nominal Catholic he sacrificed all he had to a needy pentecostal pastor. All his fortune was the guaranteed "comeback." It is my Christian understanding that charity is done totally for Christ, a sacrifice, not in expectation of a comeback. I mean that's why we don't tithe and make donations to charity simply for tax deductions.

[Ellenita]

how do protestants feel about these churches?

Well I don't know if I still qualify 'as a protestant' but in my experience of pentecostal churches and the charismatic house church movement, there were lots of very good, genuine people involved in them. The problem is the teaching which says that if you don't get the promises made to you by the leaders of the church aka the promises of God (!), such as material wealth, perfect health etc, then the problem isn't with the church teaching but with your faith; you don't believe enough. It causes enormous emotional stress and pain to those people who don't see the promises that are being made immediately taking effect in their lives; what am I doing wrong; why isn't my faith strong enough? It's very much a feelings orientated 'denomination'.

It's also concerning that personal responsibilty for sin is often sidelined with the emphasis on the power of demons.

Edited January 29, 2004 by Ellenita

[jasJis]

I know a number of Christian Pentecostals. They have a more mature understanding of Christianity than the artilcle would indicate.

Pentecostals are authentic Christians who see the charism's of the Holy Spirit as being ALL the grace, and are missing the riches of grace shared in many other Christian teachings.

The article just seems to be denomination bashing. Stereotypical and lacking of understanding. Christian denominations should not be evaluated just by it's errors or ommissions, but one must understand it and be able to discuss how much (or how little) fullness it teaches in comparison to the fullness of Christian dogma.

[M.SIGGA]

I know a number of Christian Pentecostals.  They have a more mature understanding of Christianity than the artilcle would indicate.

Pentecostals are authentic Christians who see the charism's of the Holy Spirit as being ALL the grace, and are missing the riches of grace shared in many other Christian teachings.

The article just seems to be denomination bashing.  Stereotypical and lacking of understanding.  Christian denominations should not be evaluated just by it's errors or ommissions, but one must understand it and be able to discuss how much (or how little) fullness it teaches in comparison to the fullness of Christian dogma.

I'm sure they are nice Christian people; I had a good friend in high school who was Mormon who loved Jesus and everyone else, but that still doesn't excuse his theology. Anything started with cultic origins can't be too spiritually healthy.

[jasJis]

I'm sure they are nice Christian people; I had a good friend in high school who was Mormon who loved Jesus and everyone else, but that still doesn't excuse his theology. Anything started with cultic origins can't be too spiritually healthy.

Dude, make up your mind. Can they be nice Christian people, or are they completely spiritually corrupt because of the "cultic origins"?

You missed my point anyway. Don't be too quick to throw out the baby with the bathwater. A lot of their theology is Christian and sound. The error is added, and ignorance of additional Christian theology is explained by cultic influence.

BTW, aren't Mormons considered as non-Christians by the Church?

[M.SIGGA]

Dude, make up your mind.  Can they be nice Christian people, or are they completely spiritually corrupt because of the "cultic origins"?

You missed my point anyway.  Don't be too quick to throw out the baby with the bathwater.  A lot of their theology is Christian and sound.  The error is added, and ignorance of additional Christian theology is explained by cultic influence.

BTW, aren't Mormons considered as non-Christians by the Church?

No, I think I got what you were saying, but I didn't agree with it and I just didn't interject my opinion right away so people could respond and I don't think they are 'completely' spiritually corrupt like a devil worshiper or something like that.

I think they can be nice people just like anyone else, but my personal opinion is that they are borderline sect/cult Christians, and yes they can be nice Christians in this category. I agree with what you said involving the mainline Protestant denominations,Baptists, and some AOG, but I think the Pentecostal denomination seems to be in a category in all of it's own.

Since many Pentecostals are not trinitarians and along with all these other accusations they parallel with LDS and Jehovah'sWitness brands of Christianity.

My cousin married a Pentecostal and he is a rebaptised minister who converted and they are nice people who will say the prayer when we all gather at Thanksgiving, but that doesn't change the fact they have invalid baptisms and a wierd spirituality that can be spiritually dangerous.

Mormons are considered to be a cult/sect, but isn't anyone with an invalid baptism technically not a Christian either? I know that's a justification some Protestants use to rebaptize Catholics, Lutherans, Anglicans, and Methodists who were never immersed in water.

[Laudate_Dominum]

BTW, aren't Mormons considered as non-Christians by the Church?

I've never read an official Church statement but I know they are excluded from ecumenical dialogue which suggests they aren't considered Christian.

A few points automatically come to mind:

1. They have a different "Bible" (hence a different Gospel, a different Christ).

2. They don't believe in the Trinity (3 Persons/1 Divine Nature/Perfect Unity of Substance).

3. They don't believe in the true Divinity of Christ (they have more of a pagan concept and think that Christ was once just a guy).

4. They don't have a valid baptism (this is essential for being incorporated into Christ's body and being a Christian).

5. They don't believe in heaven and hell. (they have the celestial, telestial, and terestrial kingdoms which I guess is in their book or mormon)

6. They think God lives on a planet in outer space.

For these, and many other reasons, I think it is a stretch to call them Christians. If I thought Jesus was a guy on another planet with special powers and that if I kept my sacred underwear clean like a good mormon I would get my own planet too, I don't think I would expect protestants and Catholics to consider me one of them. But that is exactly the PR move of mormons these days. They want to be accepted as regular Christians. I guess they revise their teachings all the time, maybe they will adopt more orthodox docrines? I doubt it though since they would have to dump their book.