Abortionist The New Age Nazi's

[KnightofChrist]

[quote name='Kosh' post='1135270' date='Dec 4 2006, 11:47 PM']
JClives, is murder in general ok? It infringes ALL THE TIME on the killers freedom. Can I walk up to a random person and shoot him? How 'bout my dad? or little brother? you gonna infringe on my freedom? Could a mom kill her 2 year old kid?
[/quote]


"The most merciful thing that a family does to one of its infant members is to kill it."
Margaret Sanger, Founder of Planned Parenthood

[Kosh]

Why does that matter? B/c it can't life for itself? A day year old baby is just as dependant on the mom inside or outside the womb. What magical property about the baby changed the second its outside the womb that no longer allows you to be able to kill it?

[Aloysius]

nothing's so hard to understand... I hear you completely: you've justified murder. murder is defined as the killing of an innocent human person you have not challenged any of these in application to abortion: you admit it is killing, you admit it is a human person, and I assume you agree it is innocent of any offence that would merit its death.

and hence, your posiiton is the same as a Nazi sympathizer position during the holocaust. challenge me by showing how it is different. a nazi sypathizer would admit the nazi government's right to kill these large numbers of its citizens for the sake of its future prosperity. you admit the woman's right to kill a human person inside of her.

if you want to hold this position, fine. but it is the same position the nazi's held, and you now have no justification for opposing what the nazis did. if you say they ought to be given the choice not to go to concentration camps and be killed; you must admit that the human persons must be given the choice whether or not to be killed.

the government illegalizes murder in any form it recognizes. your position on what abortion is makes it murder according to any legal definition (well, except the type of legal definition which begs the question 'murder is the unlawful taking of human life'... that's a definition to be left to courtrooms where lawyers are instructing jury's only to follow the law as it is actually currently written)

[KnightofChrist]

[quote name='JClives' post='1135273' date='Dec 4 2006, 11:49 PM']
Of course not. But in none of those examples is the victim attached to the mother's uterous wall.
[/quote]


Of course not. But in none of those examples is the victim attached to the Jewish faith, or the skin of a black person.

[pcabibi]

[quote name='Aloysius' post='1135279' date='Dec 4 2006, 11:53 PM']
nothing's so hard to understand... I hear you completely: you've justified murder. murder is defined as the killing of an innocent human person you have not challenged any of these in application to abortion: you admit it is killing, you admit it is a human person, and I assume you agree it is innocent of any offence that would merit its death.

and hence, your posiiton is the same as a Nazi sympathizer position during the holocaust. challenge me by showing how it is different. a nazi sypathizer would admit the nazi government's right to kill these large numbers of its citizens for the sake of its future prosperity. you admit the woman's right to kill a human person inside of her.

if you want to hold this position, fine. but it is the same position the nazi's held, and you now have no justification for opposing what the nazis did. if you say they ought to be given the choice not to go to concentration camps and be killed; you must admit that the human persons must be given the choice whether or not to be killed.

the government illegalizes murder in any form it recognizes. your position on what abortion is makes it murder according to any legal definition (well, except the type of legal definition which begs the question 'murder is the unlawful taking of human life'... that's a definition to be left to courtrooms where lawyers are instructing jury's only to follow the law as it is actually currently written)
[/quote]

wow @ you comparing me to a Nazi. The nazi's position was COMPLETLEY different. I'm not sanctioning a GOVERNMENT'S right to kill people... I'm sanctioning the WOMAN'S right to choose the future of her life as an individual and what happens with her body. The fact that you are comparing a woman's right to choose what happens with her body, to a coordinated mass extermination rooted in bigotry is nothing short of deplorable and obscene.


[quote name='KnightofChrist' post='1135280' date='Dec 4 2006, 11:53 PM']
Of course not. But in none of those examples is the victim attached to the Jewish faith, or the skin of a black person.
[/quote]

again, comparing a woman's right to choose what happens with her future, her body, and her family... to the coordinated effort of mass genocide is disgusting.

[KnightofChrist]

[quote name='JClives' post='1135290' date='Dec 5 2006, 12:11 AM']
again, comparing a woman's right to choose what happens with her future, her body, and her family... to the coordinated effort of mass genocide is disgusting.
[/quote]

again, comparing a Nazi's or Slave owners right to choose what happens with their future, their Jews/Slaves, and their family... to the coordinated effort of mass genocide is disgusting.

Edited December 5, 2006 by KnightofChrist

[pcabibi]

I am amazed How people can overlook that major and obvious difference and still go through with correlating the two. It's utter slander

[quote name='KnightofChrist' post='1135299' date='Dec 5 2006, 12:18 AM']
again, comparing a Nazi's or Slave owners right to choose what happens with their future, their Jews/Slaves, and their family... to the coordinated effort of mass genocide is disgusting.
[/quote]

ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!?!? Are you SERIOUSLY now coorelating a pregnant woman to a slave owner!?!?!

This enitire thread is becoming ABSURD!!

All the women watch out! If you become pregnant you are a slave owner and a Nazi until that kid comes out of you the right way!

[Aloysius]

you admit that the fetus is a human person, and therefore that abortion is the killing of a human person; and of course there is a widespread use of abortion because it is legal. the only difference is that you support the right of a woman to choose for the sake of her future rather than the right of a government to choose for the sake of its future.

mass genocide is mass murder. legalized abortion is legalized mass murder, unless you don't think the fetus is a person-- in that case it wouldn't be mass murder. but because you admit it as a person, then that person must be protected from anyone's choice to kill it. no individual is given the right to choose death for another person for any reason.

