The Primacy Of Peter

[desertwoman]

Word. The only thing you have to say is that Papist is an offensive term, and Reza would have apologized. attacking him as such is not productive at all. He is Coptic Orthodox, and he doesn't hate Catholics, hence he wouldn't be here.

[thessalonian]

[quote name='RezaLemmyng' post='1211055' date='Mar 9 2007, 08:22 PM']Again... its no surprise that non-catholics don't want to post here...[/quote]


My point stands. I've been on many protestant boards and virtually every one been called a pagan, not Christian, minnow muncher, idiot, liar, arrogant, moron, or some like term. Told my eucharist is a death cookie, that I am not Christian, etc. etc. I've primarily only left boards because I got banned for teaching Catholic theology (primarily from the Bible). And I see many Catholics who stick it out on these boards despite the nastiness and down right blasphemy of our faith. Why should how people speak to you drive you away from posting on that board if you are sure that you have the truth and you want to present it too them. Peter and Paul got the hell beat out of them and they wanted to go back out and preach the next day. So your complaint really holds little weight with me. If people persecute you you accept the persecution for Christ. Blessed are you when they persecute you. That non-catholics leave tells me one of two things, or maybe both. That they don't believe they are blessed when persecuted on this board and they are not that sure they have the truth. .

Edited March 10, 2007 by thessalonian

[thessalonian]

[quote name='desertwoman' post='1211061' date='Mar 9 2007, 08:39 PM']Word. The only thing you have to say is that Papist is an offensive term, and Reza would have apologized. attacking him as such is not productive at all. He is Coptic Orthodox, and he doesn't hate Catholics, hence he wouldn't be here.[/quote]

Are you talking to me?
I attacked him? Wow are you people thin skinned. Even if I did he should consider himself blessed according to Matt 6. Oh well.

Edited March 10, 2007 by thessalonian

[desertwoman]

It's alright. I didn't mean to get you upset fam. I understand it hurts the nothing out of you for someone to call you everything except a child of God. I've been there, and because I'm studying more and more into the Catholic faith, I'm getting it even more. It's hard as nails to do, but we all must act in tact for others are reading and watching us. They will follow and read closely to what we say, and the truth and will shine even more by the love that we show even to those who cast stones at us.

[jeffpugh]

I'm sorry, but who is attacking whom? I see just friendly dialogue here. Yes papist is derogatory. Stick around. We don't mind you being here and we really don't mean to harm.

[RezaMikhaeil]

[quote name='Sacred Music Man' post='1211108' date='Mar 9 2007, 08:23 PM']Yes papist is derogatory.[/quote] and "Schismatic Orthodox" isn't?

[N/A Gone]

Rez is right. Schismatic Greek Orthodox is wrong in the present eccesiological theology

[Mr.Cat]

[b]Eastern Orthodoxy[/b]: [url="http://www.catholic.com/library/Eastern_Orthodoxy.asp"]http://www.catholic.com/library/Eastern_Orthodoxy.asp[/url]

Good article...

[bmb144]

[quote name='KnightofChrist' post='1210961' date='Mar 10 2007, 07:51 AM']I find it amazing when ever Holy Scripture is used to prove Catholic teaching, there is nothing but silence from non-catholics... or anti-catholics whatever the case may be.
Bump[/quote]


Interesting, very interesting.

Ok, I'm going to throw out a challenge here. Those who read transmud know that I am in rebellion against the church, and this is one of my points of rebellion.

So would a couple of you like to put points here both in scriptural *and* historical context as to the primacy of Rome and why I should believe it.

I challenge you to prove it beyond doubt!

I'll be back in a few days to read what you say....
Belinda

[Anomaly]

Typical of you self-appointed 'pundints' of PhatMass. This is why non-Catholics don't post here.

How long did it take for this post to descend into a pointless argument of personal attacks?

A 'Catholic' took offense immediately. Then a 'Catholic' with the tact of an anvil complained about non-Catholics being overly sensitive.

Where is the willingness to engage on reasonable terms. I know I'm often sarcastic and I love biting humor. Mostly it's intentional, but not always. I was willing to engage in discussion, but that offer was soundly rebuked. Other non-Catholics offered to discuss, but were spurned as well and things degenerated into pettiness.

