Eat His Flesh, Drink His Blood. Have Life Within You!

[scardella]

[quote name='LouisvilleFan' post='1175874' date='Jan 25 2007, 12:56 PM']
That's the same verse I've heard many times used as the proof-text for the symbolic understand of Communion. But isn't Jesus is saying that his words are spirit and life, not the way his words should be understood? If the flesh is of no avail, what good is the Incarnation?
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My general argument against this sort of proof-texting would be referring to Paul's understanding of the flesh vs spirit, but I think in this one it's much better. (of course, I haven't had too much experience w/ ecumenism...)

[LouisvilleFan]

[quote name='thessalonian' post='1175929' date='Jan 25 2007, 02:54 PM']
Do you have a purpose here. This is a board about discussing apologetics. I am looking for input to a question I have about protestant thought. The Holy Spirit will decide if we have done enough and I hardly think with all the denominations out there and the people who come to our Holy Mother Church that he has said, stop trying to convince them. When he does I'll let you know. You seem rather indifferrentist in the whole protestant/catholic discussion.
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I guess I'm just not understanding your question. You can find the Catholic and Reformed/Baptist sides of this debate at a gazillion different web sites, so I figure you're looking for something more original here. In response to this part of your earlier post...

[quote]My point in all of this is that it seems like they have a contradiction in their requirements for salvation. They preach a bit to someone, get them to repent and declare them saved for evermore. But it seems that the scriptures and reading them or at least hearing them is a part of salvation if we hold their feet to the fire "unless you eat the flesh of the son of man (scripture) and drink his blood, you shall not have life within you."[/quote]

... I'd first point out that Baptist/Reformed Christians would put faith in Christ and spiritual communion with Him as the primary means of eating Christ's flesh. Bible study, daily devotional, accountability, worshipping at church, hearing a sermon, etc. are all ways of increasing one's faith.

Secondly, maybe you were being tongue-in-cheek, but the "preach a bit to someone, get them to repent and declare them saved for evermore" isn't the attitude held by most Protestants, or even Baptists. The whole once-saved-always-saved issue is a huge debate even among Calvinists.

This is a bit OT, but one thing that I'm surprised many Protestant converts to Catholicism don't understand is how Protestants view Christian unity. To them, it's not about being one, physically unified group with a single authoritive body. I don't know how many times I've read that silly "30,000+ denominations" stat from people like Scott Hahn and other converts. That doesn't get anywhere with most Protestants because they don't believe the Church should be unified like the Catholic Church is. To them, faith in Christ is the source of our unity and everything else (save some of the essentials, like the Trinity) is disputable.

I've said this before somewhere, but apologetics only goes so far. It is absolutely necessary, but basing your witness to Protestants on apologetics alone is like basing your Christian faith on Scripture Alone: there's still something missing. Protestants care more about the condition of our hearts and most don't expect to meet Catholics who are passionate about loving Christ, the Bible, and living righteously. When they see that side of you, it'll bear witness to the Truth of the Catholic faith.

Not that all your Protestant friends will be jumpin' into the Tiber to swim across right away, but you will plant seeds.

To bring all that back around to the John 6 passage, I don't think the biggest difficulty is so much explaining Catholic apologetics to them, but rather it's them getting over the deeply ingrained Protestant mindset. That takes time and it's why works are so important because they confirm what we preach. I know for me, it was one thing to understand praying to Mary was not worship, but it was quite another entirely to believe it and actually pray a Hail Mary. There is definitely a line of resistence there, but it's nothing that the love of Christ can't get through.

[thessalonian]

I know the variations in protestantism concerning how one knows they are saved and when this happens. I know I broad brush a bit here. I have argued the usual route many times. I am simply looking at it from a different angle her. It shoud be noted that if "eat his flesh and drink his blood" merely means a verbal assent at an altar call this seems rather problematic. We must consume and be filled with Christ the passage says to me.

[scardella]

[quote name='thessalonian' post='1179239' date='Jan 29 2007, 09:15 AM']
I know the variations in protestantism concerning how one knows they are saved and when this happens. I know I broad brush a bit here. I have argued the usual route many times. I am simply looking at it from a different angle her. It shoud be noted that if "eat his flesh and drink his blood" merely means a verbal assent at an altar call this seems rather problematic. We must consume and be filled with Christ the passage says to me.
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Funny thing is that as I'm trying to think of a way that Prots might argue, it seems contradictory...
I was going to say something about eating and drinking Jesus' Body and Blood (however they may interpret it) as being evidence of salvation already present.