I'm sorry, but the holocaust was not even as bad as the mass murder abortion is perpetrating.

[track2004]

[quote name='Kosh' post='1135277' date='Dec 4 2006, 11:51 PM']
Why does that matter? B/c it can't life for itself? A day year old baby is just as dependant on the mom inside or outside the womb. What magical property about the baby changed the second its outside the womb that no longer allows you to be able to kill it?
[/quote]

No see the baby after it is born is dependant on SOMEONE, not necessarily the mother, to take care of it.

I agree with JClives. This thread it getting obsurd and comparing pro-choicers with any historically evil concept in existant. I think they should compare us to the Huns next, that would be interesting to fight.

[Aloysius]

[quote name='JClives' post='1135300' date='Dec 5 2006, 12:23 AM']
I am amazed How people can overlook that major and obvious difference and still go through with correlating the two. It's utter slander
ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!?!? Are you SERIOUSLY now coorelating a pregnant woman to a slave owner!?!?!

This enitire thread is becoming ABSURD!!

All the women watch out! If you become pregnant you are a slave owner and a Nazi until that kid comes out of you the right way!
[/quote]
your indignation is unsubstantiated with any real arguments... simply calling something absurd means nothing-- show us how it is absurd.

a woman making the choice to kill her child is the same thing as any person in the entire world choosing to kill any other person. sure-- in this case one person is inconveniencing the other, yes. but inconvenience does not justify killing.

if you didn't accept it as a person, then your position would not be as absurdly murderous.

[KnightofChrist]

[quote name='JClives' post='1135300' date='Dec 5 2006, 12:20 AM']
ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!?!? Are you SERIOUSLY now coorelating a pregnant woman to a slave owner!?!?!

This enitire thread is becoming ABSURD!!
[/quote]

Ah, but the way you would wish us to view the mother child relationship is very close the the Master slave relationship, and Nazi jew relationship.

One person has complete superiority over another, the comparison works.

[pcabibi]

[quote name='Aloysius' post='1135301' date='Dec 5 2006, 12:24 AM']
you admit that the fetus is a human person, and therefore that abortion is the killing of a human person; and of course there is a widespread use of abortion because it is legal. the only difference is that you support the right of a woman to choose for the sake of her future rather than the right of a government to choose for the sake of its future.

mass genocide is mass murder. legalized abortion is legalized mass murder, unless you don't think the fetus is a person-- in that case it wouldn't be mass murder. but because you admit it as a person, then that person must be protected from anyone's choice to kill it. no individual is given the right to choose death for another person for any reason.

I'm sorry, but the holocaust was not even as bad as the mass murder abortion is perpetrating.
[/quote]

Bro... the holocaust was a synchronized event done in collaboration with a substantiated idealogy that unified people under bigotry. Abortion is a multitude of isolated events where each situation is unique to the woman considering it.

i agree... it smells of elderberries...but it's not my kid inside of her... I have no say in what she does, and I shouldn't unless she was my wife.


[quote name='KnightofChrist' post='1135305' date='Dec 5 2006, 12:27 AM']
Ah, but the way you would wish us to view the mother child relationship is very close the the Master slave relationship, and Nazi jew relationship.

One person has complete superiority over another, the comparison works.
[/quote]


THE COMPARISON IS LUDACRIS!!!!

Ya know come to think of it... the Nazi's also had peopel that dressed up in uniforms when they talked to mass amounts of people... OMG the Catholic Church has something similar with Nazi's!

See how rediculous this is?!

Edited December 5, 2006 by JClives

[Farsight one]

[quote name='JClives' post='1135306' date='Dec 4 2006, 11:28 PM']
THE COMPARISON IS LUDACRIS!!!!
[/quote]Just so you know, its ludicrous, otherwise you're talking about the rapper. And the fact that it's ludicrous is their point.

[Aloysius]

I'll give you that: the governers of the nation are not systematically attacking a specific people. thogh Margaret Sanger, founder of planned parenthood, was very clear in her goal of decreasing the black population through abortion... and there are some folks around pushing the abortion agenda in high powerful places who do so with the express purpose of decreasing the poor population... but yes, there is not a systematic effort.

but the result is the same: wide-scale mass murder.

if a mother is afforded this right to choose to kill her child who is a human person by your own admission, why can't the mother have the same right to choose to kill her child who is a human person at any other age?

it is very simple: either the fetus is a person and thus deserves protection from any and all choices by any other human person to end their life; or the fetus is not a person.

[pcabibi]

[quote name='Aloysius' post='1135309' date='Dec 5 2006, 12:31 AM']
I'll give you that: the governers of the nation are not systematically attacking a specific people. thogh Margaret Sanger, founder of planned parenthood, was very clear in her goal of decreasing the black population through abortion... and there are some folks around pushing the abortion agenda in high powerful places who do so with the express purpose of decreasing the poor population... but yes, there is not a systematic effort.

but the result is the same: wide-scale mass murder.

if a mother is afforded this right to choose to kill her child who is a human person by your own admission, why can't the mother have the same right to choose to kill her child who is a human person at any other age?

it is very simple: either the fetus is a person and thus deserves protection from any and all choices by any other human person to end their life; or the fetus is not a person.
[/quote]

ok I'm glad to see we're all not totally illogical here. I do not subscripe to Margaret Sanger's idealogy. Now as far as the person is considered... i believe that definition should be left up to the Woman who is pregnant... not the government. each side has thier own arguement and there is nothing aboslute prooving one side right over the other. Until that happens then that definition should be left to the mother.

Edited December 5, 2006 by JClives