God Is The Rock, Not Peter.

[kujo]

"And I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hades shall not overpower it." Matthew 16:18

End of discussion.

Edited March 4, 2007 by kujo

[ReinnieR]

[quote name='Budge' post='1207343' date='Mar 3 2007, 04:29 PM']GOD is the ROCK, NOT PETER... Why do Catholic ignore these verses?

All these verses proved to me that Jesus--God is the Rock and not Peter and Jesus was talking about himself.

Deu 32:31[b] For their rock [is] not as our Rock,[/b] even our enemies themselves [being] judges.

1Sa 2:2 [There is] none holy as the LORD: for [there is] none beside thee: [b]neither [is there] any rock like our God.[/b]

2Sa 22:2 And he said, The LORD [is] my rock, and my fortress, and my deliverer;

2Sa 22:3 [b]The God of my rock; in him will I trust: [/b][he is] my shield, and the horn of my salvation, my high tower, and my refuge, my saviour; thou savest me from violence.

(these arent the only verses there are many many many more)

Rom 9:33 As it is written, Behold, I lay in Sion a stumblingstone and [b]rock of offence[/b]: and whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

How can Peter be the ROCK....considering this verse?

1Cr 10:4 And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that[b] Rock was Christ.[/b][/quote]

When did was the church established? was there a leader in the 1st church after the death of Christ?

[Azriel]

I find it fascinating that there have been no rebuttals to the Catholics. Hmmm.

[got2luvjc]

I wonder why protestants are so on top of trying to tell Catholics that they're so wrong, but they don't try to talk to the people who don't even know Christ, or the people who maybe knew Him but fell away... those are the people I'd like to talk to

Jesus left the 99 to get the 1 lost, I think we should follow by his example and find that lost sheep who has strayed away from knowing Christ

also, when spouting out verses from the Bible, especially in the Old Testament, you have to look @ the historical context.... those verses you quoted (1 Samuel 2:2) had historical context, to understand the verse better, we should read the entire chapter and know the situation in which Hannah said those words

Edited March 4, 2007 by got2luvjc

[Socrates]

Well, well, well.
Look who's back (after claiming she was done with this site).

If you're going to return after all these months, one would think you'd at least come up with something new, rather than repeating the same carp that has already long ago been refuted.

Why do anti-Catholics constantly ignore these verses?

[quote]And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven.[/quote](Matthew 16:18-19)

Christ is clearly addressing Peter, giving him the new name Peter (Rock), and giving him the Keys of the Kingdom, and the power to bind and loose.

Why can't you simply accept the plain words of Christ in the Holy Bible?

[jeffpugh]

Indeed. These words are coming from the one who said let you yes be yes and your no be no.

[NewReformation]

[quote name='thessalonian' post='1207702' date='Mar 4 2007, 09:57 AM']Tell me something budge.

Who is the foundation of the Church? Christ or Prophets and Apostles? (Hint: both/and 1 Cor 3:11, Eph 2:20)
Who is the "light of the world"? Christ, or Christians? (Hint: both/and, see John's gospel)

John 8

12: Again Jesus spoke to them, saying, "I am the light of the world; he who follows me will not walk in darkness, but will have the light of life."

Matt 5
14: "You are the light of the world. A city set on a hill cannot be hid.
Do these passages contradict budge?

Who is the ROCK from which the Jews were hewn in Isiaha 51

1: "Hearken to me, you who pursue deliverance, you who seek the LORD; [b]look to the rock from which you were hewn[/b], and to the quarry from which you were digged.
2: [b]Look to Abraham your father and to Sarah who bore you[/b]; for when he was but one I called him, and I blessed him and made him many.

What? Abraham can be called rock but Peter can't be. Rocks are infinite God or something such that a man cannot be called a rock. Seems like your making rocks in to graven images of God budge. To understand the bible you reconcile things. Not deny things in order to suit preconcieved notions. All your proving budge is that your pitting the Bible against itself and ignoring plain English constructs, so that you can have your own personal doctrines. Sad, very sad. Now go to the bathroom and wash that egg off your face. I know you can't see it but it is there. [/quote]

The Apostles form the foundation, but who is the chief Cornerstone? Without that cornerstone, there is no foundation. That one single stone or rock is what is needed.

[thessalonian]

From the Catechism:

756 "Often, too, the Church is called the building of God. The Lord compared himself to the stone which the builders rejected, but which[b] was made into the corner-stone. On this foundation the Church is built by the apostles and from [/b]it the Church receives solidity and unity.


So it seems we agree Christ is the cornerstone, so you point is? How does this prevent Peter from being the rock?

[Seven77]

God IS the ROCK.

Jesus empowers Peter with a share in His "rockness"... Peter is the Rock IN Christ Jesus who strengthens him.

[Mr.Cat]

Confusion between the Rock that the Church is founded and the Cornerstone I suppose could be described between the foundation and the first block that is laid into place, but rather I think that calling our Blessed Lord the chief cornerstone is referring to the fact that He is the true founder of the Church.