BullnaChinaShop Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 My main point on the Moral or Not thread was slightly off subject so since it was mostly ignored there I thought I would ask the question here. To me there is a logical disconnect between an 18 year old being old enough to vote and die for his country but not to have an alcoholic beverage. If they are old enough to help guide the path of our country and to put their life on the line for it then doesn’t it make sense for them to be able to buy a drink. As it currently stands the government is inconsistent in its treatment of legal adulthood. I believe the age for drinking, voting and the draft should all coincide with each other. With all adult rights and responsibilities the parents should set a good example for their children from a young age and teach their kids how to handle them. Alcohol is no different. If at 18 one is not old enough for all adult rights and responsibilities then when are they? At what point do the parents take their hands off and let the kids become fully adults? Please don’t bring up the morality of underage drinking as it has been beaten to death on the other thread. I just want to know what you all think about what I perceive as an inconsistency in the law and what to do about it if anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReformationNow Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 My main point on the Moral or Not thread was slightly off subject so since it was mostly ignored there I thought I would ask the question here. To me there is a logical disconnect between an 18 year old being old enough to vote and die for his country but not to have an alcoholic beverage. If they are old enough to help guide the path of our country and to put their life on the line for it then doesn’t it make sense for them to be able to buy a drink. As it currently stands the government is inconsistent in its treatment of legal adulthood. I believe the age for drinking, voting and the draft should all coincide with each other. With all adult rights and responsibilities the parents should set a good example for their children from a young age and teach their kids how to handle them. Alcohol is no different. If at 18 one is not old enough for all adult rights and responsibilities then when are they? At what point do the parents take their hands off and let the kids become fully adults? Please don’t bring up the morality of underage drinking as it has been beaten to death on the other thread. I just want to know what you all think about what I perceive as an inconsistency in the law and what to do about it if anything. Somebody can correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the voting age used to be 21 before some politician figured he could get more votes if the voting age was lowered. Anyways, Yes, I see it as an inconsistency. Does this give me the right to break that law? No. In my state, you have to be 21 to drink, regardless of if an older person is with you or not. I chose to obey the law. WWJD? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BullnaChinaShop Posted July 30, 2003 Author Share Posted July 30, 2003 Thanks for not getting into the morality of underage drinking. I'm glad you read my whole post. I'm making no stand about breaking or following the law on this thread. I just want to know peoples opinions on what I peceive as a logical disconnect and what if anything they believe should be done about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReformationNow Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 If they're gonna do anything about it, I'd say raise the voting age. But that's just me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasJis Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 Bull, I did address in in the other thread, about page 3 or 4 I think. The social order that creates the laws, defines the cirmstances, and effects it's decisions. Society feels the harm caused to society as a whole by persons under 21 drinking alcohol is greater than the harm caused by allowing an exceedingly small percentage of the same population enlist in the army. Also consider that these persons would be under command and control of older and more mature persons in most (not all) cases. Society has also determined that having 18 year olds vote as part of millions of other voters, far outweighs any problems that may result from immature decisions. I always thought voting age was 18, at least in my experience. A point to consider. Should the age requirement to become President of the US be rescinded. Though an 18 year old can vote for President, they can't be President. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marielapin Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 Society feels the harm caused to society as a whole by persons under 21 drinking alcohol is greater than the harm caused by allowing an exceedingly small percentage of the same population enlist in the army. Also consider that these persons would be under command and control of older and more mature persons in most (not all) cases. The point is that at 18 a male may be DRAFTED, not that they may enlist. If they may be drafted, why does the goverment say they are adult enough to die for the country but not adult enough to have a beer for relaxation....they allow 18 year olds to smoke cigarettes! Why is this the only age restriction for normal rights to individuals (becoming president is not available to all people - if you are not a natural born citizen you may not become president no matter what). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ReformationNow Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 The point is that at 18 a male may be DRAFTED, not that they may enlist. If they may be drafted, why does the goverment say they are adult enough to die for the country but not adult enough to have a beer for relaxation....they allow 18 year olds to smoke cigarettes! Why is this the only age restriction for normal rights to individuals (becoming president is not available to all people - if you are not a natural born citizen you may not become president no matter what). Yes, they can enlist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marielapin Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 Yes, they can enlist. I KNOW they can enlist. Enlistment is a choice, being drafted is NOT A CHOICE. That is my point. The government says that at 18 you may be FORCED into the military, yet you may not choose to partake in a beer. Yes, you may choose to join the military, but that is neither here nor there. Again - that is a choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BullnaChinaShop Posted