The only non-Catholics that can stand to be around here are the Budge's, LittleLes's etc. The common attitude of 'Catholics' here is that they're right so everyone else is all wrong. Read Dominus Iesus and try again with a different attitude.

You Catholics endow your Pope with the Charism of Infallibilty and Athority over all. That is beyond 'primacy'. The Pope may be a leader among the Bishops, but there is no support that the Pope can act independently and maintain the controls of the Divinity of the Church. In practical application, the only way the leaders of the Church can even attempt to act infallibly in defining or discerning questions of Fatih, is as a complete and corporate body of it's Apostolic leaders. Attempts to do otherwise, abaondons the controls of Tradition and you have fallible men behaving fallibly. The Pope is a Bishop and can only apply Doctrine as previously defined. A Man who attains the position of Pope while having concubines and illegitemate children is no more able to independently act infallibly on matters of Faith than I. They are probably even less able to act infallibly on matters of Moral than Budge. (I can't resist pointed humor. I'm a weak man.)

[Mr.Cat]

[b]Anomaly, you should read the first post here. In His Light, likewise... I know it is a lot of reading but if you look through and read it, I think you will be very surprised at the results.[/b]

But as a Catholic while I can propose source after sore even reason after reason for belief this is only “human faith.” The placing of trust in human understanding which for a time I suppose is sufficient as we find ourselves and human faith does reaffirm a greater faith, this greater faith is called “Divine Faith.” Divine Faith is we believe all that we do without any other reason that Almighty God has revealed it to us through His Church, the Catholic Church. Thus in Divine Faith, a superior form of faith, it is a simple and childlike belief following the “ground and pillar of the truth.”[quote][b]Creed of Pope Pius IV[/b]
"I acknowledge the Holy Catholic Apostolic Roman Church as the mother and teacher of all churches; and I promise true obedience to the Bishop of Rome, successor to St. Peter, Prince of the Apostles, and Vicar of Jesus Christ."
[url="http://www.preces-latinae.org/thesaurus/Symbola/Tridentinae.html"]http://www.preces-latinae.org/thesaurus/Sy...ridentinae.html[/url][/quote]

[Socrates]

[quote name='In His Light' post='1211207' date='Mar 10 2007, 06:06 AM']Interesting, very interesting.

Ok, I'm going to throw out a challenge here. Those who read transmud know that I am in rebellion against the church, and this is one of my points of rebellion.

So would a couple of you like to put points here both in scriptural *and* historical context as to the primacy of Rome and why I should believe it.

I challenge you to prove it beyond doubt!

I'll be back in a few days to read what you say....
Belinda[/quote]
Here's a [url="http://www.catholic.com/library/church_papacy.asp"]list of articles from Catholic Answers regarding this topic[/url].

This is also a good article concerning papal primacy in response to Eastern Orthodox objections: [url="http://www.catholic.com/thisrock/1996/9610eaw.asp"]PETER AND THE ORTHODOX: A REPRISE [/url]

Edited March 11, 2007 by Socrates

[thessalonian]

In his light,

For those who are open to truth the evidence is sufficient. For those who are not no evidence is enough.

I would be glad to post a whole book of information. But I suspect from the tone of your post the last half might apply to you. Show me otherwise. If you are truly interested and open I suggest to you "Jesus Peter and the Keys By Butler Dahlgren and Hess or Upon This Rock by Steve Ray. Either of those books provide overwhelming support for the primacy of rome for anyone to be convinced if they are open. Do you really want the truth?

blessings

Edited March 11, 2007 by thessalonian

[RezaMikhaeil]

[quote]For those who are open to truth the evidence is sufficient. For those who are not no evidence is enough.[/quote] Don't you think that's a pretty closed minded and "I know it all" attitude? Maybe you're wrong but just dont know it? Nobody is perfect you know?

Even as an Orthodox, I dont confront those that dont agree with Orthodoxy with that attitude but allow a friendly dialog to take place. You'd be surprised, there's alot of people that dont believe in your faith that could teach you about your faith in ways that you're not aware of at this moment.

Reza

[jeffpugh]

I think I get what you mean Reza. I learn from my protestant friend all the time. He actually gives me confidence to dialogue with him now. It is a long process which takes co-operation on both sides.