July 30, 2003 Author Share Posted July 30, 2003 If someone is too immature to be trusted with an alcoholic beverage then why are they not to immature to be voting, in the military, owning firearms, smoking and a whole host of other other rights and responsibilities that adults have? Why are 18 year old too immature to drink but not to doo all these other things? Why is alcohol so much harder for young adults to get a grip on that it is worth giving them every other right but that one? Either they have been taught to use these rights and responsibilities or they haven't. Society feels the harm caused to society as a whole by persons under 21 drinking alcohol is greater than the harm caused by allowing an exceedingly small percentage of the same population enlist in the army. Also consider that these persons would be under command and control of older and more mature persons in most (not all) cases. I'm not talking about allowing to enlist I'm talking about being registered for the draft. If the country ever needed the draft again young men at the age of 18 could be called to fight and die for their country and yet they still wouldn't even be able to buy an alcoholic beverage. They can also vote on the future path of the country with the same effect on the outcome as anyone else that votes. And yet they are still too immature to have a drink. This is totally illogical. To put the future of the country on their shoulders in two instances and yet say they are too immature in the third. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mustbenothing Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 All members of the US military are allowed to drink, whether or not they are 21. One main reason the age is 21 instead of 18 is because an 18 age would create mass confusion in high schools. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mp15 Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 I believe the age for drinking, voting and the draft should all coincide with each other. With all adult rights and responsibilities the parents should set a good example for their children from a young age and teach their kids how to handle them. Alcohol is no different. If at 18 one is not old enough for all adult rights and responsibilities then when are they? At what point do the parents take their hands off and let the kids become fully adults? Bull, I believe that the ages should coincide as well. I don't like the fact that an 18 year old can vote. Most of them are too influenced by their teachers in school to form logical choices. How do you think most 18 year old's vote when something like 95% of all public school teachers are Democrats. I grew up in a staunch Republican household. Yet all it took was one teacher my senior year turning me into a left wing wacko, to the disbelief of my parents (I can still hardly believe that I wanted Mondale/Ferraro to win at that time). But with age came logic and reasoning, which is now why I am a Conservative yet again. Young people are too easily influenced. They haven't spent enough time in the real world, struggling with life choices. So no, 18 is too young to vote. As is drinking alcohol, Serving in the military, and driving a car!! Well that's what I think anyway. As for when parents take their hands off and let kids become adults? As a parent I don't think I could ever take my hands fully off the parenting responsibility. Why would a parent want to? It is a parent’s job to teach their children, and I don't think there is a time requirement to finish the teaching process. It is continual for we are never too old to learn. I'm still learning stuff and being taught stuff from my parents. It doesn't mean that I always listen, or that they will prevent me from doing it. But they are there to ask me if I learned anything and if they could offer any additional insight. Peace, Marcus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilroy the Ninja Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 I must really be blessed that my government teacher was Republican, because otherwise I might have been unduly influenced by a liberal Democrat.... Oh, wait. Nope, I've always been Republican. Even in high school. I can't believe you voted for Modale either mp. You think you know someone.... ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mp15 Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 I must really be blessed that my government teacher was Republican, because otherwise I might have been unduly influenced by a liberal Democrat.... Oh, wait. Nope, I've always been Republican. Even in high school. I can't believe you voted for Modale either mp. You think you know someone.... Hangs his head in disgust.................. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marielapin Posted July 30, 2003 Share Posted July 30, 2003 All members of the US military are allowed to drink, whether or not they are 21. One main reason the age is 21 instead of 18 is because an 18 age would create mass confusion in high schools. This is not true. My husband and I work for the military, and even in the fighter bars on base if one is below 21 they are NOT ALLOWED TO DRINK even if everyone else is. Period. Dot. Highly enforced!!! People get in major trouble for underage drinking in the military! Or for even allowing someone they know is underage to drink! Now, whether or not bar owners honor the law is something completely different. Some DO give underage military members drinks because they are willing to sacrifice themselves for the rest of us. But that still does not mean that that reflects military policy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmotherofpirl Posted July 31, 2003 Share Posted July 31, 2003 OK since I am older than dirt , a small history lesson. EVerything in life used to start at 21. You were under the control of your parents until you were 21. You couldn't drink vote etc. THen came the Vietman war. Kids were being drafted and dying at 18 for their country, but were not old enough to vote to change the law or have a beer. Great protest marches etc. (I was an anti-war protester way back then). Limits dropped to 18 to be consistant. War ended. 18 year olds could sign contracts, parents lost their rights, kids could vote drink etc. Highway deaths started to increase from younger drunk drivers. Federal goverment said we will cut offf your highway funding unless you raise the drinking age. States, being money-hungry raised their drinking age in most cases. Seat belt laws came in the same way. All legislators are expected to bring home the bacon when it comes to federal monies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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